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Ask me about "The CSM" Q&A

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Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#21 - 2012-01-20 03:57:52 UTC
Xorv wrote:

Liang Nuren wrote:

And then your response to the issue makes literally no sense. You want to somehow make it so that if you plex against Sanshas in Sansha space you won't be able to dock in Sansha stations - and then you don't even address the idea of the sov 0.0 holders attempting to negatively affect the rules of NPC space.


Actually it makes lots of sense. Since it means most of the holders of sov space in that region will have bad standing to the Pirates and not be able to utilize those stations and services, likewise any large player entity that hasn't uniformally set out to ally with those NPC pirates will have a good percentage of players that can't use the stations and services. This means that the NPC stations are less likely to be used by large player entities fighting wars for control of sovereignty, which is a good thing. On the other hand it will become a good home for those that act like pirates and attack players farming their NPC allies, and for those that run missions for the Pirates. The cost of which is having to leave the local RATS alone, although it might not be a bad idea to add new Concord DED and exploration sites to NPC Nullsec to give a little more PVE opportunities for those that don't want to ruin their standings with the Local Pirates.

...and yeah it makes absolutely no sense that you kill thousands of a Faction's ships/crew and then be merrily welcomed into the same factions stations to use every service but jump clone creation... yeah it's RP, but EVE last time I checked is an RPG.


It is a major inconsistency in the game, but that inconsistency would require a massive rewrite of all NPC space and would have extremely far reaching implications even into Empire space. Furthermore, the very way in which PVE in Eve is geared would mean that by the time people even figure out that NPC 0.0 exists they've probably blown their chance at ever docking in such a station. Are you really advocating having NPC 0.0 be only inhabitable by people that custom made alts for the purpose?

And ultimately, the entire discussion sidesteps the point I'm trying to make here - a point about what was in the minutes.

-Liang

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.
Seleene
Body Count Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
#22 - 2012-01-20 06:56:37 UTC
ANGAL 2000 wrote:
Seleene thanks for sorting a thread, i'de like to ask for your opinion on veterans/loyalty program.


I'm all for it in theory. Was there something in particular you were curious about tho?


ANGAL 2000 wrote:
but i will also like to say that a lot of older players with the 150mil plus sp toons are getting sick of the high price of clones.

My moan about it i have spent years building it up and over the years getting a load of kills but its come a time its not worth risking the pod when i can park him and use a sub toon.


I just did a re-scan of the minutes and there is this bit which got one line but was actually discussed a bit more later on:

Quote:
The discussion turned towards clone costs, which were widely agreed to be too high for high SP characters, which discourages high SP players from going on random suicide Rifter roams.


I actually used the, "My clone costs more than a mile long warship." argument and I don't recall anyone disagreeing that clone costs should come down.

2004-2008: Mercenary Coalition Boss

2007-2010: CCP Game Designer | 2011-2013: CSM6 Delegate & CSM7 Chairman

2011-2015: Pandemic Legionnaire

2015- : Mercenary Coalition Boss

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Seleene
Body Count Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
#23 - 2012-01-20 07:24:49 UTC
Liang Nuren wrote:
Seleene wrote:

I'm not quite sure why you're mad but you seem pretty mad. I'm not saying anything new, really. This stuff has been in the wind for years, m8. Lo-sec 'Viceroys' dealing with the major Empires, etc... Much of what you say doesn't make a lot of sense because you are talking about 'taking space" but you don't want people to actually TAKE any THING... just the space itself. As for the way that the space was 'designed for', I was one of the designers and I've got a pretty good idea that the reason things are the way they are currently have nothing to do with intent and everything to do with lack of resources. That is finally changing. It seems as if you just want the game to stay the same forever. I don't subscribe to that. Agree to disagree I guess. v0v Smile


Dear CCP Abathur / Seleene,

Please do not bullshit the audience about you being one of the designers behind NPC 0.0. I was shooting you and your brosefs - and even your own Nyx - long before you left Mercenary Coalition to work for CCP and there was already quite some amount of NPC 0.0 in game. Furthermore, please see the above post by Jack Dant for further explanation for what I am objecting to. He put my objections rather eloquently.

The core of my objection is that the reason the CSM even discussed the ability to incap/destroy NPC station services is because certain alliances were able to "raid" Sov 0.0 from NPC space. Thus, the Sov 0.0 members of the CSM demanded a way to "protect their space" in a way that is familiar and comfortable to them - by throwing 200 supercaps for 5 minutes every few days at the problem.

The entire approach demanded by the Sov 0.0 alliances flies directly in the face of the already existing game dynamic that exists in NPC space. NPC space is different than sov space and these differences encourage different kinds of residents and different forms of combat. "Ownership" of the system is much more about full time occupation of that system - and frankly if the sov 0.0 alliances want to fight NPC space alliances in their "home space" then they should have to adjust to the different rules of engagement - just as they would if they were trying to take Wormholes. (Oh wait, they demanded changes to make that easier for them too....)

Additionally, the ability for either party to raid along the border of Sov 0.0 / NPC 0.0 is a good thing for the game and provides unique attributes to the space on both sides - unique attributes that the current CSM is diligently working to remove and destroy.

And then your response to the issue makes literally no sense. You want to somehow make it so that if you plex against Sanshas in Sansha space you won't be able to dock in Sansha stations - and then you don't even address the idea of the sov 0.0 holders attempting to negatively affect the rules of NPC space.

Basically - NPC space is different than Sov space - and that's good for the game. All this talk about giving sov 0.0 alliances "remedies" with which they can attack the station services for NPC stations? Total bullshit.

-Liang


I'm pretty ******* frustrated right now as I just spent 30 mins writing a reply to this and didn't back it up before the forums ******* ate it during a 'preview'. Apologies, I will try again later. XXXSad

2004-2008: Mercenary Coalition Boss

2007-2010: CCP Game Designer | 2011-2013: CSM6 Delegate & CSM7 Chairman

2011-2015: Pandemic Legionnaire

2015- : Mercenary Coalition Boss

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Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#24 - 2012-01-20 07:30:19 UTC
Seleene wrote:

I'm pretty ******* frustrated right now as I just spent 30 mins writing a reply to this and didn't back it up before the forums ******* ate it during a 'preview'. Apologies, I will try again later. XXXSad


Damn dude, my condolences. That's frustrating as hell - but maybe if it frustrates you as a CSM member you can get it fixed. >:-D

-Liang

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#25 - 2012-01-20 07:51:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Nicolo da'Vicenza
I'd just like to take this chance to strongly repeat my opinion that any plan to introduce destructible stations should come part in parcel with a larger POS structure overhaul/streamlining. Including intermediary structures between those of POSs and stations. Otherwise the continuing centralization of supercap resources is going to go part in parcel with the polarization of all 0.0 into those who choose to join a supercoalition because they're the only ones with stations and those who live in antiquated, poorly-functioning POSs in the vast empty stretches in between.
Seleene
Body Count Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
#26 - 2012-01-20 07:58:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Seleene
Okay trying this again. I banged this out while my old post was still fresh in my head but I'm afraid I'll still forget a few bits. argh...

Liang Nuren wrote:
Dear CCP Abathur / Seleene,

Please do not bullshit the audience about you being one of the designers behind NPC 0.0. I was shooting you and your brosefs - and even your own Nyx - long before you left Mercenary Coalition to work for CCP and there was already quite some amount of NPC 0.0 in game.


First of all, I never claimed to have designed NPC 0.0, just that I had a very good understanding of where CCP wanted to take it but couldn't due to a a lack of resources over the years. Also, if you have known me that long, then you should know I'm not out to 'bullshit' anyone. I don't have a 0.0 null sec agenda. I just go with what feels right to me based off of playing and working on the game for a very long time. No one in PL or anywhere else is pulling my strings as they don't have the leverage.

I have no problem with anyone tearing into us for the minutes - that's what they are there for. However, bear in mind that they represent only a piece of the whole. The CSM is still in daily contact with CCP and nothing that is in those minutes represents the last time an issue is brought up or, as I've noted elsewhere, do the minutes represent a 100% account of what each individual member advocates. I can only state my opinions and explain my own actions; I'm not an apologist or defender of all CSM members. They are free to start their own threads if they wish. Moving right along...

Liang Nuren wrote:
Furthermore, please see the above post by Jack Dant for further explanation for what I am objecting to. He put my objections rather eloquently.


Yep, I'll hit that up next.

Liang Nuren wrote:
The core of my objection is that the reason the CSM even discussed the ability to incap/destroy NPC station services is because certain alliances were able to "raid" Sov 0.0 from NPC space. Thus, the Sov 0.0 members of the CSM demanded a way to "protect their space" in a way that is familiar and comfortable to them - by throwing 200 supercaps for 5 minutes every few days at the problem.


That may be what some want, but even then you have guys like Mittens that want to nuke all supercaps dead forever so.... I mean, the picture you're painting isn't even close to what I'd want to see. It's too boring and ZOMG MORE DUMBASS STRUCTURE GRINDING.

Liang Nuren wrote:
"Ownership" of the system is much more about full time occupation of that system - and frankly if the sov 0.0 alliances want to fight NPC space alliances in their "home space" then they should have to adjust to the different rules of engagement


I agree with this. It shouldn't be just about who can put 200 supers (or 800 Maelstroms) in space for a few hours.

Liang Nuren wrote:
And then your response to the issue makes literally no sense. You want to somehow make it so that if you plex against Sanshas in Sansha space you won't be able to dock in Sansha stations


Correct! I think it is beyond idiotic that you can obliterate a faction's ships by the thousands and then be greeted warmly by that faction in their stations. It was noted elsewhere in this thread that EVE is, in fact, an RPG. There are some elements of RP in it that should not be swept aside just for the sake of convenience. This is one of them. The kicker is that it would not be that drastic of a change to day to day life to alter things along these lines:

"Hey, space bro using our station - there are some bad guys around that are really upsetting us. Can you please work with our local patrols and laser them to death? Yeah, that'd be great, space bro."

So now you are blasting Angel Cartel raiders (or whatever) and actually assisting the Sansha. This would probably affect your ability to do business in Curse but what do you care? You've got a sweetheart deal here in Stain, etc... EVE is a game all about choices, from your skill training to what corp you are in, what you buy and sell on the market. Everything you do in EVE has some sense of 'finality'; you make a choice and you live with it. I believe that the same element of game play should be applied to the NPC factions as well.

Maybe this concept is too deep for some, but it's at the very core of what I would like to see - new opportunities, better options, more interesting game play. Yes, it could open the door to a big null sec alliance cutting a deal with an NPC faction but, if balanced and implemented properly, it could just as easily give long time NPC resident groups a real advantage.

So, no, I'm not really keen on "200 supers nuking NPC station services" as something that is just thrown in for the next expansion. I'd much rather see a more robust and thought out mechanic applied that could potentially benefit multiple play styles.

Does this help? (Cripes, the post I lost was much better but oh well...) Smile

EDIT - Yeah, the preview function seems to be broken as hell ATM. Be careful!

2004-2008: Mercenary Coalition Boss

2007-2010: CCP Game Designer | 2011-2013: CSM6 Delegate & CSM7 Chairman

2011-2015: Pandemic Legionnaire

2015- : Mercenary Coalition Boss

Follow Seleene on Twitter!
Seleene
Body Count Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
#27 - 2012-01-20 08:03:38 UTC
Liang Nuren wrote:
It is a major inconsistency in the game, but that inconsistency would require a massive rewrite of all NPC space and would have extremely far reaching implications even into Empire space.


GOOD. That's what is needed. It's sat there being the same boring **** for over eight years. It's a prime area to add some much needed interactive content.

Liang Nuren wrote:
Furthermore, the very way in which PVE in Eve is geared would mean that by the time people even figure out that NPC 0.0 exists they've probably blown their chance at ever docking in such a station


I'm pretty sure than were such changes to take place there would be systems in place to help newbies understand them. Well, reasonably sure. Cool

2004-2008: Mercenary Coalition Boss

2007-2010: CCP Game Designer | 2011-2013: CSM6 Delegate & CSM7 Chairman

2011-2015: Pandemic Legionnaire

2015- : Mercenary Coalition Boss

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Seleene
Body Count Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
#28 - 2012-01-20 08:13:27 UTC
Deen Wispa wrote:
Seleene- What is your or any CSM member's stance on CCP turning FW into "nullsec-light" or whatever word people want to toss around nowadays. The comments below from the minutes have created a very visceral response in the FW community;

Quote:
CCP would like to inject some of the drama that surrounds the CSM election system into FW, by having some sort of in-game election of militia leaders/admirals. This would help move some of the 0.0 style politics/revenge/spying into FW. Another important addition to this system would be some real power/consequences for system ownership, such as the elected leaders being able to set things like tax rates in lowsec stations that they control (and having some of this tax ISK flow to the faction). The leadership would be able to set strategic goals as well as adjust settings for the new FW benefits.


Quote:
Some CSMs suggested that FW could be used as a testbed for new capture mechanics, since FW would be smaller scale than nullsec.


This sort of ties into responses I've been giving previously - any proper iteration on FW is going to require a fundamental re-work of how players interact with NPC factions. This is one of the reasons I am banging on this particular drum so hard - it's not all about NPC stations in 0.0, it's also something that could heavily affect and improve how FW works.

I don't really think FW needs 'elections' but I do think that having some sort of a formal and very simple command structure, similar in duties to like what an 'Alliance Executor' performs, wouldn't be a bad thing. Players already "elect" fleet commanders to manage their ships in battle; putting a dude in charge of administrative stuff seems like a logical next step. What in this are people are upset about, exactly? I'll try to pour water on what I can and fan the flames of other stuff if needed.

As for the 'testbed' comment, that's just part of what the minutes are - a record of stuff said. I do think that FW and null-sec should have some commonalities with regard to capture mechanics but I don't really see any 'testing' going on in a practical way. v0v

2004-2008: Mercenary Coalition Boss

2007-2010: CCP Game Designer | 2011-2013: CSM6 Delegate & CSM7 Chairman

2011-2015: Pandemic Legionnaire

2015- : Mercenary Coalition Boss

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Seleene
Body Count Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
#29 - 2012-01-20 08:19:30 UTC
Jack Dant wrote:
Seleene wrote:
As for the way that the space was 'designed for', I was one of the designers and I've got a pretty good idea that the reason things are the way they are currently have nothing to do with intent and everything to do with lack of resources. That is finally changing. It seems as if you just want the game to stay the same forever. I don't subscribe to that. Agree to disagree I guess. v0v Smile

Two years ago, Greyscale wrote in a devblog, about the sov system you were working on:

CCP Greyscale wrote:
It needs to handle systems changing hands, of course, but it can afford to be descriptive, rather than prescriptive. Currently we have a prescriptive sovereignty system: you fight over sovereignty explicitly, with the sovereignty mechanics determining who owns the system. A descriptive system says who's in charge, so it only needs to change hands after the dust has settled and one side has emerged triumphant.


NPC has the ultimate descriptive system. You own a system by keeping enough active people in it, that hostiles cannot use it for anything productive. If you fail at that, and the hostiles are the ones camping you in station, you have lost control over the system. That works.

If a sov alliance can control or negate an NPC station by doing a flyby with 30 supers every day or two, I'd say that's bad for the game. If they can do the same through some sort of "NPC negotiation" and then deny me access without any sort of PVP recourse, it's even worse.

So what exactly are you advocating?


Did I answer your question a bit better in my last few responses? If not, I'll keep replying as time permits. Smile

2004-2008: Mercenary Coalition Boss

2007-2010: CCP Game Designer | 2011-2013: CSM6 Delegate & CSM7 Chairman

2011-2015: Pandemic Legionnaire

2015- : Mercenary Coalition Boss

Follow Seleene on Twitter!
Seleene
Body Count Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
#30 - 2012-01-20 08:23:45 UTC
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:
I'd just like to take this chance to strongly repeat my opinion that any plan to introduce destructible stations should come part in parcel with a larger POS structure overhaul/streamlining. Including intermediary structures between those of POSs and stations.


I don't agree that the two need to be linked because:

1.) I think that there are very workable mechanics and solutions for destroying stations now.

2.) A POS overhaul is something that CCP has finally said they seriously want to do but it's a year-long project at best due to everything from Art resources to a lot of very painstaking balancing work.

I think that the introduction of more things like the Customs Office would be great tho. That's an awesome thing that we need to see more of.

2004-2008: Mercenary Coalition Boss

2007-2010: CCP Game Designer | 2011-2013: CSM6 Delegate & CSM7 Chairman

2011-2015: Pandemic Legionnaire

2015- : Mercenary Coalition Boss

Follow Seleene on Twitter!
Seleene
Body Count Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
#31 - 2012-01-20 08:35:13 UTC
cpu939 wrote:
Seleene, i hope you will push for the micro plex system i already see a few advantages to it if put in as stated in the minutes

if done by 30 small plexes 1 day each if you have an unexpected bill you can add a few days to your account if before pay day or use some for nex store items (not sure why anyone would want them) and sell the rest



We were told that it can be done. Now I want to make sure it gets done. #death2arurum

Xorv wrote:
Oh and while you're being open about your positions, what's your position on Local Chat Intel? CCP brought up changing it again, but from the minutes it looks like the CSM spoke out against any changes.


I know it's an unpopular position with some, but I'd really like to see local chat be tied into Alliance Intel Tools somehow. I actually think there should be more information available to a sovereign entity than just looking at a number in local.

"Hey, Joe, how many Tempests just jumped through your stargate?"

Stuff like that. This sort of thing has been bounced around for going on two years now and I would really like to see CCP try to develop it somewhat. Bear in mind, myself and Greyscale literally stood on desks to keep local chat blank and mysterious in WH space so I fully appreciate the angle proponents for changing it are coming from. However, in normal space, without the development of other options to use for your intel, I'd leave it alone for now. I want it to change, but just flipping a global switch to 'delayed' or whatever isn't the answer IMO.

2004-2008: Mercenary Coalition Boss

2007-2010: CCP Game Designer | 2011-2013: CSM6 Delegate & CSM7 Chairman

2011-2015: Pandemic Legionnaire

2015- : Mercenary Coalition Boss

Follow Seleene on Twitter!
Geoscape
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#32 - 2012-01-20 09:53:00 UTC
Seleene wrote:
ANGAL 2000 wrote:

ANGAL 2000 wrote:
but i will also like to say that a lot of older players with the 150mil plus sp toons are getting sick of the high price of clones.

My moan about it i have spent years building it up and over the years getting a load of kills but its come a time its not worth risking the pod when i can park him and use a sub toon.


I just did a re-scan of the minutes and there is this bit which got one line but was actually discussed a bit more later on:

[quote]The discussion turned towards clone costs, which were widely agreed to be too high for high SP characters, which discourages high SP players from going on random suicide Rifter roams.


I actually used the, "My clone costs more than a mile long warship." argument and I don't recall anyone disagreeing that clone costs should come down.


Why not get rid of SP clones entirely?
Kenpachi Viktor
Perkone
Caldari State
#33 - 2012-01-20 10:16:53 UTC
Geoscape wrote:
Seleene wrote:
ANGAL 2000 wrote:

ANGAL 2000 wrote:
but i will also like to say that a lot of older players with the 150mil plus sp toons are getting sick of the high price of clones.

My moan about it i have spent years building it up and over the years getting a load of kills but its come a time its not worth risking the pod when i can park him and use a sub toon.


I just did a re-scan of the minutes and there is this bit which got one line but was actually discussed a bit more later on:

[quote]The discussion turned towards clone costs, which were widely agreed to be too high for high SP characters, which discourages high SP players from going on random suicide Rifter roams.


I actually used the, "My clone costs more than a mile long warship." argument and I don't recall anyone disagreeing that clone costs should come down.


Why not get rid of SP clones entirely?


there needs to be some cost with getting podded other than losing your implants

A war that would’ve involved 20,000 players, 75% of nullsec space, and hundreds of supercapitals was halted not by diplomacy, but by a game mechanic so dreadful that those who have experienced it previously have no desire to do so again. - Fix POS & SOV
Ltd SpacePig
No.Mercy
Triumvirate.
#34 - 2012-01-20 10:19:35 UTC
I don't agree with you on a couple of issues. Twisted

1. Tracking titans needs to be gone - One tracking titan shouldn't be able to kill off 70 - 80 subcaps and the subcaps can't do a thing about it. A group of them with minimal support can take out a whole fleet of hundreds of subcaps.. it happens more or less every day. Just look at the fights where the CCPs fleet got wiped out along with hundreds of other subcaps in matter of minuts as soon as PL and NCdot got on grid with titans and supercarriers.

2. Destructible stations - I like the idea.. BUT.. with some alliance being able to field 160 titans plus 250 supercarriers its very clear how this is going to end. There is no alliances today that can fight that kind of power and save their station. This is going to end up with PL running around and kill every station they can find... you know that this will happen.. be honest.

3. Supercaps overall - I want them gone from combat roles all together.. the ship class is broken. I know this will upset a lot of vets.. but instead CCP should add more capital ship classes and redefine the role of the supercaps.. i would like to see a mothership that can act as a mobile station to launch attacks from. Maybe turning the titan into a giant command ship while still keeping the bridge ability. Removing them from their combat roles would open up for the big capital fights again.. i havent seen them my self but older players always talk about how they used to love those fights and that they miss them. I like the idea about the big ship.. i do.. but sorry.. its not gonna work.. we have seen this very clearly.. one faction will go mental and do what ever it takes to get as many as they can get.. *cough* PL *cough*

Overall i think your one of the better CSM tho :) and stand up against that damn goon.. and don't let him take all the credits.. Smile
Jack Dant
The Gentlemen of Low Moral Fibre
#35 - 2012-01-20 11:16:29 UTC
Quote:
So now you are blasting Angel Cartel raiders (or whatever) and actually assisting the Sansha. This would probably affect your ability to do business in Curse but what do you care? You've got a sweetheart deal here in Stain, etc... EVE is a game all about choices, from your skill training to what corp you are in, what you buy and sell on the market. Everything you do in EVE has some sense of 'finality'; you make a choice and you live with it. I believe that the same element of game play should be applied to the NPC factions as well.

This sounds better in theory Smile But depending on implementation, it could have all sorts of bad consequences.

If this uses the existing standings system, corps living in NPC space will start to add faction standings as a requirement for recruits. But the only people with good standings to pirate factions will be residents of those regions. So you drastically reduce mobility between corps and regions.

Actually, you could have quite the opposite effect people were worried about, and make entrenched NPC space entities even harder to kick out, simply because nobody else has the standings to use their stations. And that would be just as bad.

The balance seems to be very tricky, with high potential to break things. And NPC space is probably the least broken area of space right now.

Quote:
Stuff like that. This sort of thing has been bounced around for going on two years now and I would really like to see CCP try to develop it somewhat. Bear in mind, myself and Greyscale literally stood on desks to keep local chat blank and mysterious in WH space so I fully appreciate the angle proponents for changing it are coming from. However, in normal space, without the development of other options to use for your intel, I'd leave it alone for now. I want it to change, but just flipping a global switch to 'delayed' or whatever isn't the answer IMO.

I agree 100% with that. Personally, I think local should be replaced with a system that gives you more intel, but not as exact or as inmediate as local. As a crazy example, stargates could show a graph of ship jumps in the last hour, color coded for standings/mass/race. Something that takes experience to read accurately.

Quote:
EDIT - Yeah, the preview function seems to be broken as hell ATM. Be careful!

Taking too long to write a reply seems to trigger it. I compose posts in notepad these days.

What happens in lowsec, stays in lowsec, lowering the barrier to entry to lowsec PVP: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=476644&#post476644
Raid'En
#36 - 2012-01-20 12:36:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Raid'En
Quote:
Players should be able to train more than one pilot per account by paying for this privilege with PLEXes (page 30).


Quote:
I'd never do it (I'd just get another account) but if ~people~ want to, why not? This is one of those things that if CCP can do it with minimal effort, I'd raise no real objection to it. The only real advantage I could see is where you have an account with multiple characters with tens of millions of skill points and you could find some benefit there maybe...?



it's my case, and i can tell you i would really like this functionnality.

currently the solutions when you have a need for 2 skills training on the same account are :
1) don't do it
2) open new account, pay 2 plex to move char, 2 plex to move it back... obviously too expensive 90% of the time.

my char are placed depending on what i need online at the same time, not depending on what i need to train... and we can't have both.
it would be an idea for master account...

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=679180#post679180

ps : i liked the idea of stargate construction capital ship, and made me also remember the idea about hacking stargate that was tossed some months ago
Kenpachi Viktor
Perkone
Caldari State
#37 - 2012-01-20 12:39:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Kenpachi Viktor
Jack Dant wrote:
Quote:
So now you are blasting Angel Cartel raiders (or whatever) and actually assisting the Sansha. This would probably affect your ability to do business in Curse but what do you care? You've got a sweetheart deal here in Stain, etc... EVE is a game all about choices, from your skill training to what corp you are in, what you buy and sell on the market. Everything you do in EVE has some sense of 'finality'; you make a choice and you live with it. I believe that the same element of game play should be applied to the NPC factions as well.

This sounds better in theory Smile But depending on implementation, it could have all sorts of bad consequences.

If this uses the existing standings system, corps living in NPC space will start to add faction standings as a requirement for recruits. But the only people with good standings to pirate factions will be residents of those regions. So you drastically reduce mobility between corps and regions.

Actually, you could have quite the opposite effect people were worried about, and make entrenched NPC space entities even harder to kick out, simply because nobody else has the standings to use their stations. And that would be just as bad.

The balance seems to be very tricky, with high potential to break things. And NPC space is probably the least broken area of space right now.



If anyone could join any of the pirate factions (or non pirate factions) - ie faction warfare; - via an epic arc storyline (or something to allow you to decide to swap factions in spite of a -10 standing) even with out systems to fight over (aka plexing) you would be able to fix more easily if the standings of who you're shooting at affected your own standings, and/or you expanded incursions to have everyone invading everywhere. Pirate

Wow that is a horrible sentence What?

A war that would’ve involved 20,000 players, 75% of nullsec space, and hundreds of supercapitals was halted not by diplomacy, but by a game mechanic so dreadful that those who have experienced it previously have no desire to do so again. - Fix POS & SOV
ANGAL 2000
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#38 - 2012-01-20 12:44:05 UTC
I am happy to hear about clones being look at, eve has no reward for the old age eve player, angal is my sub combat toon and soon i will stop training him but my main combat toon is sitting in a ship i only use for them special ops (love em titans) a lot of old age players have simple stop due to this and seeing the only drive in eve is to get more and more new people to join and leave the old guys out in the cold.

now for the myth about tracking titans i will simple leave it as a myth.
but have to add something so i will leave a bit of advise if you are in combat against a titan > when you lang on grid move
> guns have limited tracking, no amount of tracking mods will change this.
corbexx
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#39 - 2012-01-20 13:08:41 UTC
was wondering what your thoughts are on wh stabalizers seleene. since you did alot of work on wh space.

whats the chance of getting a completely accurate transcript of the meetings along with which csm member attually suggested what.

Corbexx for CSM X - Wormholes still deserve better
Ryans Revenge
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#40 - 2012-01-20 15:07:04 UTC
Regarding the NPC Issue.

Personally I love NPC space the way it is. It makes for very fun small gang pvp action without political crap some of us really don't enjoy.

However I do see the issue with people been able to use these stations as safe havens and places to build caps. With that been said why not just make capital production impossible in npc space. Simply set it that you have to own the space you live in to put up these types of structures and such?

This way sub-cap production companies and moon miners still get their moons in npc space but big corps/alliances/production whores have to own the space they are building this big stuff in and therefore defend it. No safe npc space with safe neutral stations.

In my opinion this also solves the problem of the npc space station's been safe havens for the big fleets. If the targets the fleets are attacking aren't in npc space, they can't dock in npc stations. Simple.

Now if people want to moan about docking games in npc space, move to nullsec. You're not in an empire war because of docking games so don't chose npc space if you don't like them either.