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Mining now sucks per cycle.
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2Sonas1Cup
#21 - 2016-12-20 15:08:28 UTC
Ok, thanks for sharing..

Noted.


I will talk to my friend that works at CCP and he will change it tonight, no worries.
ZentorUk
Totally Justified
Total Justification
#22 - 2016-12-20 15:57:01 UTC
By CCP Carrier pigeon
Shiroe Kumamato
SoulPepper Expeditionary Force
#23 - 2016-12-20 16:10:31 UTC
Scarlett LaBlanc wrote:

SurrenderMonkey wrote:
"Ore per cycle" is a pretty useless value. Try a fixed frame of reference, such as m3 per hour.


My thoughts exactly.

I dusted off an old barge and orca and tried it out.
Aside from the changes to the orca and boosting, the barges were changed as well. I had to refit an old hulk due to the changes. Lost one of the three strip miners (only 2 high slots now). Gained a low slot.

Last year a max skilled barge pilot and a max skilled orca pilot with T2 implant would pull 4,155 M3 / 83 second cycle
That was 1,385 M3 X 3 strips

That worked out to about 180,000 M3 / hour

Currently the same two pilots will pull:
3,013 M3 / 61 second cycle
1,506 M3 X 2 strips

That works out to about 177,000 M3 / hour or 1.7% less than last year.

However, the mining drone changes should offset that assuming drones are used.


For ore this may be true, but for ice it doesn't work out the same. The orca can only field 1 ice mining drone. I beleive the only way to make an orca do ice in equivalent amounts as an exhumer is to use the faction ice drones, so you can field 2 of them due to reduced bandwidth needs.
Simon Hashur
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#24 - 2016-12-20 19:46:47 UTC
pre- update, a fully boosted orca (with the pilot having the mindlink implant) supporting a T2 yield fit hulk with the pilot having the MX-1005 implant, the hulks yield was:-

turret cycle time - 69.9s
turret yield - 1924m3

1924 / 69.9 = 27.52m3/s
27.52 x 60 = 1651m3/min
1651 x 2 = 3303m3/min

post update, with the T2 range/cycle time command bursts, the hulks yield is now:-

turret cycle time - 61.5s
turret yield - 1673ms

1673 / 61.5 = 27.20m3/s
27.20 x 60 = 1632mx
1632 x 2 = 3264m3/min

5xT2 mining drones in the orca pull in 900m3 per trip, m3/min depends on how far from the 'roid you are
Iain Cariaba
#25 - 2016-12-20 19:52:50 UTC
So a maxed hulk loses 39m3/min? It's the end of the world!!!!!!!!!!!
Drago Shouna
Doomheim
#26 - 2016-12-20 20:17:22 UTC
Iain Cariaba wrote:
So a maxed hulk loses 39m3/min? It's the end of the world!!!!!!!!!!!




As we know it...

Solecist Project...." They refuse to play by the rules and laws of the game and use it as excuse ..." " They don't care about how you play as long as they get to play how they want."

Welcome to EVE.
Nicolai Serkanner
Incredible.
Brave Collective
#27 - 2016-12-20 20:20:56 UTC
ZentorUk wrote:
LOL.

Sorry.. I see the forum is a waste of time.




deleted.
Sun sue
311. Bomber squadron
GaNg BaNg TeAm
#28 - 2016-12-20 21:04:03 UTC
I am on the Ops Side on this one

1. Yes a Rorqual is a 3B+ ship but the idea of only using one toon to do an action, will is what I believe most casual players are always look for.
2. Is something balanced when a Solo Toon can net upwards of 80-120 Mil/Hr with less mouse clicking then a Miner Who has to field an Orca, 3x Hulks and Freighter to meet that same demand?
3. I strongly desire that the entire system of Mining gets an over haul. designing an over powered ship ( capital ) is and will never be or should be the answer to New Edens problems
Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#29 - 2016-12-20 21:18:58 UTC
ZentorUk wrote:



Please check char age....






I'm not sure if that's a rather lame chest-beating attempt, but in any event you're surely old enough to know better than to mine.

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log
Sylvia Kildare
Kinetic Fury
#30 - 2016-12-21 03:07:55 UTC
Jennifer Starblaze wrote:
Cycle time is less but yield / cycle is lower as well on fleet boosted barges because the mining foreman mindlink does not give a bonus to yield anymore, but increases the effectiveness of your boosts giving even shorter cycles compared to a booster that does have the implant.

I am not a miner so I am not gonna do the math for you, but from a quick look over the stats the yield / minute should be the same as before.

However the prices of Tritanium, Pyerite, Mexallon, Nocxium and Isogen have dropped since the patch (a quick look on the market graphs could have shown you) which of course results in less ISK / cycle.


Ding ding ding. They nerfed the mining foreman mindlink's effect. Which is weird, because they don't seem to have nerfed the skirmish/info/shield/armor mindlinks and the faction ones that combine the effects. But yeah.
Sylvia Kildare
Kinetic Fury
#31 - 2016-12-21 03:09:13 UTC
Simon Hashur wrote:
pre- update, a fully boosted orca (with the pilot having the mindlink implant) supporting a T2 yield fit hulk with the pilot having the MX-1005 implant, the hulks yield was:-

turret cycle time - 69.9s
turret yield - 1924m3

1924 / 69.9 = 27.52m3/s
27.52 x 60 = 1651m3/min
1651 x 2 = 3303m3/min

post update, with the T2 range/cycle time command bursts, the hulks yield is now:-

turret cycle time - 61.5s
turret yield - 1673ms

1673 / 61.5 = 27.20m3/s
27.20 x 60 = 1632mx
1632 x 2 = 3264m3/min

5xT2 mining drones in the orca pull in 900m3 per trip, m3/min depends on how far from the 'roid you are


Cool math!

And yeah, the fact that Orcas and Porpoises can provide a bit of mining bot action on grid as well as boosting the barges/exhumers = supposed to make up for the loss a bit, I guess.
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#32 - 2016-12-21 04:07:30 UTC
Sylvia Kildare wrote:

Ding ding ding. They nerfed the mining foreman mindlink's effect. Which is weird, because they don't seem to have nerfed the skirmish/info/shield/armor mindlinks and the faction ones that combine the effects. But yeah.

Yes they did. In all cases the passive leadership bonuses have been removed from the skills. Seriously, learn to read patch notes and Dev blogs.
Sarah Flynt
Red Cross Mercenaries
Silent Infinity
#33 - 2016-12-21 06:09:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Sarah Flynt
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Sylvia Kildare wrote:

Ding ding ding. They nerfed the mining foreman mindlink's effect. Which is weird, because they don't seem to have nerfed the skirmish/info/shield/armor mindlinks and the faction ones that combine the effects. But yeah.

Yes they did. In all cases the passive leadership bonuses have been removed from the skills. Seriously, learn to read patch notes and Dev blogs.

The passive leadership bonuses have been moved from the skills to the ganglink charges - except for the mining yield bonus. That one has been entirely removed.

Sick of High-Sec gankers? Join the public channel Anti-ganking and the dedicated intel channel Gank-Intel !
Shayla Etherodyne
Delta Laroth Industries
#34 - 2016-12-21 07:43:52 UTC
Disclaimer: this is something I have read, I don't do enough mining to have tested it.

From comments in the science and industry page, there is a problem with the boosting burst and the mining lasers on the barges.
The duration isn't the same and the boost isn't a constant effect anymore. So, sometime and depending on your skills, you can be mid cycle and loose the boost. From what the posters were saying that will cause you to lose the effect for the whole cycle.
If it is true that can cause some additional loss of mining yeld.

In theory you shouldn't lose anything as the new boosts affect only the mining lasers duration, and that is set at the start of the cycle. There can be the occasional situation where you lose the boost and your cycle resume before the benefit from the new burst are re applied, but that should happen very rarely.

The only way to really test that is to have checked your yeld for hour with the old system and do the same with the new system, with characters with the same skills and implants. And even in that test, the size of the target roids can make a difference as switching roid take some time.

ZentorUk
Totally Justified
Total Justification
#35 - 2016-12-21 08:34:26 UTC  |  Edited by: ZentorUk
Bumblefck wrote:
ZentorUk wrote:



Please check char age....






I'm not sure if that's a rather lame chest-beating attempt, but in any event you're surely old enough to know better than to mine.



Well its was more like... am I using T2 crystals... PMSL

I think for me the game work in circles ... do one thing for a bit.. get sick of it and do something else...

At the mo its just chilling with lazzzors!

I can more isk doing SOE level 4 with one char instead of two.

Zen
Elmund Egivand
Sebestacny Circle
#36 - 2016-12-21 08:44:23 UTC
ZentorUk wrote:
Bumblefck wrote:
ZentorUk wrote:



Please check char age....






I'm not sure if that's a rather lame chest-beating attempt, but in any event you're surely old enough to know better than to mine.



Well its was more like... am I using T2 crystals... PMSL

I think for me the game work in circles ... do one thing for a bit.. get sick of it and do something else...

At the mo its just chilling with lazzzors!

I can more isk doing SOE level 4 with one char instead of two.

Zen


That's the way the game is designed. Do one thing, do it long enough, get sick of it, do something else for a change of scenery.


A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.
Expendable Unit
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#37 - 2016-12-21 11:05:46 UTC
You need to urgently get in contact with CODE., they know all about mining affairs.
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation
The Honda Accord
#38 - 2016-12-21 19:13:31 UTC
Yes, clearly there is no point in mining any more! You need to stop immediately and change your focus on PVT.. Player vs. Themselves!! It a new thing I just invented for you! This style of play can be enjoyed by buying high and selling low! Or finding what looks like a gate camp and self destructing before you find out! Once you get the basics you can advance to flying around in untanked industrIial ships full of high end BPOs or plexs! Level 4 missions in noob ships are just one of the many things you can try to embrace the PVT focus!
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#39 - 2016-12-21 20:11:29 UTC
Can you provide us with the location of your Hulk? We will send a mining support team free of charge to inspect your fit and give you some general advice about how to improve your mining efficiency.

Evil RatKid
Doddy
Excidium.
#40 - 2016-12-21 22:56:50 UTC
Elmund Egivand wrote:
ZentorUk wrote:
Well then if the cycle time is now less.

I should be getting more?


Yes. The amount of ore yield you are getting per cycle remains constant assuming same skill and same modules. A reduction of cycle time means you spend less time getting the same amount of yield, therefore more yield/minute.

If you are getting less yield per cycle, then something really wrong has happened. For example, you might have used the wrong mining crystal, you didn't use the clone with the right mining implant. That or you haven't been checking to see if the change in ship traits.

If the problem isn't the yield but you are still making less isk, then it simply means that the demand for the ore you are mining has gone down in relation to the amount of supply is available on the market.


There is no longer a boost from mining foreman skill since the skills were all reworked. So overall mining amount per cycle was reduced by that 10%. Not sure if other changes to cycle time made up for it, since i literally don't care, but for certain the mining amount boost which fleet used to give to mining is no longer there, despite everyone jumping on the op.
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