EVE General Discussion

It's funny that people who run a valid site are called griefers. Once the mom spawns, anyone is free to engage...

Just because you don't want the mom to die doesn't make people who do griefers.

^^^

Incursions have been awesome for me to get to participate in mostly pick-up fleets and accomplish something. That something may be mindless vanguard farming but hey, I don't think I'm going to join a null alliance soon for mindless 1000 person fleet fights or pos bashing especially since I only log on for a few hours everyday depending on work schedules.

In short, incursions are good and shouldn't be nerfed just because null people are jealous. My 2 cents :)

I have ran all sites and these are my thoughts:

1. Vanguards are too easy - A 10-man gang with almost no tank can go in, finish a site in 4-8 minutes and move to the next one, while payout is far too generous for such a short period of time. Somewhere in the lines of half the current payout or 25-30% higher risk.

2. Vanguards are repetitive - This is no easy feat, however not impossible. Sites are the same all the time, without the element of random. Perhaps not completely at random, but several presets, for different NPC fleet composition, as well as random triggers. This falls into the vanguards being harder.

3. Assaults in general - Assaults are arguably the hardest sites. Nation Commander Networks are completely at random, and require delicate fleet composition and fleet management. But at the same time, Overwhelmed Civilian Facility is too easy, as the trigger is always the same and the amount of NPCs on grid is low. Nation Commander Strongholds are perhaps the most balanced sites, as there are 4 spawns that can be all at once or by groups. Problem is that payout can be inadequate for sites such as the Nation Commander Networks, which require a lot of planning, forming and managing, but pay the same as the other 2 which are noticeably easier and faster. My suggestion would be either increase the risk of all the sites, to the same level.

4. Headquarters are too easy - I mean this one. I've ran a lot of those sites, and they are too easy. Pay is adequate for the amount of NPCs that need to be shot down, however the fact that all sites are virtually the same all the time, can make them a bit tedious and/or repetitive. Sites could introduce random spawns using chance, as a surprise backup, or a second wave before the first is completely destroyed.

5. Headquarters require audio - all fleets do, but large fleets in particular need to rely on audio for commands, yet up to this day, problems are encountered with the ingame audio feature.

6. Tagging is too complicated - tags help identify the primary target, however tagging targets in these situations require too many clicks per target. Some people like it, but it would be nice to have the option to bind keyboard keys to, something like an automatic counter. Example: tag shortcut: SHIFT+T ; just type in SHIFT+T over NPC-battleshipX and automatically designate the first lowest number available in a scale from 0-9, for second target use the shortcut over the target in the overview, and designate the second lowest number available from the same scale. For letters could be used the same, but a second key.

7. Kundalini/Uroborus spawn - it is normally triggered when the influence first reaches 0%, however it sits there until taken down or the incursion withdraws completely. A solution could be that it does not spawn until the incursion starts withdrawing in the first place, or pilots should be required to achieve a certain goal before being capable of engaging against the flagship. If we want to put some story, it could be that the super-carrier spawns, but if engaged before the incursion withdraws, it will warp off and escape, covered by NPC ships.

8. Incursion states - currently there is established, mobilised and withdrawing. However nothing stands out as a difference between the three states of the incursion. It could be, as the names suggest, that once it is established, there are an X amount of beacons for sites to be ran per system in the constellation ; once it starts to mobilise, sites become harder as backup forces arrive to fortify their position and dominance ; lastly once withdrawing, lesser troops and lesser beacons can be found until it finally vanishes. This could play well with the super-carrier warping out if the incursion is not withdrawing first, as backup forces would arrive and rescue their leader (playing with storyline if you wish). A bit like Live Events, in which the super carrier can warp out.

9. Dynamic objectives - something in the lines of once in a site, especially the larger ones, having to disable their forces, or interrupt communications, bring a certain item. Somewhat like missions, but on the run, instead of just killing everything and shooting all the NPCs. Several sites have this already, but perhaps more sites require it.

10. Low-security incursion - same as the high-security requiring some rebalancing, low sec require some buff in reward and difficulty, as it comes with considerably higher risks for pilots. In high-security incursions, one is fairly safe from random encounters, not in low.

11. Faction incursions - why does it only have to be Sansha? Why can't it be the Amarr Empire invading Minmatar space looking to expand, and the loyalty and standings go to the faction with the sovereignty, as one is defending that space, but lose standings with the faction one is facing. Or for example Guristas incursion into Caldari space, or Minmatar into Ammatar space, etc. Most, if not all factions have ships that could fill the same roles as current incursion Sansha ships. Would add some diversity and some extra fun to the mechanics already in place, as well as further involve a pilot with his Empire of choice.

12. Rewards vs. missions - As a general, missions become useless to high-security pilots once they get into running incursions. The difference between the rewards of missions and incursions is far top noticeable, compared to the risk per site missions can be. A level 4 mission can tear down a ship, while paying less than half what one would do with incursions, with a higher level of safety. Incursions should not reward pilots anywhere above than twice what missions can pay under the same circumstances.

In my honest opinion, the mechanics are fine, but some extra features would be nice, to introduce some randomness, some extra risk and less automatisation from the pilots. Hope you take at least some of these into consideration as it could make incursions far more...

This is true. Most incursion runners don't log in the game for too long, so they can get into a fleet, run a while and then log off with a couple of extra ISK in the wallet. Perhaps incursions need a rebalancing and null-sec as well. Tech moons can give incredibly high amounts of ISK as well, with little to no danger once said alliance is fully settled.

On a side note, I wrote too much there, wall of text for the win. \o/

You will still be able to do all of that if incursions are removed from hisec completely.

Okay.. an actual post of me [sttrikethrough]which is not to be taken with a piece of salt..[/strikethrough]

Have it like this...players can jam other players without getting agression and concord attention in incursion sites (or even only in the mothership site).. This could get us in the position to bring more players into the incursion...jam those that want to kill the mothership all day long if needed to.. if they bring more ships, we will too.. and if one of them agresses one of the other group that nonagressionthingy collapses..and everything is to shoot at each others...THAT would be cool.. Concord will come and get rid of the agressors and everything will be status quo...it is decided by one of the fleets..

1. Pro Incursion fcs have to be more cautions WHO they let in their fleet..
2. Contra Incrusion fcs will jsut get raped like they diserve
3 ...
4. profit

CCP, for goodness sakes, DO NOT listen to any of the incursion haters.

CCP, ask directly the leadership of BTL and TDF about what changes are needed, if any.
DO NOT listen to anyone who has taken great glee in destroying Incursion fleets, or destroying the potential income generation of so many.

BTL...TDF!

WTF??

Clearly listening to the elitist heads of the ISK farmers is the right way to go.

I'm sure they have the game's best interest in mind, not their own pockets.