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Intergalactic Summit

 
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Challenging maleficars

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Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient
Electus Matari
#41 - 2017-05-26 21:02:19 UTC
While I am skeptical about CVA's loyalties, I have to point out that being paid for work does not necessarily mean you would take any work for pay. It is possible to be mercenary and loyal.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#42 - 2017-05-26 21:02:36 UTC
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:
Sheeeit, we're at war? Why didn't someone tell me?


Cuz it's just the same old gladiatorial arenas?
Mizhara Del'thul
Kyn'aldrnari
#43 - 2017-05-26 21:04:10 UTC
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:
While I am skeptical about CVA's loyalties, I have to point out that being paid for work does not necessarily mean you would take any work for pay. It is possible to be mercenary and loyal.


Disclaimer: The above message was totally not a paid promotion and the credstick is most certainly not taped under the leftmost table upon entering the Deck.
Mizhara Del'thul
Kyn'aldrnari
#44 - 2017-05-26 21:05:52 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:
Sheeeit, we're at war? Why didn't someone tell me?


Cuz it's just the same old gladiatorial arenas?


FFS stop with the teasing, people.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#45 - 2017-05-26 21:07:03 UTC
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:
Disclaimer: The above message was totally not a paid promotion and the credstick is most certainly not taped under the leftmost table upon entering the Deck.


I know, I looked, dammit!
Gaven Lok'ri
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#46 - 2017-05-26 21:12:12 UTC
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:
Utari, would you say Mercenary Coalition is loyal to the Tribes? I can assure you it's not, even though I can point to myself and some others as such. CVA and Providence is much the same and you know it. That you have sufficient numbers that the exact same loyalist percentage translates into big enough numbers for an 'Operation Deliverance' does not make CVA nor Providence Amarr loyal anymore.



This example is good, but you are using it exactly backwards. CVA's leadership supports Amarr and they are part of the CEWPA war. Yes Providence has members who are not loyal to Amarr, but that doesn't make the whole entity disloyal any more than your presence makes your organization loyal to the Tribes.

Admiral of the Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris

Divine Commodore 24th Imperial Crusade

Holder. Vassal of the Emperor Family
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient
Electus Matari
#47 - 2017-05-26 21:12:52 UTC
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:
Disclaimer: The above message was totally not a paid promotion and the credstick is most certainly not taped under the leftmost table upon entering the Deck.

Wasn't actually talking about you.

MC has plenty going for them, but they are not of the inclination to put off work just because the customer is a slaver.
Mizhara Del'thul
Kyn'aldrnari
#48 - 2017-05-26 21:15:01 UTC
Gav, m'boy, if participation in the pendulum indicates support of Amarr, you have a whole lot of nasty customers falling under the 'loyalist' umbrella. Are you entirely sure that's where you'd want to go with that?

That said, Elsebeth stop ruining my jokes with your southern sensibilities.
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient
Electus Matari
#49 - 2017-05-26 21:17:40 UTC
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:
That said, Elsebeth stop ruining my jokes with your southern sensibilities.

Didn't we already establish that I can't have a sense of humor because it would be totally untrad and ohnesh?
Erika Wallker
Titan Legion
Fraternity.
#50 - 2017-05-26 21:18:10 UTC
Gaven Lok'ri wrote:
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:
Utari, would you say Mercenary Coalition is loyal to the Tribes? I can assure you it's not, even though I can point to myself and some others as such. CVA and Providence is much the same and you know it. That you have sufficient numbers that the exact same loyalist percentage translates into big enough numbers for an 'Operation Deliverance' does not make CVA nor Providence Amarr loyal anymore.



This example is good, but you are using it exactly backwards. CVA's leadership supports Amarr and they are part of the CEWPA war. Yes Providence has members who are not loyal to Amarr, but that doesn't make the whole entity disloyal any more than your presence makes your organization loyal to the Tribes.


I agree with this 100%. There are two issues being discussed in this thread.

The first is the loyalty of Provibloc (CVA is only a part of Provibloc). If you measure loyalty by faith, than the accusations are probably partly correct. Faith in Providence is sorely lacking right now due to lack of guidance. However, if loyalty is the willingness to assist its allies and fight alongside the empire in times of need then Providence is very much loyal to the empire. Many of our pilot support the fight against the Minmatar and CVA (this time CVA only) joined the war effort for the reason of supporting its allies (not for the money).

The second part of the thread are the accusations of one man against CVA/Provibloc. I do believe Arrendis said it best:
Arrendis wrote:
Vaari wrote:

Your KOS admin, the Xhjfx the Abomination pretty much played his strongest card in existence against me by making me permanent kos to Providence, I see little ways to resolve the issue.

What he failed to see was overwhelming support of my cause as a loyalist who struggles against disloyalty.


See, now that reads like a whole heap of 'CVA can't be loyal to Amarr because they don't like meeeeeee!!' And that's just a load of crap. I don't believe for a moment that they are loyal in more than just a nominal 'uh-huh, sure, whatever' way, but it's pretty clear your case against CVA being loyal is entirely based on the legal principle of 'ow! my butt!'


I believe these is nothing more to say on the matter.

Pentag Blade!
Vaari
Imperial Pharmacy
#51 - 2017-05-26 21:26:31 UTC
Gaven Lok'ri wrote:
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:
Utari, would you say Mercenary Coalition is loyal to the Tribes? I can assure you it's not, even though I can point to myself and some others as such. CVA and Providence is much the same and you know it. That you have sufficient numbers that the exact same loyalist percentage translates into big enough numbers for an 'Operation Deliverance' does not make CVA nor Providence Amarr loyal anymore.



This example is good, but you are using it exactly backwards. CVA's leadership supports Amarr and they are part of the CEWPA war. Yes Providence has members who are not loyal to Amarr, but that doesn't make the whole entity disloyal any more than your presence makes your organization loyal to the Tribes.


Providence is indeed mixture of loyalists and money makers. With great respect to my good and close friend Daedalus, currently CVA does not belongs to the loyalists.

Fear the God and honor the Empress!

-House Valius battle shout.
Claudia Osyn
Non-Hostile Target
Wild Geese.
#52 - 2017-05-26 21:40:09 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:
Disclaimer: The above message was totally not a paid promotion and the credstick is most certainly not taped under the leftmost table upon entering the Deck.


I know, I looked, dammit!

Was wondering who left that there. Well, I dropped it off at the lost items counter if you're looking for it...

A little trust goes a long way. The less you use, the further you'll go.
Gaven Lok'ri
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#53 - 2017-05-26 21:54:25 UTC
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:
Gav, m'boy, if participation in the pendulum indicates support of Amarr, you have a whole lot of nasty customers falling under the 'loyalist' umbrella. Are you entirely sure that's where you'd want to go with that?


When combined with CVA leadership's open support of Amarr, it makes a compelling case. They also joined the militia despite it having some notable negative consequences for some of their members.

That makes them somewhat different from the Blooders, pirates, and venal mercenaries that also fly under the 24IC but would never qualify as loyal.

Admiral of the Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris

Divine Commodore 24th Imperial Crusade

Holder. Vassal of the Emperor Family
Mizhara Del'thul
Kyn'aldrnari
#54 - 2017-05-26 22:05:59 UTC
Pretty sure some of the 'Blooders, pirates and venal mercenaries' also proclaim open support of Amarr. Lip service and pendulum activity does not a loyalist entity make, as far as I'm concerned.

... it should be a concern that I apparently have higher standards for Imperial loyalists than you do.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#55 - 2017-05-26 22:14:36 UTC
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:
... it should be a concern that I apparently have higher standards for Imperial loyalists than you do.


To be fair, you have generally high standards. It's not a bad thing, mind, but it does set you up to be disappointed in people.
Mizhara Del'thul
Kyn'aldrnari
#56 - 2017-05-26 22:22:25 UTC
Now now, if I start holding people to lesser standards than I hold myself, I'd have to start acknowledging just how vastly superior I am to other people. We can't have that kind of narcissism and megalomania, now can we?
Arrendis
TK Corp
#57 - 2017-05-26 22:30:40 UTC
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:
Now now, if I start holding people to lesser standards than I hold myself, I'd have to start acknowledging just how vastly superior I am to other people. We can't have that kind of narcissism and megalomania, now can we?


I dunno, it's kinda hot.
Mizhara Del'thul
Kyn'aldrnari
#58 - 2017-05-26 22:34:17 UTC
That is basically proof that you need to get that head of yours checked, if random cataclysmic sleep poetry wasn't enough.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#59 - 2017-05-26 22:36:03 UTC
I should dig that stuff outta my comms logs and publish it.
Gaven Lok'ri
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#60 - 2017-05-26 23:40:55 UTC
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:
Now now, if I start holding people to lesser standards than I hold myself, I'd have to start acknowledging just how vastly superior I am to other people. We can't have that kind of narcissism and megalomania, now can we?


Things are not binary. Some loyalists are more loyal than others.

Admiral of the Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris

Divine Commodore 24th Imperial Crusade

Holder. Vassal of the Emperor Family