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Sentry Drones
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Agent 5B
Venom and Bullet Corporation
Metropolis Defense
#1 - 2017-06-02 21:57:54 UTC
I was looking at the stats for sentry drones to find out if they had worse or better tracking than large turrets and I was a bit surprised by the results.

Garde 0.028
Bouncer 0.014
Curator 0.02
Warden 0.01

1400mm Howitzer 0.9
1200mm Howitzer 1.125
425 Railgun 1.01
350 Railgun 1.22


This seems a bit odd because I hadn't noticed quite that much difference and I was wondering if CCP had not updated the tracking stats on sentries to the new format ?
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#2 - 2017-06-02 23:17:04 UTC
Agent 5B wrote:
This seems a bit odd because I hadn't noticed quite that much difference and I was wondering if CCP had not updated the tracking stats on sentries to the new format ?

I'm assuming they didn't do any of the drones considering a 200mm ac has 315 tracking and a warrior II has 3.24. also drones still have signature resolution listed as a stat

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Agent 5B
Venom and Bullet Corporation
Metropolis Defense
#3 - 2017-06-03 01:51:49 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:

I'm assuming they didn't do any of the drones considering a 200mm ac has 315 tracking and a warrior II has 3.24. also drones still have signature resolution listed as a stat


So does an autocannon, not sure what that stat has been replaced with
Soel Reit
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2017-06-04 21:56:10 UTC
mmmmmm
just firing at random:
with a factor of "x100"

warrior II (better tracking drone) goes from 3.24 to 324 (200mm ac = 315)


garde 2,8
bouncer 1,4
curator 2,4
warden 1,2

1400mm 0,9
1200mm 1,125
425 rail 1.01
350 rail 1.22


now the values seems more close to their counterparts weapons.
:thonking: Shocked
Agent 5B
Venom and Bullet Corporation
Metropolis Defense
#5 - 2017-06-05 04:03:51 UTC
Soel Reit wrote:
mmmmmm
just firing at random:
with a factor of "x100"

warrior II (better tracking drone) goes from 3.24 to 324 (200mm ac = 315)


garde 2,8
bouncer 1,4
curator 2,4
warden 1,2

1400mm 0,9
1200mm 1,125
425 rail 1.01
350 rail 1.22


now the values seems more close to their counterparts weapons.
:thonking: Shocked


Yep but so is x50
Soel Reit
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2017-06-05 04:21:56 UTC
i mean.... Cool
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#7 - 2017-06-05 08:57:31 UTC
Ugh. I still hate this ******* change.

In the olden days (anything beyond a year ago or so) turrets had signature resolution and tracking as separate stats. The tracking part of the chance to hit formula was given as (angular velocity/tracking)*(signature resolution/signature). Or rearranged, (angular velocity * signature resolution)/(tracking*signature). It worked fine, and then CCP changed how the stats were listed. Yay. Or rather, they changed it but forgot about drones. Double yay.

The *new* formula instead looks like (angular velocity * 40000)/(tracking score * signature), so to translate between systems you have to know that small, medium, and large turrets had signature resolution scores of 40, 125, and 400 respectively. Except that isn't even all you need to know: light drones had a signature resolution of 25 to help them hit while orbiting at optimal, so 40 is irrelevant for drones. Oh well. From there you can pretty easily reverse engineer factors by which to multiply the tracking speed of drones to match the new system, namely:

light: multiply by 1600
medium: multiply by 320
heavy and sentry: multiply by 100

So 100 was the right guess for sentries!

Note that you get some absurdly high tracking for light/medium/heavies for their class. This is correct and has to do with drone orbit mechanics (that is, they'd never hit anything while orbiting at max speed if they didn't have abnormally high tracking). Sentries better approximate guns.
Agent 5B
Venom and Bullet Corporation
Metropolis Defense
#8 - 2017-06-05 09:22:05 UTC
Zhilia Mann wrote:
Ugh. I still hate this ******* change.


light: multiply by 1600
medium: multiply by 320
heavy and sentry: multiply by 100

So 100 was the right guess for sentries!

.


I was looking at the sentries to try to find out whether sentries or the turrets would be more likely to hit something that is in close orbit. If the x100 is correct then the most Sentries are superior tracking and it would perhaps be better for me to fit an omnidirectional tracking computer and have better chance of hitting them than try to hit them with large artillery.


Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#9 - 2017-06-06 22:00:13 UTC
Agent 5B wrote:
Zhilia Mann wrote:
Ugh. I still hate this ******* change.


light: multiply by 1600
medium: multiply by 320
heavy and sentry: multiply by 100

So 100 was the right guess for sentries!

.


I was looking at the sentries to try to find out whether sentries or the turrets would be more likely to hit something that is in close orbit. If the x100 is correct then the most Sentries are superior tracking and it would perhaps be better for me to fit an omnidirectional tracking computer and have better chance of hitting them than try to hit them with large artillery.



Well, all other things being equal, yes. Things, of course, are not equal.

First, sentry drones are actually stationary. Your ship may be slow, but it's mobile and can reduce transveral through piloting. Sentries can't do that.

Second, sentries have a *relatively* high rate of fire. This is an advantage as they might score low-probability hits and get more rolls to do so than, say, artillery.

Really what you want though are lights or mediums. Sentries excel where other large guns do: hitting things on approach before orbit behaviour settles in.
Agent 5B
Venom and Bullet Corporation
Metropolis Defense
#10 - 2017-06-07 04:36:57 UTC
Zhilia Mann wrote:


Really what you want though are lights or mediums. Sentries excel where other large guns do: hitting things on approach before orbit behaviour settles in.


True but not all ships have the drone bay to carry everything and swapping drones consumes time that they could be firing. Also a strategy such as rep your drones works nice on sentries as they stay within range. When boldly going more than 10 jumps from a trade hub you might not have exactly the right thing to deal with what you encounter.
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#11 - 2017-06-07 07:06:30 UTC
Agent 5B wrote:
Zhilia Mann wrote:


Really what you want though are lights or mediums. Sentries excel where other large guns do: hitting things on approach before orbit behaviour settles in.


True but not all ships have the drone bay to carry everything and swapping drones consumes time that they could be firing. Also a strategy such as rep your drones works nice on sentries as they stay within range. When boldly going more than 10 jumps from a trade hub you might not have exactly the right thing to deal with what you encounter.


Shrug. Your call. I'd buy drones in bulk and take them with me like ammo (albeit in smaller quantities). I'd also never use, say, a 100m^3 drone bay on sentries because the mobility you lose to them is just too painful in most cases. I find sentries to be ok if you're already sniping and/or you have a ship purpose built to use them. Otherwise I'd rather have other drones at my disposal.
Muffinmixer
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2017-06-07 12:18:28 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:

also drones still have signature resolution listed as a stat


Everything that can be combat-probed needs to have a sig res and sensor strength.
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#13 - 2017-06-07 14:43:14 UTC
Muffinmixer wrote:
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:

also drones still have signature resolution listed as a stat


Everything that can be combat-probed needs to have a sig res and sensor strength.

that stat would be signature radius Blink

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#14 - 2017-06-08 05:34:18 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
Muffinmixer wrote:
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:

also drones still have signature resolution listed as a stat


Everything that can be combat-probed needs to have a sig res and sensor strength.

that stat would be signature radius Blink


Resolution for guns, radius for targets.

And yeah, I guess issues like this is probably why they made the change. Still hate it.
Agent 5B
Venom and Bullet Corporation
Metropolis Defense
#15 - 2017-06-11 06:58:22 UTC
Zhilia Mann wrote:


Resolution for guns, radius for targets.

And yeah, I guess issues like this is probably why they made the change. Still hate it.



Yeah sig res was a stat that was the optimal size of target for that weapon where as sig radius is the size of the drone/ship/thing

I'm not sure what sig resolution is replaced with , it was a bit like the way explosion radius works for missiles
Agent 5B
Venom and Bullet Corporation
Metropolis Defense
#16 - 2017-06-12 02:51:09 UTC
Zhilia Mann wrote:

I'd also never use, say, a 100m^3 drone bay on sentries because the mobility you lose to them is just too painful in most cases. I find sentries to be ok if you're already sniping and/or you have a ship purpose built to use them. Otherwise I'd rather have other drones at my disposal.


Yes that is true but consider say a Tempest or a Scorpion I was thinking about the possibility to use it with 3 Sentries