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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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Starlifter Tech I and Starlifter Vanguard Tech II Transport Ship

Author
Cade Windstalker
#61 - 2017-02-17 19:52:03 UTC
Danika Princip wrote:
You can't jettison a depot, I just tried.

You also can't launch or jettison an unassembled ship from your cargo bay (or fleet hanger, since I tried punting a rifter out of my dst). Nor can you toss out an assembled one from either bay, unless the buttons to do this kind of thing are hidden somewhere other than the right click menu.


Huh, I stand corrected then.

Either I'm thinking of what happens to ships in cargo when the ship carrying them explodes, or at some point CCP removed the ability to eject unassembled ships into space and I didn't notice.

In either case I retract the previous statements.
Ronnie Rose
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#62 - 2017-02-17 23:09:59 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Daichi Yamato wrote:
It can emergency warp out of bubbles but cannot be targeted before it warps AND cannot be smartbombed because it can drop out of warp the moment it detects a smart bomber on d-scan?

It's insanely hard to counter. Like luxury yacht hard which is a silly ship with about 30m3 cargo. You want 25k? I don't think it needs to carry pods. Jump clone bays kinda do that.


If the whole point is to get a small fleet behind enemy lines, use blops and covert ships like T3's, bombers and recons. Or blops and blockade runners if you're trying to get supplies through heavily camped areas.


A whole 4 destroyer fleet assuming there is ever a way to assemble the damn thing in space. That's her proposition because that way, it's not a bowhead with all those feature. Just a mini bowhead with all those feature.


Okay, that's a fair description.

We're not here to change the game, we're here to change YOUR game

Ronnie Rose
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#63 - 2017-02-17 23:38:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Ronnie Rose
So folks, ideas and concepts are just that. I just started this one, that's all, and if it starts out bad it doesn't mean its dead. If it has some merit and even a teenie weenie aspect of good or interest in it, then the discussions, the proposals the counter proposals is what makes the idea and concept evolve. It also makes "my" concept yours.

I thought of this concept out of a problem I perceive with EVE's playability for many new and even older players and that is gate camps. It is restrictive, and it stagnates the game. Insta locks around the gates do not do this game justice, so I thought, perhaps one just one ship that could defeat this might fix the problem.

I bet if interceptors were not in the game today and the idea of interceptors was started here, it would also be met with opposition opinion; the idea of a ship immune to warp bubbles and scram...give this person a pony and a rainbow with sprinkles! But they are in the game, they did not break the game, and they managed to pass the scrutiny and now serve a purpose.

Furthermore, what's good for the goose is good for the gander, in which I mean if this ship is seen as a threat to alliance controlled space then what is stopping the threatened to use it as a weapon as well? I would see it as an arms race as alliances try to figure out the docrtinal uses for this , and that in itself would add to the interest in the game.

I don't know if Starlifters is the answer to the gate camp problem, and maybe there could be one without introducing a whole new ship needing to extensively retool the existing code.

But anyway, I do appreciate the feedback and replies.

Thanks Big smile

We're not here to change the game, we're here to change YOUR game

Ronnie Rose
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#64 - 2017-02-17 23:54:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Ronnie Rose
Dark Lord Trump wrote:
So it can move 4 people in small ships. No one is going to use this, except as a super blockade runner since there's literally no way to catch it barring egregious pilot stupidity.


I'm thinking that is actually half true. People would use it, a lot, I think. I've thought of ferrying an alt in a Starlifter with a miner, or even just myself leaving the starlifter and getting into the miner to mine. It would serve like a mini base camp, where I'd book mark the starlifter and then warp off in my miner to a near by belt (I'd lose the ship if I forgot to book mark it because it can't be scanned down! Wouldn't that be funny?)

Of course while mining I could be scanned downed, but if I could get back to my ship in time to pack up and leave...that right there adds an element to cat and mouse.

We're not here to change the game, we're here to change YOUR game

Ronnie Rose
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#65 - 2017-02-18 00:04:50 UTC
Oh and one more thing. I think the one very interesting aspect I propose about this ship is being overlooked and that is Warp Drops. Here's a description of that feature I wrote in my paper.

Starlifter Vanguard Pilots only need to perform a warp drop by loading items into the Load and Deploy cargo bay. The pilot then right-clicks on a destination such as a gate, planet, a bookmark or a fleet member with the choice “Warp Drop” made available and selects it. The ship engages warp and will automatically drop the cargo in route as it passes by the destined warp drop. Note, the Vanguard will only fly by destined warp drops, so gates and stations selected as such will only be flown pass them (e.g. no jumping into the gate or station docking is performed)

While docked in a station, a passenger pilot fleeted with a Starlifter pilot that boards the Starlifter will see the Starlifter spaceship appear in their hangar view. Access to the Starlifter cargo hold is available through the normal holographic ship display available from the “enter Captain’s Quarters”. Clicking the Ship’s Fitting button will only bring up the capsule pod’s fitting display for that passenger pilot, but clicking on the cargo hold in the pod’s fitting window will display the Starlifter’s cargo hold. Once onboard, passenger pilots can see all cargo items in the Starlifter’s cargo hold window.

In space passenger pilots will see the Starlifter’s interior of its cargo bay. Alternately they can press an assigned function key to view the Starlifter from the outside. The Starlifter pilot only sees the ship from the outside.

In a warp drop, both passenger and the pilot will see a status indicator that will flash red or steady green as the Starlifter approaches its drop point. The indicator flashes red with an audible warning as the Starlifter approaches the drop point showing a distance countdown inside it. Once the countdown hits zero, the status indicator turns steady green, sounds an audible and in a near instant all cargo in the Load and Deploy bay is dropped at the

destination. Passenger pilots will see the familiar transition screen of the gate jump take place for a warp drop at their arrived destination. Starlifter pilots will see a trail of white star like flares leave the space ship in rapid succession from behind it. Observations at the drop point will see the dropped items warp into the drop point followed by the audible warp popping sound as the items and passenger pilots drop from warp. The Starlifter spaceship looks like a beautiful, space faring version of the C-17 Globemaster III.

We're not here to change the game, we're here to change YOUR game

Ronnie Rose
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#66 - 2017-03-20 00:15:03 UTC
Well, its now plain to me. Freighter hauling in this game is officially dead. People will be doing less and less of it because ganking has become so efficient.

No way for the hauler to fend an attack off.

CCP needs to do something or trade will drop off.

We're not here to change the game, we're here to change YOUR game

Dark Lord Trump
Infinite Point
Pandemic Horde
#67 - 2017-03-20 01:13:50 UTC
Ronnie Rose wrote:
Well, its now plain to me. Freighter hauling in this game is officially dead. People will be doing less and less of it because ganking has become so efficient.

No way for the hauler to fend an attack off.

CCP needs to do something or trade will drop off.

There are plenty of ways to fend off an attack. Freighters just choose not to use them.
Also, explain why Red Frog and the like haven't closed their doors. (Hint: It's because they're not bads)

I'm going to build a big wall that will keep the Gallente out, and they're going to pay for it!

ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#68 - 2017-03-20 01:19:45 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
Yeah... people said that hauling and trade and industry would be killed off YEARS ago due to ganking, wars, etc etc.

The monthly economic reports that CCP posts every few months shows that trade, hauling, industry and mining are continuing to increase at a steady pace.



Gankers may be efficient at killing things, but professional haulers are no slouches either.
Traders and haukers have been getting ever more efficient using... ironically enough... many of the same tools, tricks, and tactics that gankers use.

My take on your idea?
I think you are viewing the "problem" through the prism of "a solo player should be able to get around the efforts of organized groups of players without assistance."


That mentality doesn't exactly work in a multiplayer game like this as anything you do to negate the efforts of multiple players so that the situation favors a solo player can be turned on its head (see: organizations of players will use those mechanics to make themselves functionally immune to other organizations of players).

It also puts a bad taste in the mouth of players that do organize.
Why put the effort into organizing and becoming efficient when the game will simply be changed to negate that power increase?
Bjorn Tyrson
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#69 - 2017-03-20 02:21:58 UTC
Posting in ninja "gate camps are op plznerf" thread number 279835
Ajem Hinken
WarFear Gaming
#70 - 2017-03-20 14:25:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Ajem Hinken
I like the idea - perhaps have a Hull Hold - an area specially designed to contain pods and ships (unpackaged). However, the fact it can drop out of warp anywhere and that they are unable to be scanned down - that's scary. It should be scan-able, but to counteract this, it should be able to use covert ops cloaks as well. Just don't let it dump things while cloaked... heck no.

I like the ability to warp in a straight line - in fact, it should be an option for all ships (to kill bumping and encourage being there to intercept the hauler, instead of delaying the hauler until they could destroy it). Instantaneous? Nah, I'd say it needs no instantaneous thing - instead, it just warps like normal in a straight line, and if it gets nudged, that line is moved, but the ship's warp isn't reset.

I'd say this SHOULDN'T become a hauler-type thing, more a 'bus'. To prevent it from being used as a hauler via insertion of industrials into its hold, it should impose a hold penalty on all ships inside it - say a flat 50%. You won't be able to sit inside the ship with a more than 50% full hold - it won't let you - perhaps say, "Your ship has too much in its cargo hold to be stored." Blame it on special compression that allows it to stay nimble when a bunch of people are inside it with their ships. In addition, the pilot won't be able to move ships around or access the ships' cargo holds - only the owner of the docked ship, which could only access their ship, similar to how stations are.

People should also have full control of their ship and be able to use any module fitted on it that do not require a target lock on anything that isn't the ship they're in or the other ships inside. (So yes, that guy you put in your ship? He's now filling your insides with bulletholes. Enjoy.) This would allow remote repping inside the ship as well as repping the ship itself. (A shameless plug, but if you combined this with my 'ship mounted explosives' suggestion, you could be carrying ships - that were hidden bombs - inside one. Sneaky sneaky death trap!)

I feel like this'd add enough risk while making it enough of a pain in the butt to abuse to make it decently reasonable.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=6875494#post6875494 - Ship mounted explosives. Because explosions and Jita chaos.

Ajem Hinken
WarFear Gaming
#71 - 2017-03-20 14:32:29 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
Yeah... people said that hauling and trade and industry would be killed off YEARS ago due to ganking, wars, etc etc.

The monthly economic reports that CCP posts every few months shows that trade, hauling, industry and mining are continuing to increase at a steady pace.



Gankers may be efficient at killing things, but professional haulers are no slouches either.
Traders and haukers have been getting ever more efficient using... ironically enough... many of the same tools, tricks, and tactics that gankers use.

My take on your idea?
I think you are viewing the "problem" through the prism of "a solo player should be able to get around the efforts of organized groups of players without assistance."


That mentality doesn't exactly work in a multiplayer game like this as anything you do to negate the efforts of multiple players so that the situation favors a solo player can be turned on its head (see: organizations of players will use those mechanics to make themselves functionally immune to other organizations of players).

It also puts a bad taste in the mouth of players that do organize.
Why put the effort into organizing and becoming efficient when the game will simply be changed to negate that power increase?

There's a difference from a power increase and power creep - power creep is stuff getting more viable over time, power increase is a deadon power spike.

Over all, the idea'd need some changes, but the concept is valid - having a ship for transporting people and ships.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=6875494#post6875494 - Ship mounted explosives. Because explosions and Jita chaos.

Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#72 - 2017-03-20 15:31:36 UTC
Ronnie Rose wrote:
So folks, ideas and concepts are just that. I just started this one, that's all, and if it starts out bad it doesn't mean its dead. If it has some merit and even a teenie weenie aspect of good or interest in it, then the discussions, the proposals the counter proposals is what makes the idea and concept evolve. It also makes "my" concept yours.

I thought of this concept out of a problem I perceive with EVE's playability for many new and even older players and that is gate camps. It is restrictive, and it stagnates the game. Insta locks around the gates do not do this game justice, so I thought, perhaps one just one ship that could defeat this might fix the problem.

I bet if interceptors were not in the game today and the idea of interceptors was started here, it would also be met with opposition opinion; the idea of a ship immune to warp bubbles and scram...give this person a pony and a rainbow with sprinkles! But they are in the game, they did not break the game, and they managed to pass the scrutiny and now serve a purpose.

Furthermore, what's good for the goose is good for the gander, in which I mean if this ship is seen as a threat to alliance controlled space then what is stopping the threatened to use it as a weapon as well? I would see it as an arms race as alliances try to figure out the docrtinal uses for this , and that in itself would add to the interest in the game.

I don't know if Starlifters is the answer to the gate camp problem, and maybe there could be one without introducing a whole new ship needing to extensively retool the existing code.

But anyway, I do appreciate the feedback and replies.

Thanks Big smile


The only way to kill your idea ship is of the pilot is asleep or a well timed AoE atttack except we don't even know what the tank is on that thing so it might require a damn fleet of smartbombing BS or even a Titan Boson/lance/reaper and pray you timed/aimed it well.