These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Intergalactic Summit

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
Previous page123
 

On the realignment of my crew structure

Author
Avaelica Kuershin
Paper Cats
#41 - 2016-12-22 01:06:50 UTC
Arrendis wrote:

Direct democracy's a lovely idea. Maybe at some point, the Federation can even make it work. So far, though, human history's shown it pretty much collapses under any pressure worth noticing. Don't get me wrong, I applaud your motives... but much like the thread on 'let's stop CODE by shooting at them!', I have to view your methodology as ineffectual, probably even counterproductive to your goals, and repeatedly and consistently shown by mountains and mountains of 'people tried this'-style data to be a Bad Idea™.


Direct Democracy does tend to be an idea which flourishes most readily in UC but not even the Federation can make it work. Indeed, I would be worried for the future of the Federation if they tried. It's just too big.

And the number of Artist's Collectives I've seen which dissolved into bickering... well!

Kolodi Ramal
Sanxing Yi
#42 - 2016-12-22 06:50:58 UTC
True that the Federation itself isn't exactly a direct democracy, but 30-40% of the member states are direct democracies, 20-30% are representative democracies (including stuff like elective monarchies), and 40-50% are "hybrid democracies" including the Federal government.

(here's one source of info about hybrid democracy and the rest)
Bjorn Tyrson
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#43 - 2016-12-29 00:13:57 UTC
This has got to be one of the most dangerously Naive and hopelessly optimistic pieces of drivel I have ever heard.
Look, working a capsuleer ship is **** work, and one of the most dangerous things someone could ever possibly undertake, the people who crew our ships are literally gambling with their lives, sure some assignments are safer than others, and yeah escape pods do mean that at least some of the crew is likely to escape... well assuming the pilot hasn't taken them into J-space, in which case if something goes wrong there aint no one coming to save them.

So why do they do it then? Because working for us is the quickest and fastest way for most of them to better their lot in life, the meager pittance we pay them (by our standards) is enough for most of them to retire to a safer line of work, or pursue better education for themselves within a month or so of signing on board, and in my experience that is about the maximum turn around time for most people. Sure some old hands may stay in the employ of a particular capsuleer for longer, but they generally swap to a station based role that while paying less, is infinitely safer.

By enacting this proposal of yours, you are actually making life harder for yourself, and are gonna find it harder to keep loyal crewmen around. why? because first of all, they sign up with us out of desperation yes, but also because they assume that we at least have some inkling of what we are doing. By putting the responsibility on them you undermine your own authority, and with it their trust in you. Second of all, if you are advocating a fair and equitable split of profits, truly advocating for that, then your gonna find damn near every single crewman you've got jumping ship after the very first operation, after all, that 100 or 1k ISK share they would be entitled too, would be enough for them to just flat out retire and in style at that after only a single time out of dock. so why risk their lives further?

What you are suggesting may work aboard ships crewed entirely by regular people, where there is some semblance of equality, but we are NOT the equal to these people, we cannot and never will be, it is our elevated status that gives them the faith to put their lives into our hands, and through that gives them the chance to obtain a better live than they would have otherwise. and for the very rare, and lucky few, gives them something to aspire towards being.

By treating them as equals, you are not elevating them, you are diminishing yourself, and in the process stripping away what precious little they do have.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#44 - 2016-12-29 03:13:26 UTC
Bjorn Tyrson wrote:
Stuff


Not that I'm directly disagreeing with you as you're busy agreeing with me, but did you read to the end of the thread where she already said she's gonna take some time and re-think the whole thing? I mean, there's making the point, and then there's flogging a dead fedo.
Bjorn Tyrson
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#45 - 2016-12-29 03:20:19 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
Bjorn Tyrson wrote:
Stuff


Not that I'm directly disagreeing with you as you're busy agreeing with me, but did you read to the end of the thread where she already said she's gonna take some time and re-think the whole thing? I mean, there's making the point, and then there's flogging a dead fedo.


Isn't overkill what we do best?
Elmund Egivand
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#46 - 2016-12-29 03:24:39 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
Bjorn Tyrson wrote:
Stuff


Not that I'm directly disagreeing with you as you're busy agreeing with me, but did you read to the end of the thread where she already said she's gonna take some time and re-think the whole thing? I mean, there's making the point, and then there's flogging a dead fedo.


Don't flog dead fedo. They stink worse than when they were alive.

A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.

Arrendis
TK Corp
#47 - 2016-12-29 05:50:26 UTC
Bjorn Tyrson wrote:
Isn't overkill what we do best?


I'm a logistics pilot. I don't even do 'kill'.
Previous page123