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Delaying local in eve in NS/LS
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In Xile
Literally The Worst Community
#1 - 2017-02-06 09:40:08 UTC  |  Edited by: In Xile
The idea is here:

Delaying the local in NS/LS by 15 up to 30 seconds to make it less safer and avoid safety carebear ratters systems.
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2017-02-06 09:59:30 UTC
Just remove it, the instant paranoia of no local is...refreshing...
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#3 - 2017-02-06 10:11:13 UTC
You don't have to live in Stain, you can always find a wormhole group. If you don't let me carebear here in null, I cannot shoot anyone in the face anymore.

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

Aura sound-clips: Aura forever
In Xile
Literally The Worst Community
#4 - 2017-02-06 10:35:01 UTC
I live in stain cause i love this region, but please it's not just about stain it's about all Eve, Eve is a pvp game even if some peoples can't accept it, it is and it will be for ever.

So this delay will really impact the pvp cause farmer won't be able to be safe is their locked systems, and It will be diffcult to farm without a good intel and some decent scout who mess around.

A delay of just 15 to 30 seconds can do it and it would be more fun cause more pressure in NS and LS, more skill and then more adrenaline, never afk always on the laptop :p
Lugh Crow-Slave
#5 - 2017-02-06 10:42:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
lol


"Remove local it will add pvp"

sure it will maybe increase the number of ratters and miners you kill but it will drastically lower good fights. I can't tell you how many fights we got because we were able to see the name of some one or a group we knew would be up for it.


Elita is correct there is an area of space you can play in if you do not want local. Eve is great that way it gives you many rule sets to play in. we don't need to make all areas the same


that said i would like to see sov null require a structure to gain local with a deploy-able to block it. a good way for that would be if you put it within 30km of a mobile scan inhib it stopped working

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
In Xile
Literally The Worst Community
#6 - 2017-02-06 10:46:29 UTC
Quote:
lol


"Remove local it will add pvp"

sure it will maybe increase the number of ratters and miners you kill but it will drastically lower good fights. I can't tell you how many fights we got because we were able to see the name of some one or a group we knew would be up for it.


Elita is correct there is an area of space you can play in if you do not want local. Eve is great that way it gives you many rule sets to play in. we don't need to make all areas the same


that said i would like to see sov null require a structure to gain local with a deploy-able to block it. a good way for that would be if you put it within 30km of a mobile scan inhib it stopped working


It's not about removing the local, it is about delaying it just a bit (as i said some seconds) to allow some fast opération of tackle.

On Dscan to find someone in 15-30 seconds you must be good then the men see you and you are spotted. And this only for NS and/or LS
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#7 - 2017-02-06 10:54:56 UTC
Considering how devoid of PVP W-space is with their lack of local, I do not quite follow your argument. No local or delay has no positive impact on PVP and quite the contrary happens: Less regular PVP and just random ganks.

Local in NS/LS, on the other hand, allows for timely preparation of traps and fights all the time, as well as to see whether there is someone in system in the first place and whether you can continue on to the next system or want to stick around. I do not see how hindering that provides more actual PVP. Furthermore, I do not see how that impacts NPC null sec and low sec at all. Finding someone there means combat probing is essential because people run missions, therefore local delay has far less impact on their activities.

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#8 - 2017-02-06 10:58:48 UTC
In Xile wrote:

On Dscan to find someone in 15-30 seconds you must be good then the men see you and you are spotted. And this only for NS and/or LS



we have been able to catch people in low/null in under 15s


just takes knowing what you are doing. Jump in D-scan is instantly updated see ship names "what would be the most likely place for x to be" warp there boom.


i'm sorry you are having such trouble padding your KB with ratters but this is not the answer

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Lugh Crow-Slave
#9 - 2017-02-06 10:59:56 UTC
Rivr Luzade wrote:
Considering how devoid of PVP W-space is with their lack of local, I do not quite follow your argument. No local or delay has no positive impact on PVP and quite the contrary happens: Less regular PVP and just random ganks.



as some one who spent most of their eve time living in WH i beg to differ. while finding fights is done differently their is no shortage

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
In Xile
Literally The Worst Community
#10 - 2017-02-06 11:11:36 UTC
I've no trouble with ratters, and my kb is a kb of explorer in Heron who make money and test some fit, do not use a kb like that to up your arguments


Lugh Crow when a system have more than 20 anomalies of PVE, good luck to find the men before he warp out and if he have intel you can't even see him in Dscan cause he docked, so this place isn't to trash talk but to give our opinion about the subject.

It's not a question of skill, it's about to give more risk when you rat in NS, i don't like hunting them, i just like when the attackers have a decent chance to rekt the defensor, don't tell me atm it's true cause all know with bubble in pipe, with intel, local intel, Cloaky scout, you are spotted at 10 systems around

And about the delaying, if the ratters look his dscan it's like a local, he see you directly and he can warp out
That's the same for you


Quote:
that said i would like to see sov null require a structure to gain local with a deploy-able to block it. a good way for that would be if you put it within 30km of a mobile scan inhib it stopped working


You trash me about delaying while you give the same ideas in others way.
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#11 - 2017-02-06 11:34:07 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Rivr Luzade wrote:
Considering how devoid of PVP W-space is with their lack of local, I do not quite follow your argument. No local or delay has no positive impact on PVP and quite the contrary happens: Less regular PVP and just random ganks.



as some one who spent most of their eve time living in WH i beg to differ. while finding fights is done differently their is no shortage

Considering that some W-space regions have over a week's worth of kills on page 1 on zKill, while even deserted low sec regions like Aridia or very quiet null sec regions like Outer Passage have not even one full day on page 1, W-space is devoid of PVP in comparison.

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#12 - 2017-02-06 12:30:33 UTC
Rivr Luzade wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Rivr Luzade wrote:
Considering how devoid of PVP W-space is with their lack of local, I do not quite follow your argument. No local or delay has no positive impact on PVP and quite the contrary happens: Less regular PVP and just random ganks.



as some one who spent most of their eve time living in WH i beg to differ. while finding fights is done differently their is no shortage

Considering that some W-space regions have over a week's worth of kills on page 1 on zKill, while even deserted low sec regions like Aridia or very quiet null sec regions like Outer Passage have not even one full day on page 1, W-space is devoid of PVP in comparison.




...

.....

........


wut?

if you were locked down to one region or system this would make scene but you're not. like i said finding fights is different.

not only that but the lack of individual areas being low on kills is not do to there being no local but rather do to there being far fewer people

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Lugh Crow-Slave
#13 - 2017-02-06 12:38:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
In Xile wrote:
I've no trouble with ratters, and my kb is a kb of explorer in Heron who make money and test some fit, do not use a kb like that to up your arguments


Lugh Crow when a system have more than 20 anomalies of PVE, good luck to find the men before he warp out and if he have intel you can't even see him in Dscan cause he docked, so this place isn't to trash talk but to give our opinion about the subject.

It's not a question of skill, it's about to give more risk when you rat in NS, i don't like hunting them, i just like when the attackers have a decent chance to rekt the defensor, don't tell me atm it's true cause all know with bubble in pipe, with intel, local intel, Cloaky scout, you are spotted at 10 systems around



i love how cloakies are both at the same time OP AF and impossable to use depening on who you ask

and considering how often they die there is plenty of risk.
Quote:

And about the delaying, if the ratters look his dscan it's like a local, he see you directly and he can warp out
That's the same for you


ooooh you just don't know how eve works this makes more seance

tell me do you know how fast you can cover 14.3 AU? not to mention one of the main Issues in WH is with cloaks you can land on some one and they will have 0 idea until they are scrammed and should we talk about the ships that do not show up on D?
Quote:

Quote:
that said i would like to see sov null require a structure to gain local with a deploy-able to block it. a good way for that would be if you put it within 30km of a mobile scan inhib it stopped working


You trash me about delaying while you give the same ideas in others way.



no yeah removing local but allowing player intervention to bring it back and adding in mechanics that would become content generators. is exactly the same as your idea to make it easier to get back at those mean mean ratters

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Wolfgang Jannesen
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2017-02-06 13:41:59 UTC
There is nothing wrong with how local works for gathering Intel, if you want to be out in null you've got to just fly safer, not have CCP protect you from the big bad tank machine.
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#15 - 2017-02-06 13:50:32 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:

wut?

if you were locked down to one region or system this would make scene but you're not. like i said finding fights is different.

not only that but the lack of individual areas being low on kills is not do to there being no local but rather do to there being far fewer people

And there being fewer people is because, in large parts, of no local. This circumstance alone is too much to handle for most people, which in turn reduces the population and keeps content and PVP low.

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
Wolfgang Jannesen
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#16 - 2017-02-06 13:58:57 UTC
Rivr Luzade wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:

wut?

if you were locked down to one region or system this would make scene but you're not. like i said finding fights is different.

not only that but the lack of individual areas being low on kills is not do to there being no local but rather do to there being far fewer people

And there being fewer people is because, in large parts, of no local. This circumstance alone is too much to handle for most people, which in turn reduces the population and keeps content and PVP low.


PvP happens all the time in wormeholes and nullsec. You're expecting it to be 'I just went throu 5 jumps of a war zone' instead of the reality, which is the biggest tracts of space with the least amount of stuff in it. Yeah, locals going to be empty in a lot of systems.

The conclusions you're drawing from that are weaker than wet paper mate, and local chat isn't the tool that's going to make or break pvp for you, but it will always be an important information tool for scouts and fleet commanders.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#17 - 2017-02-06 14:06:37 UTC
Rivr Luzade wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:

wut?

if you were locked down to one region or system this would make scene but you're not. like i said finding fights is different.

not only that but the lack of individual areas being low on kills is not do to there being no local but rather do to there being far fewer people

And there being fewer people is because, in large parts, of no local. This circumstance alone is too much to handle for most people, which in turn reduces the population and keeps content and PVP low.




Have you ever tried to live in wh? The population is low because it's hard to live their. Logistics and navigating are not as simple as k-space. You need to learn entire new skill sets and get familiar with using differant tools both in game and out. You seem to be taking rather great leaps in logic with no real reasoning

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#18 - 2017-02-06 15:09:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Rivr Luzade
Wolfgang Jannesen wrote:
PvP happens all the time in wormeholes and nullsec. You're expecting it to be 'I just went throu 5 jumps of a war zone' instead of the reality, which is the biggest tracts of space with the least amount of stuff in it. Yeah, locals going to be empty in a lot of systems.

The conclusions you're drawing from that are weaker than wet paper mate, and local chat isn't the tool that's going to make or break pvp for you, but it will always be an important information tool for scouts and fleet commanders.

I don't expect it to be that way. I only draw conclusions from objective killboard data about kills per day.

Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Have you ever tried to live in wh? The population is low because it's hard to live their. Logistics and navigating are not as simple as k-space. You need to learn entire new skill sets and get familiar with using differant tools both in game and out. You seem to be taking rather great leaps in logic with no real reasoning

Yep, new and different skill sets and tools, which is, as I said, too much to ask for from most people. And the lack of local and required constant dscaning is part of that "new skills and toosls", as I said. I am not taking any big leaps and my reasoning is simple.

Having said that, something like this will come soon enough anyways in order to justify the then mandatory intel structures in null sec. I guess it will end up being something like your local delay suggestion and the structure reduces it to immediate for the people living there and disadvantaging people flying through. Purely speculative, though.

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
Cade Windstalker
#19 - 2017-02-06 15:11:37 UTC
As much as I'm in favor of a general intel rework it needs to be just that, a rework, not a bandaid fix and not a hatchet job that pushes things too far one way or the other.

That means new tools on both sides and making it possible for people to achieve a certain level of perceived safety. If you just take a hatchet to Null Sec safety people will stop taking risks and the whole ecosystem suffers. What we should be looking for is something that offers more chances to make mistakes on both sides but also the chance for great benefit, rather than a simple one-sided and fairly obvious buff.
Old Pervert
Perkone
Caldari State
#20 - 2017-02-06 16:59:53 UTC
As it sounds, it feels like it would provide advantage to a roaming fleet. The ratter is in local long enough to show up, but the pirates aren't for 15-30 seconds.

If that's what you meant, that is dumb.

Now.. if local doesn't work for the roaming fleet either for 15-30 seconds, then I'd totally say good. If both are blind, then it's fair. As much as Eve is not a fair game, it has to be a level playing field for people to fight unfairly.

But I have to imagine that as a roaming fleet, dropping probes every system so that you could scan for ratters before they see you would get suuuuper annoying. I'd honestly rather just see it the way it is, because then we know when there are potential targets in system. If they're paying attention, doing things right, they don't deserve to lose their ship.

Then you'd have to worry about +1s in cepters.. they are usually at least 5-10 seconds ahead of the fleet anyways, so in a 15 second case, you've only got 5 seconds to get your roaming fleet into warp and land on the target before you show up in local anyways.

Take away local, they'll just start spamming d-scan like they do in w-space.
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