These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
123Next pageLast page
 

Idea: Auto logoff after 20-30 minutes of idle time

Author
Kassimila
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1 - 2017-05-28 05:48:02 UTC
This is a pretty standard feature in most online games. I'm not sure why Eve Online hasn't implemented it.

Benefits :
Less Server load.
Less Tidi
Less load on the network pipe.
Accurate Count of people playing the game.

Con:
Afk people have to reconnect to the game.
Piugattuk
Litla Sundlaugin
#2 - 2017-05-28 06:01:07 UTC
Kassimila wrote:
This is a pretty standard feature in most online games. I'm not sure why Eve Online hasn't implemented it.

Benefits :
Less Server load.
Less Tidi
Less load on the network pipe.
Accurate Count of people playing the game.

Con:
Afk people have to reconnect to the game.


Roll here we go again, so tell us YOUR story of why anybody afk bothers you, eve can "handle" the extra load of afk'ers and if people want to pay to be afk that is their choice no?
Kassimila
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#3 - 2017-05-28 06:05:59 UTC
Piugattuk wrote:

Roll here we go again, so tell us YOUR story of why anybody afk bothers you, eve can "handle" the extra load of afk'ers and if people want to pay to be afk that is their choice no?


Well #1: Alpha Toons, aren't paying to be afk. 1000 afk people in local means that every line of chat needs to be replicated 1000 times more than is needed. This creates server load, server load creates lag. Less lag = better fleet engagements. If eve servers could "handle" the load, TIDI wouldn't be a thing.

Now please tell me, why do people have to remain online afk? Why would they need to be on a game they aren't playing?
Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
#4 - 2017-05-28 06:12:30 UTC
We have a trash can for stupid AFK cloaking whines, please use it: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=397030&p=488
Kassimila
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#5 - 2017-05-28 06:14:35 UTC
Merin Ryskin wrote:
We have a trash can for stupid AFK cloaking whines, please use it: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=397030&p=488


Ummm, what? I didn't mention cloaking. I did mention the 1k+ afk's in Jita.
Max Deveron
Deveron Shipyards and Technology
Citizen's Star Republic
#6 - 2017-05-28 06:25:42 UTC
Nope i think you have an ulterior motive for this.....
and it has nothing to do with Jita.

-1
Kassimila
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#7 - 2017-05-28 06:40:23 UTC
Max Deveron wrote:
Nope i think you have an ulterior motive for this.....
and it has nothing to do with Jita.

-1


My only motive sir, is to have lag free 500 person fleet fights. I believe booting afk players is a good step towards that goal. I can't see how people not playing the game are adding any benefit to it. Can you?
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#8 - 2017-05-28 07:05:24 UTC
Kassimila wrote:
Max Deveron wrote:
Nope i think you have an ulterior motive for this.....
and it has nothing to do with Jita.

-1


My only motive sir, is to have lag free 500 person fleet fights. I believe booting afk players is a good step towards that goal. I can't see how people not playing the game are adding any benefit to it. Can you?


It is not. AFK people add next to no load to servers. Also, when is the last time you had a lot of AFK on the same node as a 500+ character fight happened? You do realize Jita is on an independent node which mean the afk there affect no other system at all.
Kassimila
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#9 - 2017-05-28 07:38:23 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Kassimila wrote:
Max Deveron wrote:
Nope i think you have an ulterior motive for this.....
and it has nothing to do with Jita.

-1


My only motive sir, is to have lag free 500 person fleet fights. I believe booting afk players is a good step towards that goal. I can't see how people not playing the game are adding any benefit to it. Can you?


It is not. AFK people add next to no load to servers. Also, when is the last time you had a lot of AFK on the same node as a 500+ character fight happened? You do realize Jita is on an independent node which mean the afk there affect no other system at all.


While yes, Jita is on it's own 'node', your assessment is inorrect I shall explain why. Each system gets 1 or more CPU cores attached to it. When you request a node to be 'reinforced' for example, all they do is shift more cpu cores onto that node. That's not even taking into account things like socket connections, memory, logging. All of these activities take resources from the cluster as a whole to process. Systems that have 0 players in them, get 0 cpus, that's why you get that longer load time when you're the first person to jump into a system in a while. The cluster has to assign a cpu to that system so you can be in it playing.

So lets say out of the 25,000 connected players, 18000 of them are actually playing the game. Disconnecting those 7,000 people will free up a lot of memory and cpu that can be assigned to other active nodes.

So again I ask the question, what exactly is the value of assigning server resources to characters that are not actively playing the game? I shouldn't be getting TIDI in 400 player fights.
Agondray
Avenger Mercenaries
VOID Intergalactic Forces
#10 - 2017-05-28 08:47:00 UTC
ill go with this, I play some other games that's less than 15 mins and your out

"Sarcasm is the Recourse of a weak mind." -Dr. Smith

ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
Infinite Pew
#11 - 2017-05-28 09:05:37 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
Relevant thread from 2013:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4269005#post4269005
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4287956#post4287956

tldr:

- someone wants to have "spammers" / "afk players" kicked out of Jita to open server resources for "active players."

- DEV responds by saying that "afk players" do not consume server resources the same way "active players" do and are pretty much a non-issue because the server will automatically allocate resources accordingly.

- even on dedicated nodes (which are separate from each other), major fleet flights are laggy and suffer TiDi because that is the nature of the beast.
Kicking people out in some nodes will not make other nodes run smoother as they are utilizing resources on different hardware.
Marek Kanenald
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2017-05-28 09:07:56 UTC
I seriously doubt in-station players require much server resources anyway.
Avaelica Kuershin
Paper Cats
#13 - 2017-05-28 10:01:08 UTC
Marek Kanenald wrote:
I seriously doubt in-station players require much server resources anyway.


Exactly. It's not like the server has to calculate where they are in relation to every other player out in space.
JC Mieyli
the united
#14 - 2017-05-28 11:06:43 UTC
there is and afk cloaker thread stickied post it there
mkint
#15 - 2017-05-28 12:30:11 UTC  |  Edited by: mkint
Kassimila wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Kassimila wrote:
Max Deveron wrote:
Nope i think you have an ulterior motive for this.....
and it has nothing to do with Jita.

-1


My only motive sir, is to have lag free 500 person fleet fights. I believe booting afk players is a good step towards that goal. I can't see how people not playing the game are adding any benefit to it. Can you?


It is not. AFK people add next to no load to servers. Also, when is the last time you had a lot of AFK on the same node as a 500+ character fight happened? You do realize Jita is on an independent node which mean the afk there affect no other system at all.


While yes, Jita is on it's own 'node', your assessment is inorrect I shall explain why. Each system gets 1 or more CPU cores attached to it. When you request a node to be 'reinforced' for example, all they do is shift more cpu cores onto that node. That's not even taking into account things like socket connections, memory, logging. All of these activities take resources from the cluster as a whole to process. Systems that have 0 players in them, get 0 cpus, that's why you get that longer load time when you're the first person to jump into a system in a while. The cluster has to assign a cpu to that system so you can be in it playing.

So lets say out of the 25,000 connected players, 18000 of them are actually playing the game. Disconnecting those 7,000 people will free up a lot of memory and cpu that can be assigned to other active nodes.

So again I ask the question, what exactly is the value of assigning server resources to characters that are not actively playing the game? I shouldn't be getting TIDI in 400 player fights.

Not only is that not how the game works, that's very nearly the opposite of how the game works.

A fair analogy would be comparing the server cluster to a city. Over in one corner of the city is where all the afk'ers sitting in station are. Over on the other side of the city is the downtown district where people are active and doing stuff. The people sitting in station have zero effect on the traffic downtown. Even the people sitting in a parking lot downtown (i.e. afk but in space on a loaded node) don't affect actual traffic in any meaningful way because they are not interacting with it. Every effort to fix traffic/lag has been about spreading load to parts with less traffic or better "roads." Likewise, TiDi was the equivalent of installing traffic lights where previously the default state was gridlock. Bulldozing your afk tree fort in the suburbs will not improve traffic downtown.

And that's why people think you have ulterior motives. Because either you understand the system and are full of crap, or you have the opposite of an understanding of the system and yet are still trying to give advice on how to "fix" it.

edit: because your description is so painful to read I feel like I have to correct it. You have it backwards. Multiple systems can be on 1 CPU, but each system can't use more than 1 CPU. No multi threading in this case. Node and CPU often get used interchangeably, so assume they are the same thing. You may be confusing "blade" with "node" but the existence of blades doesn't really matter in this context. The biggest reinforced nodes are Jita and the fleet fight one. They are reinforced because they get better hardware and a full CPU to themselves without sharing. Things like chat and trade and stuff that's not Dogma (the in-space simulation) get put on separate CPUs so they don't cause lag. What systems share which CPUs are decided at downtime and cannot be changed without turning off all the systems that share that CPU, so live migration is not done at all (even though your understanding of it would be the opposite of how it would be done if it were done at all). That's why it's important to notify CCP the day before a big fight so they can map the system to a reinforced node, because doing it live doesn't work. Setting aside Jita afk'ers (which have precisely zero effect on fleet fight lag) even in-space afkers don't add load to a fight. Usually someone afk in space will be off grid from everything interesting since that's the entire point of being afk in space. The only load they'd add is in updating local (almost no load and on a different CPU anyway) and position for d-scan (which only happens if they aren't cloaked and adds almost nothing to the big picture compared to the load of everyone on grid in the overview.) They aren't moving, they aren't running d-scan, they aren't adding anything to any dogma calculations. No additional lag. If kicking afk'ers would help lag, it would have been done years ago. Whatever your ulterior motives for kicking AFKers, you aren't going to convince anybody by pretending it'll help against lag. Try again. Maybe with more honesty.

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.

Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
#16 - 2017-05-28 13:25:37 UTC
Kassimila wrote:
This is a pretty standard feature in most online games. I'm not sure why Eve Online hasn't implemented it.

Benefits :
Less Server load.
Less Tidi
Less load on the network pipe.
Accurate Count of people playing the game.

Con:
Afk people have to reconnect to the game.

Just say no to terrible ideas like this.
Why, well for one I have cyno characters that will sit logged in at safe spots in case they are needed for an emergency jump, it is common for those characters to sit somewhere for an hour or more. Emergency cyno ships are rather useless if you have to go through the hassle and the time needed to log them in first, then wait for the safe warp to bring them back to where they are supposed to be.

For day trippers to a worm hole what happens to the scout ship they have cloaked up and watching structures for signs of player activity, do they get booted simply because they are sitting there not moving for more than 20 minutes?

How about the players that will camp a gate in low or nul, they often sit without moving for long periods of time, do they get booted out of the game because of their play style?

You know folks since Jita has been mentioned here perhaps this is yet another anti-ganking idea.
Piugattuk
Litla Sundlaugin
#17 - 2017-05-28 16:18:29 UTC
Kassimila wrote:
Piugattuk wrote:

Roll here we go again, so tell us YOUR story of why anybody afk bothers you, eve can "handle" the extra load of afk'ers and if people want to pay to be afk that is their choice no?


Well #1: Alpha Toons, aren't paying to be afk. 1000 afk people in local means that every line of chat needs to be replicated 1000 times more than is needed. This creates server load, server load creates lag. Less lag = better fleet engagements. If eve servers could "handle" the load, TIDI wouldn't be a thing.

Now please tell me, why do people have to remain online afk? Why would they need to be on a game they aren't playing?


If your posting about Jita, you do know that those that sit in stations are basically bots right, keystrokes can be simulated, this may be against the EULA in cases but it is up to CCP to boot them.

Don't get me wrong I get what your saying, just understand that there are many GOOD reasons not to do this action, the playstyles that folks do would be effected and gimp many, including boosting ships which can sit for a long time not moving.
Eleonora Crendraven
Global Communications AG
#18 - 2017-05-28 16:50:20 UTC
What about afk-players jusing autopilot? What about miners being afk and mining ore? There are so much players more or less active in this game, maybe some are using EVE as a nice screensaver while doing something else... Blink
And there are pilots hunting down this afk-players. So they are not "useless", for some they are just adding content - and ISk to their own wallet when destroyed. Big smile

https://twitter.com/gcAG_EVE

http://eveboard.com/pilot/Eleonora_Crendraven

≡⋁≡

Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#19 - 2017-05-28 17:55:12 UTC
Paikis wrote:
This thread comes up on almost a weekly basis. In fact, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a nerf cloaking thread in the first 2 pages on this forum section. Almost every single one of them goes like this:

1. OP posts a post with a new (lol) idea that always boils down to some variation of the following:
- "There's a big meanie who is sitting in my system and not doing anything, but I don't know where he is and I can't ever just go next door. I can't find said meanie and even though I know that he's probably at work and poses no threat at all, I wont do anything in my system that I absolutely can't leave ever because he might not be at work and I might lose a ship. CCP please stop the meanie from being able to do nothing to me because he's probably at work"

2. Thread gets trolled because its been done literally to death. This horse has been beaten so hard and so often that it's little more than a memory of a memory of a red smear on the grass, and yet it STILL WONT DIE! In fact it's been done so many times that this particular horse is now undead; even if it does die, it will still be remembered and parodied.

3. Someone comes along and suggests that AFK cloakers can't hurt you, because they are, by their very definition, AFK. No one ever lost a ship to someone who ISN'T PLAYING THE GAME.

4. Someone else comes along and points out that while the cloaker might be AFK, he might not be, and so we have Schrodinger's Hot Dropper. The cyno pilot who might be AFK... but he might not be as well, and you will only know for sure when he decloaks, points and lights his candle. (Yes, I know this isn't how the cat works)

5. Someone else comes along and suggests that you use bait and setup a TARP. Or have a defence fleet on standby. Heaven forbid you have to actually fight to defend your space.

6. A further person comes along and suggests that the problem isn't cloaking AFK in your system that you can't possibly leave ever, but that you KNOW that the person is AFK in your system... and perhaps local should be removed because free 100% accurate intel is probably not the best thing in the game and if you didn't know that the big meanie was in your system, you wouldn't be worried about leaving the undock/POS.

7. Then another person pokes their head in and complains that local is 100% NEEDED because D-Scan and probing are such bad mechanics, and IF YOU TAKE MY LOCAL AWAY IM QUITTING FOREVER AND NO YOU CAN'T HAVE MY STUFF!

8. Someone asks if they can have 7's stuff.

We end up with another thread which goes on for pages and pages between complains about local, defence fleets, inability to just go next door, people who aren't playing the game but are playing the meta, lots of bickering and in the end nothing gets solved. CCP wont remove cloaking because it would mess with waaay too many things and it creates content (which is a good thing) by removing content (which is a bad thing) but they can't really think of any way to do it without a complete overhaul of the local and scanning systems.

Now that I've had this entire thread's conversation, can we just let it die? Please?
Black Pedro
Mine.
#20 - 2017-05-28 18:03:00 UTC
Nah. If AFK logins are consuming a significant amount of server resources then CCP should do something. However, all evidence and common sense suggest that this is not the case since docked or AFK logins aren't doing anything to slow down the cluster. If detailed examination of the logs determines this is a real issue, then I am sure we would all accept such a change. In absence of that though, it appears the OP is just whining about names in local that make them feel unsafe.

So, -1.
123Next pageLast page