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Sick and tired of shield miners

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Amojin
Doomheim
#1 - 2017-02-13 21:02:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Amojin
After a discussion on a local in game channel, a few mentioned that CCP may spy more here, than in game, and I should make a thread.

Fine. I'd like to see some armor based mining ships. The ones we currently have, in complete and total contradiction to every other roie in the game, are shield based, ONLY.

It's also amusing that they're using Gallente Starship Engineering as a skill to make them. We're not shield, but armor. Why not fix these to be like every other role in the game, that we characters that armor tank, can do that, and barring that, why not get rid of this lie?

Require Caldari starship engineering, not Gallente?
2Sonas1Cup
#2 - 2017-02-13 21:14:46 UTC
I too would love to fit a doomsday on my interceptor, sick and tired of doomsday only titans.
Ayx Shewma
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2017-02-13 21:18:35 UTC
Amojin wrote:
We're not shield, but armor.


i shield tank 80% of my gallente ships.
Amojin
Doomheim
#4 - 2017-02-13 21:24:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Amojin
Ayx Shewma wrote:
Amojin wrote:
We're not shield, but armor.


i shield tank 80% of my gallente ships.



And you do so, stupidly, don't you?

If a ship has a base of 1000 Shield, and 1600 Armor, and the slot difference is really vast, you can make it work.

But that's not really true, anymore. The days of the shield Ishtar are gone, for you min-max meta-gamers. I always armor tanked my Ishtar. It's Gallente. It has a high base armor... I didn't try to min-max.

But, CCP changed the slot layout. How many of you meta-gamers are left? Running an Ishtar, now? I'll bet it's armor tanked.

Same thing with these mining boats. They need a rebalance. It seems the last thing left where I have to pretend I'm Caldari.
Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
EDENCOM DEFENSIVE INITIATIVE
#5 - 2017-02-13 21:25:57 UTC
Neuntausend
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2017-02-13 21:26:11 UTC
A retriever can be hulltanked about as well as it can be shield tanked, and Gallente ships are by no means armor only, if you take a look at shield tanking Ishtars or hull tanking Dominixes for example. The Ninazu even has a remote shield boosting bonus.

Shield tanking just makes a lot more sense for mining boats. Tank aside, what goes into a med slot? Cap modules, tracking modules, propulsion modules and electronic warfare. What goes into low slots? Fitting modules and damage/yield modules for the most part. Now, Mining ships being intended for non-combat roles typically don't need tracking modules, or electronic warfare. They also don't benefit much from propulsion modules in most cases, and if they are skilled/fit properly, they don't require cap- and fitting-modules either. So, that leaves yield modules. And where do those go? They go into lowslots. And if you cram your low slots full of armor modules, then you won't have much left for tank.

If CCP were to introduce armor-bonused mining barges, most people would still just cram the low slots full of yield modules, because greed is good. And after all, the purpose of a barge is to mine lots of ore, so in a way this fitting philosophy makes sense. Armor modules and yield modules are simply in conflict with each other, which is why shield tanking a mining ship makes perfect sense.
Amojin
Doomheim
#7 - 2017-02-13 21:27:50 UTC
Nana Skalski wrote:
You dont have to put tank on your mining ships. They will mine just fine without any defence modules.



Never heard of CODE, have you?

Wow... No, no they won't do just fine without tanks...
Amojin
Doomheim
#8 - 2017-02-13 21:29:13 UTC
Neuntausend wrote:
A retriever can be hulltanked about as well as it can be shield tanked, and Gallente ships are by no means armor only, if you take a look at shield tanking Ishtars or hull tanking Dominixes for example. The Ninazu even has a remote shield boosting bonus.

Shield tanking just makes a lot more sense for mining boats. Tank aside, what goes into a med slot? Cap modules, tracking modules, propulsion modules and electronic warfare. What goes into low slots? Fitting modules and damage/yield modules for the most part. Now, Mining ships being intended for non-combat roles typically don't need tracking modules, or electronic warfare. They also don't benefit much from propulsion modules in most cases, and if they are skilled/fit properly, they don't require cap- and fitting-modules either. So, that leaves yield modules. And where do those go? They go into lowslots. And if you cram your low slots full of armor modules, then you won't have much left for tank.

If CCP were to introduce armor-bonused mining barges, most people would still just cram the low slots full of yield modules, because greed is good. And after all, the purpose of a barge is to mine lots of ore, so in a way this fitting philosophy makes sense. Armor modules and yield modules are simply in conflict with each other, which is why shield tanking a mining ship makes perfect sense.



Already talked about that. Shield tanked Ishtar is a joke, now. They rebalanced a lot of slot layouts to make you stop being an asshat and play your race. The Ishtar one, included. You're not gonna shield tank an Ishtar and get away it, today.
Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
EDENCOM DEFENSIVE INITIATIVE
#9 - 2017-02-13 21:33:20 UTC
Amojin wrote:
Nana Skalski wrote:
You dont have to put tank on your mining ships. They will mine just fine without any defence modules.



Never heard of CODE, have you?

Wow... No, no they won't do just fine without tanks...

Yes, I heard about CODE and they dont use much tank either.

ᴇᴠᴇʀʏ ᴘᴀʀᴛ ᴏғ ᴀ ɢᴀᴍᴇ ʜᴇʟᴘs ᴛᴏ ᴛᴇʟʟ ᴀ sᴛᴏʀʏ 📕

ᴡʜᴇʀᴇ ɪs ᴀɴɢʀʏ ᴄᴏɴᴄᴏʀᴅ ɢᴜʏ ᴡʜᴇɴ ʏᴏᴜ ɴᴇᴇᴅ ʜɪᴍ

ᴏsᴘʀᴇʏ 🚀

≡⋁≡ ♥
Ayx Shewma
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2017-02-13 21:35:01 UTC
Amojin wrote:
Ayx Shewma wrote:
Amojin wrote:
We're not shield, but armor.


i shield tank 80% of my gallente ships.



The days of the shield Ishtar are gone,


well, at least we've confirmed that you have no idea what you're talking about. well done.
Amojin
Doomheim
#11 - 2017-02-13 21:37:54 UTC
Nana Skalski wrote:
Amojin wrote:
Nana Skalski wrote:
You dont have to put tank on your mining ships. They will mine just fine without any defence modules.



Never heard of CODE, have you?

Wow... No, no they won't do just fine without tanks...

Yes, I heard about CODE and they dont use much tank either.


*sigh*

That's nice. I wouldn't, either. A suicide run is a cheap affair. 6 of them for one skiff is about right. But if I had a mining ship that would let me field an armor tank, instead of a shield tank, I'd be able to take 8-10 of them before concorde wipes them out.


I'm sitting in a ship that I built, with gallente starship engineering. That uses shields. By design. This is the only role in the game, where I build a ship, with that skill, with anything gallente in the name, and you get a SHIELD tank.

I HATE shields. I'm offended that they don't just call it Caldari, and even if they did, I would wonder where is the balance?

Every other role is tank-balanced. Anything else from missioning, to exploration, to logi, has both options of tank.
Amojin
Doomheim
#12 - 2017-02-13 21:39:14 UTC
Ayx Shewma wrote:
Amojin wrote:
Ayx Shewma wrote:
Amojin wrote:
We're not shield, but armor.


i shield tank 80% of my gallente ships.



The days of the shield Ishtar are gone,


well, at least we've confirmed that you have no idea what you're talking about. well done.



You're welcome. Have fun with that expensive waste. An Ishtar, with a shield tank, in today's game, is less than it should be, or could be.
Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
EDENCOM DEFENSIVE INITIATIVE
#13 - 2017-02-13 21:46:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Nana Skalski
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#14 - 2017-02-13 21:50:09 UTC
So you want more low slot for additional mining laser upgrades?
Amojin
Doomheim
#15 - 2017-02-13 21:52:11 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
So you want more low slot for additional mining laser upgrades?


If you do that, you take your tank and make it a Hulk, don't you? Did you notice how they split up the advantages of drone upgrades , both high and low slots?

This is not repeatable?
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#16 - 2017-02-13 21:54:24 UTC
Take it up with ORE.

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
000Hunter000
Missiles 'R' Us
#17 - 2017-02-13 21:55:32 UTC
Amojin wrote:
Nana Skalski wrote:
You dont have to put tank on your mining ships. They will mine just fine without any defence modules.



Never heard of CODE, have you?

Wow... No, no they won't do just fine without tanks...



I just LOLed really hard!

Somehow i got the idea it was meant to be sarcastic in nature. Lol
Neuntausend
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#18 - 2017-02-13 21:56:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Neuntausend
Amojin wrote:
That's nice. I wouldn't, either. A suicide run is a cheap affair. 6 of them for one skiff is about right. But if I had a mining ship that would let me field an armor tank, instead of a shield tank, I'd be able to take 8-10 of them before concorde wipes them out.

No you wouldn't. Unless that armor tank was stronger than your shield tank, which it should not be. I suppose this stealth-"nerf ganking" thread has been unmasked.


Amojin wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
So you want more low slot for additional mining laser upgrades?


If you do that, you take your tank and make it a Hulk, don't you? Did you notice how they split up the advantages of drone upgrades , both high and low slots?

This is not repeatable?

They just unified the weapon systems: range/tracking mods in the meds and damage in the lows. Do you have problems tracking your roids then?
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#19 - 2017-02-13 21:57:13 UTC
Amojin wrote:
Ayx Shewma wrote:
Amojin wrote:
We're not shield, but armor.


i shield tank 80% of my gallente ships.



And you do so, stupidly, don't you?

If a ship has a base of 1000 Shield, and 1600 Armor, and the slot difference is really vast, you can make it work.

But that's not really true, anymore. The days of the shield Ishtar are gone, for you min-max meta-gamers. I always armor tanked my Ishtar. It's Gallente. It has a high base armor... I didn't try to min-max.

But, CCP changed the slot layout. How many of you meta-gamers are left? Running an Ishtar, now? I'll bet it's armor tanked.

Same thing with these mining boats. They need a rebalance. It seems the last thing left where I have to pretend I'm Caldari.


Oh you sweet summer child
Amojin
Doomheim
#20 - 2017-02-13 22:00:11 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Amojin wrote:
Ayx Shewma wrote:
Amojin wrote:
We're not shield, but armor.


i shield tank 80% of my gallente ships.



And you do so, stupidly, don't you?

If a ship has a base of 1000 Shield, and 1600 Armor, and the slot difference is really vast, you can make it work.

But that's not really true, anymore. The days of the shield Ishtar are gone, for you min-max meta-gamers. I always armor tanked my Ishtar. It's Gallente. It has a high base armor... I didn't try to min-max.

But, CCP changed the slot layout. How many of you meta-gamers are left? Running an Ishtar, now? I'll bet it's armor tanked.

Same thing with these mining boats. They need a rebalance. It seems the last thing left where I have to pretend I'm Caldari.


Oh you sweet summer child


I am so overwhelmed with the information you have. The logic you presented is so overwhelming as to be regarded with my utmost resp...

Oh, wait, you didn't have anything...
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