EVE General Discussion

You never made it, hence you never lost it.

Again, you are applying the concept of opportunity cost retrospectively and backwards, whereas it is part of the assessment process in making a choice between opportunities beforehand, not after.

I specifically answered these already in the very post you quoted.

1) In an extended chain, from sourcing internally to manufacturing internally, if the materials are sourced without cost, that is carried forward in the margins. If I give you a stack of minerals, your margins increase according to the value of the materials I gave you.

2) Nobody has stated those minerals do not have value, only that acquiring them does not incur cost, if done yourself.
The minerals have market value, but they cost NOTHING to you, if sourced yourself, rather than purchasing them at market value.

3) I specifically said in a previous post, that if you attempt manufacture of a product of which the market value is below that of its constituent minerals, you are taking a net loss. That is just stupid, unless in extremis and you really need a product otherwise unavailable.

4) You are confusing the cost of acquiring something, with its market value. They are not directly congruous.
If Im walking along a stream, and glimpse a gold nugget, and pick it up, that nugget has real market value, but my cost of acquiring it, was zero. It was free for me, but is not free to the market into which I introduce it.

Free to me, but not to you.

You only "lost" it compared to another choice that you did not make, and which hence never became real.

This speaks to the fact what the concept of opportunity cost is, as part of the assessment process BEFORE making a choice.

Not retrospectively, as you apply it. Its a tool, a calculation, of cost, not an actual cost, despite its name.

The irony here, is that I have been accused of unduly focusing on the "cost" part of opportunity cost, whereas its you that does so, as the "cost" of an opportunity you chose NOT to pursue.

If you chose the course of using 100mil in value to manufacture a product worth 90m, that is your own stupid choice.
You then clearly failed the opportunity cost analysis beforehand, in that you choose that.

Of course.

I addressed this earlier.

If the material value exceeds the value of the end product, it would be folly to produce that, unless you intend to sell it later if you expect the market to adjust favorably.

But when someone mines their own materials, they are free.
That does not mean the materials do not have value.
It means they are free in that their acquisition incurred no cost.

The TAX.

It doesn't matter if you have 10 mil and spend it on materials or mine 10 mil worth of materials because those materials (value of them), not matter how acquired, will go into manufacturing job.

1) Tax is a good point.

You will always incur additional costs, beyond the value of the minerals you mine yourself, when you acquire them from the market, due to fees.

This further confirms that minerals acquired yourself are not only free, but also cheaper than those bought from the market, as they incur no fees.

2) Manufacturing process dont care about the cost of a material. Manufacturing process only care that you input sufficient quantities of the required materials.Its up to you how you make that profitable.

3) The value of materials is market based. The value of manufactured products is also market based. Both are also interlinked and in flux between supply/demand of both.

4) The value of materials and products is in constant flux on the market..
But if you source your materials yourself, you are inured against that, because you already own them.
You can leverage your stockpiled, self-earned, FREE materials, without cost, when the market suits you.
Whilst others scramble to fulfill their own requirements subject to the whims of the market.

It is you that is misunderstanding me.

I have repeatedly said that the minerals have value (on the market), but that their cost of acquisition if done yourself is zero, ergo:free.

You are confusing the cost of acquiring the mineral, with its value.
They are not the same, if you mine them yourself.
If you mine them yourself, it costs you nothing, and you own them.
If you buy them off the market inorder to own them, it costs you isk+fees and it may not be at the best possible moment.

When you source your own minerals, you are not subject to the whims of the market.
When you buy your minerals off the market, you have to do so subject to whatever the current price is.

If you have stockpiled your own minerals, you can produce those into products that are currently hot, even if the constituent mineral price is far below that. Sure, you can do that with bought minerals too, but you paid isk for those at the price at the time, whereas if you mined them yourself, you didnt pay a single isk for them.

When you have mined your own minerals, you face zero fiscal risk. Everything you do with either the minerals, or products manufactured from them, is pure profit. Sure, you might have made more producing something else, or selling the minerals at another time, but they cost you nothing in the first place.

If, however, you instead buy your minerals off the market, you have invested and expended your own isk, and now are in a hole inorder to either re-sell those minerals for equity/profit, or manufacture them further for equity/profit. The price you originally bought those minerals at, spent isk on, becomes the most important determinant on whether you can or cannot make a profit off them at any given time.

Free of tax and free of cost.

No, it is not. If the time and resources spent to acquire the ore were actually without value, there would not be the slightest reason for the ore to have any market value at all. If it actually was free, everyone could just grab all the ore they want. Nobody would ever need to buy ore, because they could just get it for free.

But they can't get it for free, which is why they are willing to pay money for it.

Just imagine the following situation: In front of your local grocery store there's a stand where they hand out samples of a new soda pop for free. Next to that stand there's a guy who takes those samples and tries to sell them for a dollar each. Do you think he will sell any? He won't. Because they are actually free, and there's no reason to pay money for them.