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To CCP about Alpha vs Omega accounts

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Logan Revelore
Symbiotic Systems
#41 - 2016-12-15 18:53:53 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
TL;DR?

I'm guessing it's along the lines of "give alphas more free stuff".


Nah, it's really about making the game more appealing towards alphas and make them want more, but with out giving them anything that would actually make them able to compete against omegas. Apparently at the moment it feels more like a trial rather than a game for alphas.

Remember, due to the network effect, any players in a game is a valuable asset, whether they pay for the game or not, since the more people, the more likely they are to play. Just take old games like WoW, they're basically dead in terms of content and what they have to offer, but tons of people stick around just because other people are sticking around as well. The network effect.
Nat Silverguard
Aideron Robotics
Aideron Robotics.
#42 - 2016-12-15 19:35:42 UTC
Logan Revelore wrote:
Apparently at the moment it feels more like a trial rather than a game for alphas.


it is actually like that.

alphas gives newbros 'time' to learn the game that is difficult to do with the previous 12/21 days trial.

if you like the game, then sub up.

Just Add Water
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#43 - 2016-12-15 19:42:14 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
TL;DR?

I'm guessing it's along the lines of "give alphas more free stuff".


Yep, with a side of "more PVE please" to go along with it.

CCP has bee stuffing this game with PVE since I started playing (pve in 2007 was missions, cosmos, plexes static and non static, and belt rats), new AIO, new capabilities, new and better rewards.

And still people complain. This should be proof enough that no amount of Adding PVE is going to satisfy these types. And those of us who already like EVE's PVE know it has enough of it (most people who complain about PVE don't even PVE by the way, hell oook at how barren the Missions and Complexes forum usually is).

If Alphas want more to do, they should sub.
Ravas Geloris
Doomheim
#44 - 2016-12-15 20:07:35 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Scipio Artelius wrote:
TL;DR?

I'm guessing it's along the lines of "give alphas more free stuff".


Yep, with a side of "more PVE please" to go along with it.

CCP has bee stuffing this game with PVE since I started playing (pve in 2007 was missions, cosmos, plexes static and non static, and belt rats), new AIO, new capabilities, new and better rewards.

And still people complain. This should be proof enough that no amount of Adding PVE is going to satisfy these types. And those of us who already like EVE's PVE know it has enough of it (most people who complain about PVE don't even PVE by the way, hell oook at how barren the Missions and Complexes forum usually is).

If Alphas want more to do, they should sub.



WHAT?

"Stuffed with PVE" ?

What are you talking about.....?

CCP is ONLY doing something for PVP...way to much.....

There is the SAME pve mission pool since release and NOTING is done to update it or construct storylines around it.....

And even it it would be...you could BET some idiots that think they have the right to do so will try to hinder you due scanning out your mission spot and getting your mission critical item....

THIS is the problem....

There has to be a FORCE that hinders idiots to jump on your head and harras you in that way.....

Any non willing PVP or stealing critical loot or even scanning out a mission should be prohibited.....

No griefing in high.....


But i can hear the harrasment fans "i do it cause i can.Eve is a pvp game.....ect p.p.
For some people only THEIR way to play the game counts...all other players that don't share their strange hobby are just loosers that deserve disrespect,,,,,

Bullshit.....

One has to let the other play HIS game at least in high and should otherwise be punished with a ban.....

Bottom line.....
Ravas Geloris
Doomheim
#45 - 2016-12-15 20:13:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Ravas Geloris
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
PvP pervades the fundamental nature of EVE.

PvE exists, but is susceptible to PvP, at all times and all instances.

PvP underlies everything in EVE.



And exactly this has to be changed.....

Let the people play the game as they want to...and if that means non pvp flag than let this be so.....

No animals will be harmed during the filming...just the selfrespect of a couple of griefers will be cut.....and that's a good thing..... :-)
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#46 - 2016-12-15 20:17:17 UTC
Ravas Geloris wrote:
[


WHAT?

"Stuffed with PVE" ?

What are you talking about.....?

CCP is ONLY doing something for PVP...way to much.....


And this is untrue. Incursions (sansha and for a while, Drifter), Drifters, Burner missions. Clone soldiers. New complexes in 2011. Lvl 5 missions. Epic Arcs. Pirate Epic Arcs. Wormholes (sleepers). New loot since 2012 (like Gistum/Pithum invuls), Marauders (pve focused ships) etc etc.

There is the SAME pve mission pool since release and NOTING is done to update it or construct storylines around it.....[/quote]

So Dread Pirate Scarlet has been a missions since release?


Quote:

And even it it would be...you could BET some idiots that think they have the right to do so will try to hinder you due scanning out your mission spot and getting your mission critical item....

THIS is the problem....

There has to be a FORCE that hinders idiots to jump on your head and harras you in that way.....

Any non willing PVP or stealing critical loot or even scanning out a mission should be prohibited.....

No griefing in high.....


But i can hear the harrasment fans "i do it cause i can.Eve is a pvp game.....ect p.p.
For some people only THEIR way to play the game counts...all other players that don't share their strange hobby are just loosers that deserve disrespect,,,,,

Bullshit.....



One has to let the other play HIS game at least in high and should otherwise be punished with a ban.....

Bottom line.....


Your post is a pretty good example of what's wrong with 'carebears'.
Ravas Geloris
Doomheim
#47 - 2016-12-15 20:26:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Ravas Geloris
Jenn aSide wrote:
Ravas Geloris wrote:
[


WHAT?

"Stuffed with PVE" ?

What are you talking about.....?

CCP is ONLY doing something for PVP...way to much.....


And this is untrue. Incursions (sansha and for a while, Drifter), Drifters, Burner missions. Clone soldiers. New complexes in 2011. Lvl 5 missions. Epic Arcs. Pirate Epic Arcs. Wormholes (sleepers). New loot since 2012 (like Gistum/Pithum invuls), Marauders (pve focused ships) etc etc.

There is the SAME pve mission pool since release and NOTING is done to update it or construct storylines around it.....


So Dread Pirate Scarlet has been a missions since release?


Quote:

And even it it would be...you could BET some idiots that think they have the right to do so will try to hinder you due scanning out your mission spot and getting your mission critical item....

THIS is the problem....

There has to be a FORCE that hinders idiots to jump on your head and harras you in that way.....

Any non willing PVP or stealing critical loot or even scanning out a mission should be prohibited.....

No griefing in high.....


But i can hear the harrasment fans "i do it cause i can.Eve is a pvp game.....ect p.p.
For some people only THEIR way to play the game counts...all other players that don't share their strange hobby are just loosers that deserve disrespect,,,,,

Bullshit.....



One has to let the other play HIS game at least in high and should otherwise be punished with a ban.....

Bottom line.....


Your post is a pretty good example of what's wrong with 'carebears'.
[/quote]

And your post is a pretty good example for the disrespect of PVP players showing all other.......

"only our way to see the game counts" and if someone wants to play his way he is a "carebear" that just want to hinder me in playing the game "the right (my) way"......but "your" way is not "the" way and respecting other ways would be saying "hey...if he wants to do this he should be able even if that means i'm not allowed to shoot him".....

THIS would be respectful and i don't see ANY...not a single PVP player showing that respect.....

I know this look in the mirrow must hurt but i think it's a true sight of pvp here...they think the rule and have lost any contact to others......
Kolinthia Lincoln
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#48 - 2016-12-15 20:34:19 UTC
Alpha clones are fine the way they are - that said, the expansion advertised the game as free to play.. whereas it's really just a indefinite trial. Whether or not you agree, every single Alpha I've talked to says the same thing. And with the paywall literally in your face on every screen, it isn't attractive to new or returning players.
Clandestiny
Doomheim
#49 - 2016-12-15 20:45:31 UTC
Kolinthia Lincoln wrote:
Alpha clones are fine the way they are - that said, the expansion advertised the game as free to play.. whereas it's really just a indefinite trial. Whether or not you agree, every single Alpha I've talked to says the same thing. And with the paywall literally in your face on every screen, it isn't attractive to new or returning players.

+1 🎯

❤╫╟╖A╥╖K❤╙╢OU❤

🎯→🚀
Salvos Rhoska
#50 - 2016-12-15 20:56:47 UTC
Ravas Geloris wrote:
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
PvP pervades the fundamental nature of EVE.

PvE exists, but is susceptible to PvP, at all times and all instances.

PvP underlies everything in EVE.



And exactly this has to be changed.....

Let the people play the game as they want to...and if that means non pvp flag than let this be so.....

No animals will be harmed during the filming...just the selfrespect of a couple of griefers will be cut.....and that's a good thing..... :-)


You dont understand.

There is no escaping the fundamental nature of PVP in EVE, on a one shard server, in all its forms.

Check my link to help you internalize and conceptualize the nature of the game you are playing.

The entire ingame economy and the systemic nature of its existence depends upon this.

If you want to absolutely safely farm dailies, do so in WoW.
This will never be possible in EVE.

What you propose is anathema to this game, Its impossible.
It would destroy it, utterly. It cannot be done here.

If you want what you propose, I straight up tell you this is not the game for you.

PvE v PvP <> Old School Exploration <> CODE Licenses <> CODE Special Agent
Ravas Geloris
Doomheim
#51 - 2016-12-15 21:01:00 UTC
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
Ravas Geloris wrote:
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
PvP pervades the fundamental nature of EVE.

PvE exists, but is susceptible to PvP, at all times and all instances.

PvP underlies everything in EVE.



And exactly this has to be changed.....

Let the people play the game as they want to...and if that means non pvp flag than let this be so.....

No animals will be harmed during the filming...just the selfrespect of a couple of griefers will be cut.....and that's a good thing..... :-)


You dont understand.

There is no escaping the fundamental nature of PVP in EVE, on a one shard server, in all its forms.

Check my link to help you internalize and conceptualize the nature of the game you are playing.

The entire ingame economy and the systemic nature of its existence depends upon this.

If you want to absolutely safely farm dailies, do so in WoW.
This will never be possible in EVE.

What you propose is anathema to this game, Its impossible.
It would destroy it, utterly. It cannot be done here.

If you want what you propose, I straight up tell you this is not the game for you.



Certainly there is one...it its called "non pvp flagging"....but just mentioning that let others jump bareassed right in your face.......

Part of the problem here.....
Salvos Rhoska
#52 - 2016-12-15 21:13:39 UTC
Cannot and will not ever happen.

What you are proposing, is as impossible as Blizzard suddenly allowing unrestricted PvP and asset destruction in WoW.

As much as I and many others might hope for that, it would be financial and playerbase suicide for Blizzard.

PvE v PvP <> Old School Exploration <> CODE Licenses <> CODE Special Agent
SurrenderMonkey
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#53 - 2016-12-15 21:16:59 UTC
Ravas Geloris wrote:
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
Ravas Geloris wrote:
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
PvP pervades the fundamental nature of EVE.

PvE exists, but is susceptible to PvP, at all times and all instances.

PvP underlies everything in EVE.



And exactly this has to be changed.....

Let the people play the game as they want to...and if that means non pvp flag than let this be so.....

No animals will be harmed during the filming...just the selfrespect of a couple of griefers will be cut.....and that's a good thing..... :-)


You dont understand.

There is no escaping the fundamental nature of PVP in EVE, on a one shard server, in all its forms.

Check my link to help you internalize and conceptualize the nature of the game you are playing.

The entire ingame economy and the systemic nature of its existence depends upon this.

If you want to absolutely safely farm dailies, do so in WoW.
This will never be possible in EVE.

What you propose is anathema to this game, Its impossible.
It would destroy it, utterly. It cannot be done here.

If you want what you propose, I straight up tell you this is not the game for you.



Certainly there is one...it its called "non pvp flagging"....but just mentioning that let others jump bareassed right in your face.......

Part of the problem here.....


I'm betting Chess players would also be averse to having the rules of Chess changed to be more like Checkers.

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
Clandestiny
Doomheim
#54 - 2016-12-15 21:17:24 UTC
Ravas Geloris wrote:
Certainly there is one...it its called "non pvp flagging"....but just mentioning that let others jump bareassed right in your face.......

Part of the problem here.....

CCP should create a wall of shame 😡.

Pilot A was too 🐓💩 to fight an armed 🚀 so he killed an unarmed 🚢 instead.

🐣's can go either way depending on the circumstances 🎲.

❤╫╟╖A╥╖K❤╙╢OU❤

🎯→🚀
Salvos Rhoska
#55 - 2016-12-15 21:20:47 UTC
Clandestiny wrote:
Ravas Geloris wrote:
Certainly there is one...it its called "non pvp flagging"....but just mentioning that let others jump bareassed right in your face.......

Part of the problem here.....

CCP should create a wall of shame 😡.

Pilot A was too 🐓💩 to fight an armed 🚀 so he killed an unarmed 🚢 instead.

🐣's can go either way depending on the circumstances 🎲.


Im undecided whom is worse.
Him with his ridiculous trolling to destroy EVE, or you with your ridiculous emoji spam.

I hate you both, lets settle at that.

PvE v PvP <> Old School Exploration <> CODE Licenses <> CODE Special Agent
Clandestiny
Doomheim
#56 - 2016-12-15 22:00:39 UTC
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
I hate you both, lets settle at that.

Hate is such a strong word.

You can 🐇 your 😋🐴 right on out of here!

❤╫╟╖A╥╖K❤╙╢OU❤

🎯→🚀
StonerPhReaK
Herb Men
#57 - 2016-12-15 23:16:46 UTC  |  Edited by: StonerPhReaK
Salvos Rhoska wrote:


Im undecided whom is worse.
Him with his ridiculous trolling to destroy EVE, or you with your ridiculous emoji spam.

I hate you both, lets settle at that.


Cant take either serious that's for sure.

Signatures wer cooler when we couldn't remove them completely.
Sarren Sap
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#58 - 2016-12-15 23:32:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Sarren Sap
I think CCP got it abit wrong in the means to expand the customer base.

the trial format before isnt a bad mean, just that it's too short and lacks proper tutorial.

ccp should do a little bit pressure cooking in marketing mechanic. With 5m sp cap, for a normal alpha to decide is TOO long, it will take months to even get to 3m mark, if an alpha gonna go Omega they already did before this milestone, if they have'nt, they aint pay the game anyway.

And dont be fooled by the stat, 8/9 out of 10 alpha clone are probably old timers who had quited the game. It aint getting your customer base expanded.

You need to let the newbies to feel there's hope for a better reward quick before they lose interest.

CCP would be better to lower the sp cap, say to 2.5/3m sp mark, but relax a bit on the skill and mod requirement, to maximize the expereince of an alpha, just keep the cruiser cap, so alpha can do whatever under the 2.5m sp and cruiser class cap to let them explore the game more freely. Effectively this is a modified free trial of 3 months....

And CCP can introduce another transitional clone state, say beta/gamma clone, to give access to more skill point and ship class for a lower rate or a one time fee. So it's a a la carte state.
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#59 - 2016-12-15 23:59:19 UTC
Ravas Geloris wrote:

There is the SAME pve mission pool since release and NOTING is done to update it or construct storylines around it.....



I regret to inform you that you're mistaken.

When Eve started, it didn't have missions. All Isk was gained by belt ratting.

The First expansion to Eve added Missions. Castor.

Missions have been added on an irregular basis thereafter.

Additional content is being added as time passes. A recent example is the addition of the NPC mining fleets.



As for your mention later of a non-pvp flag, that's against the core DNA of Eve. Where Death is a serious business. (Which is pretty much the mission statement for Eve) You can take steps to protect yourself, but you're always at _some_ degree of risk.

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Grymmstorm
Kings of Groth
#60 - 2016-12-16 06:48:04 UTC
Val Kaleth wrote:
I am also a returning player, and I am returning because of Alpha actually. I cannot always drop the giant wad of cash it would take to keep all my EVE accounts up anymore, so I moved away from it in favor of games I only need 1 account for. Now it isn't that I do not feel the game is worth it, because it was well worth every subscription I paid for in the past. BUT having alpha lets me stay in the game easier and choose accounts to omega or PLEX.

I am thankful for what is offered and enjoy what I have. In the end I see alpha as being the perfect way to keep me interested in the game and encourage me to spend my money here rather than elsewhere. CCP just got more money from me this way than they would have keeping the old model.

They give alphas more than enough to experience the game in most ways, and it holds back enough to give you the urge to pay. It is also careful not to give alphas things that can be exploited easily. This model gives people unlimited time to test out the game without feeling the pressure of paying for something they may not like, and we all know that EVE can take time to learn. So I hope this helps get people really into the game and interested in paying for a subscription that supports the game. (added PvE would help this a LOT)

I tried to read this entire thread but didn't, so I apologize if this was already said, but I felt the need to jump in and say it. I missed out on a lot of EVE because of feeling like I needed ALL my accounts active to enjoy it, and now that is not as big of an issue. I am also getting into it much deeper than I ever did because I no longer have the fear of "yikes I may not be able to keep paying all my subs"


Well, I agree with you on the whole point of being afraid you can't afford all of your accounts, so Alpha is nice in that respect. However, CCP has actually lost a lot of income from me since introducing Alphas. I dropped all my subs except one since I can still use them for some stuff. I still have one sub, but might be dropping it as well. After dropping the other subs, I find I have more free time to do other stuff, and I don't feel pressured into playing a ton to get my money's worth. I'm actually contemplating dropping my last sub, and then just login a couple times a month to do some small PVP roam or something. There are very few people still around that I've flown with in the past, the game has gotten boring, and without the friendships it just isn't as fun anymore.