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When NPCs become detrimental to PVP

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Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#421 - 2017-01-04 20:01:19 UTC
Salvos Rhoska wrote:


The objective/subjective side issue was moot and immaterial. It is a philosophical issue whether any individual can be objective, or whether any body of science can be truly objective. I am as "subjective" or "objective" as any other human being, but that again is neither here nor there in relation to the issues discussed in this thread.


Ha! P

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Lady Ayeipsia
BlueWaffe
#422 - 2017-01-04 20:16:07 UTC
http://massivelyop.com/2015/10/28/eve-vegas-2015-what-to-expect-from-eve-vegas-2015-2/

Again, the idea of more dynamic NPCs in eve is old and a goal of CCP. It may not roll out perfectly and it may mess up some things.

Still, to play in a world that is more alive be it NPC life or not, i am happy to watch. Yeah it will be interesting. Yeah there may be oddities. But still to see more active consequences for our actions is great.
Etain Darklightner Agittain
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#423 - 2017-01-04 21:29:43 UTC
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Personally, the part that interests me is that a minority of the player populace can game this mechanic to provide them with NPC aid in PVP in high security space.
I'm talking deliberately, not incidentally.
Granted, setting the circumstances up to make it happen requires both work and luck. However, if you do pull it off you get a hotdrop of a friendly NPC fleet repping you without fear of losing their neutral logi... because they have the rest of their kill fleet present to defend said logi.

Mind you, it doesn't trouble me that this can be used as a trap.
What concerns me is that it is limited only to special snowflakes such as myself, or others who've ground like bloody murder to be deemed almost as awesome by DCM.
It's almost like CCP has decided that anyone who's not Deities is a scrub or something.


Here is what I expected to see. Not the whining but rather the exploitation of mechanics in game, purposefully and articulately placed by the Denveloperst. Make use of what is possible, don't bother with what isn't.

Then again I don't see myself as a snowflake who deserves a participation trophy. Get in or GTFO, understand your environment and adapt or don't and get podded. I don't care which you choose remi, get on with it. I'm done with your empty rhetoric and your targeted metaphorical descriptions you have of posters on this thread.
Brylan Grey
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#424 - 2017-01-04 21:44:05 UTC
OP: Can I have your stuff?
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#425 - 2017-01-04 21:45:53 UTC
Brylan Grey wrote:
OP: Can I have your stuff?


Roll

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#426 - 2017-01-04 22:01:33 UTC
Brylan Grey wrote:
OP: Can I have your stuff?

Sure you can. Go take it off him. He's pretty easy to find in lowsec based on his killboard.

Of course, you wouldn't just be a gutless sperg would you?

Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."
Syn Shi
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#427 - 2017-01-04 23:14:15 UTC
Bring friends
Git good
Risk/Reward
Consequences

Maybe some cheese with that wine
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#428 - 2017-01-05 00:37:53 UTC
Brylan Grey wrote:
OP: Can I have your stuff?


You know, I can still count the number of ships I've lost to solo PVP'ers on one hand. Every other time I've lost something, It's required three or more people.

So bring friends.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#429 - 2017-01-05 05:07:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Remiel Pollard
Etain Darklightner Agittain wrote:
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Personally, the part that interests me is that a minority of the player populace can game this mechanic to provide them with NPC aid in PVP in high security space.
I'm talking deliberately, not incidentally.
Granted, setting the circumstances up to make it happen requires both work and luck. However, if you do pull it off you get a hotdrop of a friendly NPC fleet repping you without fear of losing their neutral logi... because they have the rest of their kill fleet present to defend said logi.

Mind you, it doesn't trouble me that this can be used as a trap.
What concerns me is that it is limited only to special snowflakes such as myself, or others who've ground like bloody murder to be deemed almost as awesome by DCM.
It's almost like CCP has decided that anyone who's not Deities is a scrub or something.


Here is what I expected to see. Not the whining but rather the exploitation of mechanics in game, purposefully and articulately placed by the Denveloperst. Make use of what is possible, don't bother with what isn't.

Then again I don't see myself as a snowflake who deserves a participation trophy. Get in or GTFO, understand your environment and adapt or don't and get podded. I don't care which you choose remi, get on with it. I'm done with your empty rhetoric and your targeted metaphorical descriptions you have of posters on this thread.


Criticism of, and raising awareness of flaws in new mechanics =/= whining. Referring to it as 'whining' tells me exactly where you stand, hence why you and your opinions are as worthless as that NPC corp you're in. What you 'expect' of me, and what I can do, are two completely unrelated things. Who the actual **** are you that I should care what you expect?

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#430 - 2017-01-05 05:46:06 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Railyn Quisqueya wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Etain Darklightner Agittain wrote:


Restating the obvious thing we should be doing in lowsec, while informative as to your position, is unnecessarily redundent.

The consequences are obvious, pop a pc in an npc mining Corp, get shot back at. Ganking shouldn't be easy for anyone, or in this case, as you put it, killing spies and scouts in system shouldn't be easy. CCP doesn't look like they're going to change the mechanics of this so maybe bring your friends along for all to get their kill mails?

You attack people in their posts for reading comprehension as they respond to you, as if, you're better than they are somehow. You're not, you look dodgy at best putting people down instead of taking into consideration that maybe they might have something to offer you. I just see you as trolling.


Sorry, but restating the same carebear crap that's already been argued against in this thread isn't a point. I suggest you try reading it. And if I'm vitriolic, it's because I'm getting sick and tired of the so far wilful ignorance that leads to posts like yours.


You know, Remiel? For someone who claims to be autistic, you sure like to insult people's intelligence just by them simply disagreeing with you. I don't know if it's some kind of defense mechanism. I suspect it is. People have brought up very valid points in this thread that do not necessarily align with your views. It doesn't mean they're automatically inferior to your intelligence. You need to learn to accept that other people's opinions may be just as valid as yours. Or, if you feel it isn't valid, address the opinion, not the person. If you already have, then move on. No need for the snarky intelligence remarks. Just some thoughts to live by.


You have also demonstrated a refusal/inability to read and keep up and subsequently form any kind of educated opinion on the topic at hand, so why the **** should I care what you have to say or think about me? Maybe you should read more of the posts that these two have posted in open hostility to me BEFORE I became hostile to them. Oh, wait, you don't want to, because you'd rather be hostile to me as well, as you were in your own first post on this thread. GG.




Remiel. You Ok? B4R is ^

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#431 - 2017-01-05 05:53:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Remiel Pollard
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:




Remiel. You Ok? B4R is ^


I hope you're not belittling real life emotional anxiety by comparing it to a difference of opinion over a video game. That would be incredibly trashy of you.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#432 - 2017-01-05 06:13:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Teckos Pech
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:


Remiel. You Ok? B4R is ^


I hope you were being sincere otherwise you are nothing but a complete and giant douche.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Salvos Rhoska
#433 - 2017-01-05 07:18:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Salvos Rhoska
1) That there is currently only one joinable NPC corp, by bloodline, to which this system applies, is a balance problem.

2) The system itself, however, is not a balance problem.

CCP Paradox wrote:
This is a first stage at creating new procedural PvE content for EVE, to make the universe more exciting, vibrant and alive.

The mining NPCs will react to hostiles if you should attack them, and call in a fleet for assistance. They will also react according to your standings, should they be negative.

(Full post: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=496994)

I think this is a pilot project by CCP to test the system ingame, whilst the expanded system is tested on SiSi, and is further developed by CCP as to future changes and implementation.

It makes sense to test it on live in a relatively restricted fashion, such as only by one bloodline at this time.

The issue of NPC dynamics and interaction has been explored in this thread, and is corroborated by a CCP Dev post.
Its impact on LS is explored in this thread.

The only outstanding argumentt I see, is that this applies to only one bloodline NPC Corp.
However, as I point out above, I think that is only temporary, pending wider implementation.

PvE v PvP <> Old School Exploration <> CODE Licenses <> CODE Special Agent
Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#434 - 2017-01-05 07:20:59 UTC
Teckos Pech wrote:
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:


Remiel. You Ok? B4R is ^


I hope you were being sincere otherwise you are noting but a complete and giant douche.

I know what I'd be putting my money on.

Herzog being a bot aligned lying douche.

Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."
Salvos Rhoska
#435 - 2017-01-05 07:33:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Salvos Rhoska
Remiel Pollard wrote:
I hope you're not belittling real life emotional anxiety by comparing it to a difference of opinion over a video game. That would be incredibly trashy of you
...
you and your opinions are as worthless as that NPC corp you're in.

Teckos Pech wrote:
I hope you were being sincere otherwise you are nothing but a complete and giant douche.

Shae Tadaruwa wrote:
Herzog being a bot aligned lying douche.
...
Of course, you wouldn't just be a gutless sperg would you?

Galaxy Duck wrote:
...bunch of spergs.


And the ad-hominem insult brigade continues.

Whilst ignoring the dozens of incidents of personal abuse, insults and disrespect Remiel and these others continue to lay on those that disagree with them.

Its like you learned nothing.

You went right back to self-destructing your own thread and exhibiting exactly the behavior for which you have already been called out on and criticized.

PvE v PvP <> Old School Exploration <> CODE Licenses <> CODE Special Agent
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#436 - 2017-01-05 07:59:38 UTC
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
I hope you're not belittling real life emotional anxiety by comparing it to a difference of opinion over a video game. That would be incredibly trashy of you.

Teckos Pech wrote:
I hope you were being sincere otherwise you are nothing but a complete and giant douche.

Shae Tadaruwa wrote:
Herzog being a bot aligned lying douche.


And the ad-hominem insult brigade continues.

Whilst ignoring the dozens of incidents of personal abuse, insults and disrespect Remiel and these others continue to lay on those that disagree with them.

Its like you learned nothing.

You went right back to self-destructing your own thread and exhibiting exactly the behavior for which you have already been called out on and criticized.


No, I was criticising someone's use of real-world emotional struggles as an attempt to throw me off balance. It is, actually, a very trashy thing to do. I have no delusion that he has genuine concern for my well-being, so you can take that ad-hom projection of yours, and shove it up your arse.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#437 - 2017-01-05 08:00:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Teckos Pech
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
I hope you're not belittling real life emotional anxiety by comparing it to a difference of opinion over a video game. That would be incredibly trashy of you.

Teckos Pech wrote:
I hope you were being sincere otherwise you are nothing but a complete and giant douche.

Shae Tadaruwa wrote:
Herzog being a bot aligned lying douche.


And the ad-hominem insult brigade continues.

Whilst ignoring the dozens of incidents of personal abuse, insults and disrespect Remiel and these others continue to lay on those that disagree with them.

Its like you learned nothing.

You went right back to self-destructing your own thread and exhibiting exactly the behavior for which you have already been called out on and criticized.


Making a joke out of depression and people suffering psychiatric emergencies is not funny at all. Now maybe Herzog was being serious, but I don't see anything in Remiel's posts to indicate he is in psychiatric distress so my first thought is that Herzog was being a douche, but I thought I'd give him the benefit of the doubt and make it a conditional statement.

Since I have a loved one who has suffered through major depression I have to say, if Herzog was making a joke I think a permanent forum ban would be in order as it is no laughing matter.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Salvos Rhoska
#438 - 2017-01-05 08:06:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Salvos Rhoska
Remiel Pollard wrote:
you can take that ad-hom projection of yours, and shove it up your arse.

Teckos Pech wrote:
Since I have a loved one who has suffered through major depression I have to say, if Herzog was making a joke I think a permanent forum ban would be in order as it is no laughing matter.


I refer you to the dozens of incidents of Remiel, yourself and others being abusive, insulting and disrespectful of people that may infact be suffering from severe clinical depressions, autism or any number of conditions without you knowing it.

That is part of the reason such behavior is not allowed, in addition to it obviously being uncivil, dragging down the quality of the community and the board.

I have, and will continue to list all insults, abuse and disrespect you continue to lay on participants you disagree with and wish to denigrate.

You have no ground to stand on. Look at the list in my post above which constitutes not even 1/10 of the totality of what you and others listed have said throughout this thread.


Herzog asked if Remiel is ok.
There is nothing wrong with asking someone if they are OK.
Its a perfectly normal colloquial term used around the world millions of times a day.

The very fact you attempt to twist that and insinuate that to mean something you do not know it to mean, is insulting and disrespectful in and of itself.

You are continuing to exhibit, constantly, exactly the kind of behavior you have already been called out on many times.
You are continuing to destroy your own thread, and avoiding ontop discussion in preference of attempting to force out participants with insults and abuse.

PvE v PvP <> Old School Exploration <> CODE Licenses <> CODE Special Agent
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#439 - 2017-01-05 08:12:53 UTC
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
you can take that ad-hom projection of yours, and shove it up your arse.

Teckos Pech wrote:
Since I have a loved one who has suffered through major depression I have to say, if Herzog was making a joke I think a permanent forum ban would be in order as it is no laughing matter.


I refer you to the dozens of incidents of Remiel, yourself and others being abusive, insulting and disrespectful of people that may infact be suffering from serious clinical depressions, autism or any number of conditions without you knowing it.

I have, and will continue to list all insults, abuse and disrespect you continue to lay on participants you disagree with and wish to denigrate.

You have no ground to stand on. Look at the list in my post above which constitutes not even 1/10 of the totality of what you and others listed have said throughout this thread.


Herzog asked if Remiel is ok.
There is nothing wrong with asking someone if they are OK.
Its a perfectly normal colloquial term used around the world millions of times a day.
The very fact you attempt to twist that and insinuate that to mean something you do not know it to mean, is insulting and disrespectful in and of itself.


Please learn to read douche.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#440 - 2017-01-05 08:15:30 UTC
BTW, why don't you let Herzog defend himself.

And learn what a conditional statement means.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online