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Cap recharger & Ancillary Armor rep behavior explanation
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Dvametragluposti Umobolus
Apotheosis.
#1 - 2016-12-27 22:07:40 UTC
Sup,

I have both on Auto-reload and Auto-repeat.
However, Cap booster will reload, but won't repeat, even when capacitor reaches 0.
Vice-versa, Armor rep won't auto reload Paste.
Yes, I have more of each ammo in bay.

Why?
Memphis Baas
#2 - 2016-12-27 22:42:21 UTC
Most modules that need to reload won't restart once the reload is done. Guns, missiles, cap booster, they all do this; you have to activate them again as soon as they're reloaded, otherwise they'll just sit there.

Don't know about the ancillary armor, but the ancillary shield has a LONG reload time, and it won't reload until you turn it off. Once it's going, it'll consume its charges and then keep on going on empty, consuming your capacitor, and will only reload when you turn it off. This gives some control over when exactly to spend the 1 minute it takes to reload the thing; you can use up the charges and your capacitor, if it's an emergency, before you stop it to reload.
Dvametragluposti Umobolus
Apotheosis.
#3 - 2016-12-28 13:26:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Dvametragluposti Umobolus
Memphis Baas wrote:
Most modules that need to reload won't restart once the reload is done. Guns, missiles, cap booster, they all do this; you have to activate them again as soon as they're reloaded, otherwise they'll just sit there.

Don't know about the ancillary armor, but the ancillary shield has a LONG reload time, and it won't reload until you turn it off. Once it's going, it'll consume its charges and then keep on going on empty, consuming your capacitor, and will only reload when you turn it off. This gives some control over when exactly to spend the 1 minute it takes to reload the thing; you can use up the charges and your capacitor, if it's an emergency, before you stop it to reload.


Then why the options of auto repeat and reload? I know guns stop shooting after reload, but they have lot of ammo inside. Cap Booster has only 1 charge.

I really need Ancillary Rep to reload the Paste, and I so far need Cap Booster to reload itself to keep the Capacitor working mid fight.[/quote]
Dvametragluposti Umobolus
Apotheosis.
#4 - 2016-12-28 13:27:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Dvametragluposti Umobolus
*double post, remove me*
Memphis Baas
#5 - 2016-12-28 14:18:07 UTC
The auto-repeat is an option (and not forced on us) because of modules like MWD, where you may want to just use one cycle. Also, sometimes ships fit 2x repairers, one going continuously and the other just doing one cycle as needed. In these cases, we have the option to disable auto-repeat for these modules.

Cap booster doesn't have 1 charge; it's your choice to use it with the biggest charge it can fit, you certainly have the option of using smaller and more charges in the cap booster (esp. for the bigger ones).

But ultimately, you're asking us (players) why CCP decided to do things this way, and my answers are opinions, cause I don't know what went through their minds at the time they were coding this stuff. If you want it changed, you can:

a. Make a suggestion in the Suggestions and Ideas forum.

b. Open a support ticket and ask for it; you'll probably get a "we don't do suggestions, do you have an issue / bug / crash to report?", but maybe they'll forward it to the devs.
Dvametragluposti Umobolus
Apotheosis.
#6 - 2016-12-28 15:45:58 UTC
Memphis Baas wrote:
The auto-repeat is an option (and not forced on us) because of modules like MWD, where you may want to just use one cycle. Also, sometimes ships fit 2x repairers, one going continuously and the other just doing one cycle as needed. In these cases, we have the option to disable auto-repeat for these modules.

Cap booster doesn't have 1 charge; it's your choice to use it with the biggest charge it can fit, you certainly have the option of using smaller and more charges in the cap booster (esp. for the bigger ones).

But ultimately, you're asking us (players) why CCP decided to do things this way, and my answers are opinions, cause I don't know what went through their minds at the time they were coding this stuff. If you want it changed, you can:

a. Make a suggestion in the Suggestions and Ideas forum.

b. Open a support ticket and ask for it; you'll probably get a "we don't do suggestions, do you have an issue / bug / crash to report?", but maybe they'll forward it to the devs.


Thanks for replying.

I didn't know smaller Cap Boost charges fit multiple times into Cap Boosters, something to try out. That's one possible workaround, rather than constantly mashing that cap booster icon while it's finished with cycle :)

Regarding Ancillary+Paste, makes no sense why it doesn't reload paste...
Dvametragluposti Umobolus
Apotheosis.
#7 - 2016-12-28 17:29:32 UTC
Keno Skir
#8 - 2016-12-28 18:16:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Keno Skir
Might be late info, but for Ancillary Repper at least it's because of the 2 functions it can perform. A turret module for instance won't do anything without ammo, therefor it's safe to assume that if you have ammo ready to load it should be loaded. The Ancillary Rep however does 2 kinds of boost. With ammo loaded it will boost a lot but stop now and again for a minute during which it cannot be used. However if no ammo is loaded the Ancillary Rep does something different, boosting less but with no stop for reload necessary.

It's the 2 functions with different pros and cons that mean it's not "assumed" that you want it to reload, you might still be under fire and want to leave it running on low power rather than have 0 reps for 60secs.

Sorry if you already worked this out Pirate

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Dvametragluposti Umobolus
Apotheosis.
#9 - 2016-12-28 18:32:18 UTC
Keno Skir wrote:
Might be late info, but for Ancillary Repper at least it's because of the 2 functions it can perform. A turret module for instance won't do anything without ammo, therefor it's safe to assume that if you have ammo ready to load it should be loaded. The Ancillary Rep however does 2 kinds of boost. With ammo loaded it will boost a lot but stop now and again for a minute during which it cannot be used. However if no ammo is loaded the Ancillary Rep does something different, boosting less but with no stop for reload necessary.

It's the 2 functions with different pros and cons that mean it's not "assumed" that you want it to reload, you might still be under fire and want to leave it running on low power rather than have 0 reps for 60secs.

Sorry if you already worked this out Pirate


Sorted it out. Still disappointed with not being able to set to turn off is there is no Paste in Anc Rep, or to reload it, like a tick mark option or smth. As for Cap Booster, to work only between X and Y Capacitor values, aka 33%-90%.

o7
Memphis Baas
#10 - 2016-12-28 22:27:46 UTC
Well, having to do this manually is what separates a win from a loss in PVP. Everyone else has to mind their modules too; it introduces the chance that you'll forget and lose the fight.

There's a "reload all" key; if you press it, it will load whatever modules aren't busy. That means, if the guns are firing and the cap recharger is cycling, and the only thing that you've turned off is the ancillary, "reload all" will reload the ancillary only.

There's also keys for turning on/off med slots and low slots, it's not just F1 that you can press. Remap your keyboard shortcuts to:

F1 - F4 - high slots
F5 - F8 - med slots
F9 - F12 - low slots

With weapons grouping and the few slots that most ships have, it's unlikely that you'll ever have to press more than 6 - 8 buttons, really.

Drag the icons for the various modules around to different slots, when you're in space, and you can turn things on and off much faster. Move your HUD to the top, or move your targets bar down to just above the HUD, etc., so you can focus your eyes on all the indicators and not have to roam all over the screen.

Turn off shield and armor warnings, and turn on capacitor warnings, so that you hear a buzzer when the ancillary sucks your capacitor too much. Configure it to buzz you at 33%. Hit ESC and play with the audio settings, mute the music and the "environment" / "ambiance" sounds, and turn up the capacitor buzzer and the repairer sounds.
Major Trant
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#11 - 2016-12-29 12:35:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Major Trant
Dvametragluposti Umobolus wrote:


...Still disappointed with not being able to set to turn off is there is no Paste in Anc Rep, or to reload it, like a tick mark option or smth. As for Cap Booster, to work only between X and Y Capacitor values, aka 33%-90%.

o7

The Ancillary Repper can be toggled for Auto-Repeat and Auto-Reload. The Cap Booster certainly can be toggled for Auto-Repeat, I think it can be toggled for Auto-Reload too.

While in space you have to right click on the module and pick the relevant option to toggle it. Note that the option is poorly worded. For example if Auto-Repeat is on, you will have the option "Auto-Repeat off" or something like that (can't remember the exact wording). But after selecting it and switching Auto-Repeat off, the next time you right click on the module you will see "Auto-Repeat on". ie. it shows the exact opposite of what is currently selected.

Each type of Cap Booster has a capacity limit, but will take all sizes of charges up to that capacity limit and multiple charges if possible. Also note that the faction Cap Booster charges (eg Navy Cap Booster 800) take up only 2/3rds of the size of the regular charges, both in the cargohold and in the Capacitor Booster. Examples:-

A Heavy Capacitor Booster II has a capacity of 160m3, so can fit:
. 5 x Cap Booster 800 (@ 32m3 each)
. 6 x Navy Cap Booster 800 (@ 24m3 each)
. 10 x Cap Booster 400 (@ 16m3 each)
. 13 x Navy Cap Booster 400 (@ 12m3 each)
etc...

A Small Capacitor Booster II has a capacity of 15m3, so can fit:
. 1 x Navy Cap Booster 400 (@ 12m3)
. 1 x Cap Booster 200 (@ 8m3)
. 2 x Navy Cap Booster 200 (@ 6m3 each)
. 2 x Cap Booster 150 (@ 6m3 each)
. 3 x Navy Cap Booster 150 (@ 4.5m3 each)
etc...

Note that the charge you intend to fit, may allow you to fit a T1 Capacitor Booster with lower fitting needs. For example in the Small case above, a T1 with a capacity of 12m3 will still fit the same number of Navy Cap Booster 400, Cap Booster 200s, Navy Cap Booster 200s and Cap Booster 150s as a T2. The T2 is only better if you are fitting Navy Cap Booster 150s.

What size of charge you fit and whether to Auto-Repeat/Auto-Reload or not depends on many factors, eg Cap pressure, size of Cap, size of cargohold. Obviously you don't want to be cap boosting with a charge that is too big for your capacitor and wastes some of it and that is one reason you might want to switch Auto-Repeat off. A frigate might have a Capacitor of 500, but if you fire off a Small Capacitor Booster II with 3 x Navy Cap Booster 150 fitted, when it is at 1/3rd Cap. Some of the final charge may be clipped and wasted with Auto-Repeat on.

Also note that a cap booster cycles in 12 seconds and reloads in 10 seconds. So in the Small Capacitor Booster example above, with a Navy 400 loaded it will boost 400 every 22 seconds (18/s), but with Navy 150s loaded it will boost 450 every 46 seconds (10/s).

The latter suggests fitting the largest possible charge. However, in a heavy neuting situation, you only want to boost the minimum amount to run your setup at the point you boost, because the rest will be neuted away by the time your modules recycle. So 3 smaller boosts delivered 12 seconds apart would be advantagous in that situation.

For the Ancillary Repper, switching off Auto-Reload is an important consideration in a PvP situation especially if it is the only repper. Because it takes a minute to reload the paste, which is often longer than most 1v1 engagements last. However, unloaded it can continue to rep at 1/3rd effectiveness.