EVE General Discussion

I don't think I get "The Rush," but I still enjoy screaming headlong into certain death in video games.

For me, I actually enjoy grinding in games so long as I have someone to talk to on some sort of voice comms and feel like I am in some way contributing to something. Back when I played World of Warcraft, my guildmates and I would go out in a group and grind for hours and hours for no reason other than to kill time and to accumulate gold and item drops. I didn't mind it at all; in fact, I thought it was really fun at the time. On my friend's minecraft server, my most frequent activity is chopping down trees, harvesting and replanting our crops, digging up stone and otherwise gathering useful materials for our group. You might look at that sort of thing as "carebear behavior," or "slave labor," or any number of other pejoratives, but for me it's how I most enjoy the games I play. I feel good about contributing to the group's welfare and accomplishment.

In EVE Online, you can contribute to the group's welfare and accomplishment by helping in PVP. The suicidal frigate pilot, or as we like to call them "Rifter heroes," are an essential part of any fleet doctrine. I find this particular part of PVP to be fun and rewarding because I feel like I am contributing, especially when I die. It also helps me to internally justify not showing up in a bigger and more expensive ship, beyond the fact that those bigger ships just aren't as much fun to me as zipping around in a frigate. So that's what I do. I construct and fit frigates for newbies, I hand them out to newbies and anyone else who wants them, and I fly them myself. I don't feel even a little bit guilty about it, because as is often explained in our official rhetoric it's better to have someone in fleet in a ship he wants to fly than to have one less guy.

Sorry if this sounded like an off-topic rant, but your post inspired me to talk a bit about myself.

They knew, But they were cool about it becuase my Corpies are chill about everything. But still. Lose a boat PVE. That sucked. Especially a Faction Boat. I felt like a damn n00b all over again.

Not sure if this explains it all. In other games I PvPed a lot, sometimes even exclusively for months, while I don't in EVE.

While I don't bother about ship loss or killboards at all, I think the clone costs, loss of implants or skillpoint loss due to lack of implants - and last but not least the whole tedium of grouping up and finding an exciting fight is too discouraging to really bother. I simply do have better uses for my time than roam around for hours for - perhaps - a couple of minutes of fun, or as you call it, "rush".

CCP just doesn't seem to want to cater people who don't have a lot of time to waste away. I think it's one of the reasons they'll never ever get a lot of subscribers.

In one way they have: The PLEX. As has been pointed out by many, the pay from a reasonable job yields hundreds of millions of ISK per hour when used to purchase PLEX. If you do not enjoy "grinding for ISK", then don't. Use that time to make or save RL money and buy PLEX. Even spending time comparison shopping for the lowest prices at the supermarket can result in more isk per hour than L4 missions. Or driving slower to save gas money.

About the entire implant issue: I have suggested before that CCP could change the jump clone cooldown to a few hours, provided the clone jump does not change your location. That way you can get into a clean clone for some PvP, and go right back. But this does not make the galaxy small: Clone jumping across the galaxy still needs that 24 hour cooldown.



Sounds like you are in the middle, where you don't get The Rush, but the stress does not make you sick either. The feeling of accomplishment and desire to work with others draws you into PvP. I get this a tiny bit, and go out with a fleet maybe once every few months, about as much stress as I can tolerate.

I remember adrenaline shakes, don't get them much these days.

A minority? Heh. Only because they want the Missioneers/Miners, etc to come to them. But I digress...

All this talk of risk aversion really comes down to the oft quoted and lamented Risk vs Reward Equation. People who mind their own business and get caught up in PvP usually have little reward for a lot of risk. On the opposite end of the spectrum are those who like to tip the odds in their favor, taking little risk for greater reward, relatively speaking. I hear tales of a time when solo PvP was much more common than it is now. As time passes, it becomes less about the fun of winning or losing and just becomes about winning. Given the current propensity to outnumber a foe in order to recieve the All-Holy KM, it should come as no surprise that some don't even want to bother anymore, and I don't blame them.

Using superiority in numbers IS a valid tactics, and often dictated the outcome in combat. But do you really think the ones being outnumbered where having fun? Oh sure, there are a few out there that truly desire the odds stacked against them, and that's fine. But for the rest, either getting destroyed or having to run quickly loses any luster of 'fun'. They get tired of it, they go do something else. The fishing pond gets smaller and smaller, a vicious cycle that perpetuates itself. It's like Losec...the sharks have either eaten all the fish or chased them away, all in the name of their perspective of 'fun'.

In the end, it's less about risk aversion and more about maximizing your own brand of fun. If there is aversion to anything, it is to embodying the stereotypical victim to the stereotypical villians. Why bother anymore if you can't have your own type of fun? Why put yourself is the drivers seat of risk when you can do things more in your control and thus drive to more reward? It's really not that hard to figure out, you just have to put yourself in the place of your potential victim in order to truly understand why they don't want to play with you anymore.

Souless blobbing is usually about keeping your guys from being bored to tears between wars so they dont up and leave your corp/alliance.

Speaking from a solo pilots point of view: Yes, Fun is the purpose of my pvp as well as the challenge of solo flying. I like winning fights I should not have won because its, you know, FUN!

As for the flaw of pvp, I believe someone else has said it before in this thread and it bears repeating. The flaw is in the player behind the keyboard and nothing can be done to change people. The only flaw with pvp itself is ships need to be balanced a bit more. By balance I mean more nerfs and less buffs.

On a side note, many people in thread have said they hate 'grinding isk' and 'doing things they dont want to' in order to have fun. These same people should play on the test server where everything costs 100 isk. You can PVP all day everyday for 1 milion isk there. I'd be willing to bet within a day or two you will be back on Tranquility because the kills on the test server have zero meaning and are boring as hell.

I fall under "1) People with no static assets," but I still resent that.

edit, (@KrakizBad, and anyone else who cares) : And besides, who cares if they don't post with their main, if their responses are intelligent and well informed.

edit2, (back to reply): I would add a 4th option there too.

4) Just doesn't care.

Amelia, sounds like you should join a PvP oriented corp and go for those kills. The PvP part of the game is there for people like you, just as the PvE part is there for people like me.

I can sort of tolerate PvP if I can suppress the adrenaline reaction, staying cool and calm. Tried it last night (on an alt), sat in a gate camp and got in on a kill. Not the final blow, but was #2 damage doer.

Even so, today I do not feel that good.

And there's the biggest reason why people don't run down into null automatically. Its not the game. Its the people playing the game. The null sec pilots are the biggest reason to not become a null sec pilot. Who needs all that crap? Seriously.