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[December] Excavator Mining Drone yield rebalance

First post First post First post
Author
Nivek Steyer
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#281 - 2016-12-09 03:03:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Nivek Steyer
CCP: Its amazing how fast you give out the best miner in eve, handicap the drones with speed then nerf the bonus. How about increasing the moon mins so that everyone can mine them. I mean fair is fair right so lets come out with something for moon mining in HS. Why not Moon T2 products are manipulated by every 0.0 alliance, at all. Wow, sad you all don't see that having people get cheaper ships would be more fun for all. More PvP for us all. I remember a time when CCP said that T2 should only be 2x the cost of a T1. I think that was lost in the bubble and 0.0 was used to cash cow afk mining. Don't you think Alpha clones would love to fly cheaper ships, more fun, and less grind for all. Cheers! Oh, and its time to get rid of the T3 cruiser skill loss. No reason at all anymore to loose skill points. CCP please come on, you get something out that is great and then you kill it. 6 years to fix the rorqual and what less than 2 weeks to nerf it. Outstanding! Cheers!
Sharasa
Royal Manticoran Excavation
#282 - 2016-12-09 03:41:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Sharasa
Way to go CCP. Do you honestly think you've given enough time to evaluate risk vs reward???

I haven't even had a chance to outfit my Rorqual that I bought before you made this change. You didn't even allow enough time for observation for the many players like me to go out and lose their multibillion isk ship. The Rorqual losses were going to happen.

The mega corps get these first and they are the best protected... DUH

Morons...
Lotus Rose
Lotus Industrial Collective
Goonswarm Federation
#283 - 2016-12-09 03:53:55 UTC
For your reading pleasure

~ An hour in the life of a mining rorqual.

Undock in an ungodly expensive space brick with drones which cost more than a carrier, each.
Align and warp somewhere with rocks to mine.
Eventually arrive.
Realise that the closest unmined rock is 30k away, start to move in that direction.
Sigh and warp back to a place you can actually dock your space brick and fit some kind of module which makes you go faster.
Eventually arrive back in the busy place that rocks go to die.
Find a free space rock, start the journey in the direction.
Try to start slowing the brick, frantically pressing control space.
Bounce off the looming space rock.
Sigh and reposition. Launch the scary expensive drones.
Manically check local and intel channels for the 20th time, finger hovering over the indy core.
Tell yourself that it is all going to be ok.
Push the button. Briefly wonder if you are bad because you clicked it. A clicker. Going to hell now.
Watch the slowest drones in the universe as they bumble to the selected rock.
Check intel again.
Rats spawn. Look to see who is getting the business. Realise that no one is going to kill them.Pull in the slow mining buddies, sigh, kill the rats.
Watch as someone loots the faction spawn.
Heart races as you read about the command destroyers coming to steal the carrier priced peanut sized little miners that are finally arriving at the rock.
Decycle the indy core... just in case.
The threat is close, pull the drones back into the nest.
Wait a while, with much checking that the coast is clear.
Notice that another mining behemoth has drifted close to you and has cheekily started mining the rock you spent an age approaching with murder in your heart.
Sigh and approach another rock. Decide to activate indy core as you decelerate. Realise that your mining brick is slowing, well, very slowly.
Bounce off the rock and wait out the rest of the indy core timer as you drift further and further away.
Watch as your little drones take a painfully long time to make it back to you to deposit their goodness as you float into the distance.
Sigh, wait out the timer and reposition.
Scratch head wondering why all the little barges are approaching you. Get reproached for not making your fleet hangar open so that they can use you to reprocess their ores. Hide all your things in the cargo bay. Don't want people touching your stuff.
Stare at the screen blankly as the rock pops and the drones return to you, dancing about in glee. Realise that the rock had been mined almost to death and left to linger.
Sigh. Warp back to that place, you know, where you can get a rock scanner. Refit.
Make it back to the place where rorquals go to die.
Look around, attempt to use the rock scanner and accidently press the cyno. Short lived relief that it wasn't the panic module followed by horror due to the reaction of everyone around you. Reassure everyone. Resolve to never make that mistake again. Until next time.
Sigh. Wait out the timer. See some space rocks around you popping.
See the cyno finally decycle and feel proud that at least it didn't go into the humiliating second cycle.
Look for a rock to mine, realise that there are only mercoxit rocks left.
Launch yourself at the closest one, wondering where all the other mining rorquals went.
Position. Indy core. Can't mine that mercoxit with these here drones.
Sigh. Wait out timer. Pick finger nails. Check intel for the 131st time.
Head to a place where you can park your fat bottomed mining goddess and get into a procurer to mine the mercoxit after being berated for not cleaning mercoxit up.
Well folks, that's the end of the tale now as clearly, there isn't a rorqual to discuss anymore. Thanks for bearing with me.

These may or may not be actual events related to actual miners with actual miner rage.
Doggy Dogwoofwoof
The Blind Spot
#284 - 2016-12-09 04:04:42 UTC
Again guys, CCP either A, Forgot Mining Rigs existed; Or B, changed the drone interfacing skill into a double damage bonus in their heads. They now have their stated yield.
Sharasa
Royal Manticoran Excavation
#285 - 2016-12-09 04:05:24 UTC
Lotus Rose wrote:
For your reading pleasure

~ An hour in the life of a mining rorqual.

Undock in an ungodly expensive space brick with drones which cost more than a carrier, each.
Align and warp somewhere with rocks to mine.
Eventually arrive.
Realise that the closest unmined rock is 30k away, start to move in that direction.
Sigh and warp back to a place you can actually dock your space brick and fit some kind of module which makes you go faster.
Eventually arrive back in the busy place that rocks go to die.
Find a free space rock, start the journey in the direction.
Try to start slowing the brick, frantically pressing control space.
Bounce off the looming space rock.
Sigh and reposition. Launch the scary expensive drones.
Manically check local and intel channels for the 20th time, finger hovering over the indy core.
Tell yourself that it is all going to be ok.
Push the button. Briefly wonder if you are bad because you clicked it. A clicker. Going to hell now.
Watch the slowest drones in the universe as they bumble to the selected rock.
Check intel again.
Rats spawn. Look to see who is getting the business. Realise that no one is going to kill them.Pull in the slow mining buddies, sigh, kill the rats.
Watch as someone loots the faction spawn.
Heart races as you read about the command destroyers coming to steal the carrier priced peanut sized little miners that are finally arriving at the rock.
Decycle the indy core... just in case.
The threat is close, pull the drones back into the nest.
Wait a while, with much checking that the coast is clear.
Notice that another mining behemoth has drifted close to you and has cheekily started mining the rock you spent an age approaching with murder in your heart.
Sigh and approach another rock. Decide to activate indy core as you decelerate. Realise that your mining brick is slowing, well, very slowly.
Bounce off the rock and wait out the rest of the indy core timer as you drift further and further away.
Watch as your little drones take a painfully long time to make it back to you to deposit their goodness as you float into the distance.
Sigh, wait out the timer and reposition.
Scratch head wondering why all the little barges are approaching you. Get reproached for not making your fleet hangar open so that they can use you to reprocess their ores. Hide all your things in the cargo bay. Don't want people touching your stuff.
Stare at the screen blankly as the rock pops and the drones return to you, dancing about in glee. Realise that the rock had been mined almost to death and left to linger.
Sigh. Warp back to that place, you know, where you can get a rock scanner. Refit.
Make it back to the place where rorquals go to die.
Look around, attempt to use the rock scanner and accidently press the cyno. Short lived relief that it wasn't the panic module followed by horror due to the reaction of everyone around you. Reassure everyone. Resolve to never make that mistake again. Until next time.
Sigh. Wait out the timer. See some space rocks around you popping.
See the cyno finally decycle and feel proud that at least it didn't go into the humiliating second cycle.
Look for a rock to mine, realise that there are only mercoxit rocks left.
Launch yourself at the closest one, wondering where all the other mining rorquals went.
Position. Indy core. Can't mine that mercoxit with these here drones.
Sigh. Wait out timer. Pick finger nails. Check intel for the 131st time.
Head to a place where you can park your fat bottomed mining goddess and get into a procurer to mine the mercoxit after being berated for not cleaning mercoxit up.
Well folks, that's the end of the tale now as clearly, there isn't a rorqual to discuss anymore. Thanks for bearing with me.

These may or may not be actual events related to actual miners with actual miner rage.



Awesome ^ That's about right I'm sure
Lotus Rose
Lotus Industrial Collective
Goonswarm Federation
#286 - 2016-12-09 04:38:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Lotus Rose
I finally escaped being stuck in a bubble where the main highlight was getting to watch a rorqual transform. So many new things to bounce off of.

CCPLS make some of the rocks shoot back, My eyes start to get so heavy, watching the hypnotising excavator drones swaying around.

Ore (hah sorry, couldn't resist) end rorqual rage by giving them their own doomsday devices, which can only be used against other rorquals. Survival of the fittest, fastest, fattest.

#rorquallivesmatter
Vald Tegor
Empyrean Guard
Tactical Narcotics Team
#287 - 2016-12-09 05:21:54 UTC
Tarsas Phage wrote:

At any rate, one doesn't counter neuts with low slot capacitor mods, bro. CPRs might work against your daily nemesis the Blood Raiders, but not against the possibility of multiple staggered heavy/capital neuts alpha'ing your cap. I guess you really tricked us there, as the only neuts of consequence on grid were our alts :laffo:

Man it's so hard to manage the cap. Must be balanced. Good thing the industrial core prevents incoming remote capacitor transfers eh?
Nessto Lombardi
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#288 - 2016-12-09 05:41:54 UTC
32% seems a bit harsh.

As the citadels have better refine.

More reduction to material cost.

This increased mining shouldn't get cut alone. Maybe hit each area with a 10%
PANZER1233000
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#289 - 2016-12-09 05:56:36 UTC
WTF CCP you broke constant "isk vs reward" 32% nerf kill this profeshion if you don't have t2 all 5 fit and rorqual in 5. You make again **** in balance, and forgot you mistake in capital rebalance "we want another chose in first capital question - dread or carr" again be in sige 5 min lose vs be free for move.
PANZER1233000
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#290 - 2016-12-09 06:44:18 UTC
MightyGuy wrote:
ANOTHER FOZZIE WONDERFUL idea... . we finally get some love for the miners and leave it to fozzie to skullf**k it so hard. The only patch i want to see is "Fozzie quits Eve" i think the population would jump 20% in eve. 32% nerf.. Jesus is that nerf bat heavy,, are you able to pick it up by yourself?

Please .... .fozzie.... quit

This is just another way the ccp screws its players. People have invested heavily into roquals and drones. Now you look at it and see Wow they really enjoy this.. We cant have that ... we are ccp. I swear ccp's Montra that is painted on every wall in the office.

IF ITS NOT BROKE FIX IT TILL IT IS.

Fozzy don't undestand rig module specialization (+40% mining yeld) have problem - rorqual lose tank, and be easy target after 7.5 min, his have reward for it.
Strykr X
Infernal Armada
#291 - 2016-12-09 06:58:58 UTC
I don't know if this has been mentioned before Roll, but this nerf is bullshit.
Anthar Thebess
#292 - 2016-12-09 08:34:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Anthar Thebess
God hate miners.
Kids hate miners.
CODE hate miners.
CCP (finally) hate miners.

GJ.

Please work on this 7min invul super point thingy - it is broken as hell.
Instead of increasing drop rates of this drone materials - increase spawn rate of signatures that them drop all around eve.
It is always better when more things are moving.
regretfully gentle
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#293 - 2016-12-09 10:30:05 UTC  |  Edited by: regretfully gentle
CCP are like the British Government...

Protect the mega corporations at all costs and screw the little ones who invested a significant percentage of their GDP in Rorquals in NullSec and WH space in good faith...

Mega Corps purchased dozens of Rorquals and made their investment back within hours.

Small corps just lost their investment.

Hisec carebears just won again. If I wasn't allergic to HiSec I would go there to make isk - but I break out in a rash everytime I go there.

Hows about you nerf the range of Jump Freighters, decrease the mining yield of the drones by 20% and increase their base speed.

Just show a little less of the "knee jerk reaction" and give the current model more time? Oh any implement hard ass drifters that spawn in roid belts or anoms if there are more than 5 Rorquals on grid? These bad ass drifters then target the Rorquals and **** them up wholesale? That's a MUCH more fun way of restricting the dirty multi-boxing mofo's...

So yeh - I VOTE bad ass invading Drifter's spawning to kill Rorquals as soon as there are 5 on grid. And they are equipped with the "KEEP CALM AND CARRY ON" module that disables the PANIC module.
Hisana
Perkone
Caldari State
#294 - 2016-12-09 11:41:23 UTC
I don't like this update at all.

The Rorqual and its drones should be very expensive. There should be a huge risk involved in using them. With this update you remove that risk completely. Isn't EVE supposed to be a risk vs. reward game? We just had that and you're taking it away.
Lotus Rose
Lotus Industrial Collective
Goonswarm Federation
#295 - 2016-12-09 11:51:04 UTC
Hisana wrote:
I don't like this update at all.

The Rorqual and its drones should be very expensive. There should be a huge risk involved in using them. With this update you remove that risk completely. Isn't EVE supposed to be a risk vs. reward game? We just had that and you're taking it away.


It's ok, they're taking away 32% of the reward too. Maybe they'll balance each other out.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#296 - 2016-12-09 11:57:03 UTC
Its astonishing the number of people who didn't see this coming months ago.
Maria Senseye
Doomheim
#297 - 2016-12-09 12:01:59 UTC
It's a game and it should be played as a game not like 2nd life for some of you. Indeed ... the Rorqual received some massive bonuses on mining drones, but that wasn't its scope after all! Somebody from CCP did a mistake, a huge one!

Rorqual description is:
Quote:
The Rorqual was conceived and designed by Outer Ring Excavations in response to a growing need for capital industry platforms with the ability to support and sustain large-scale mining operations in uninhabited areas of space.

To that end, the Rorqual's primary strength lies in its ability to grind raw ores into particles of smaller size than possible before, while still maintaining their distinctive molecular structure. This means the vessel is able to carry vast amounts of ore in compressed form.

Additionally, the Rorqual is able to fit a capital tractor beam unit, capable of pulling in cargo containers from far greater distances and at far greater speeds than smaller beams can. It also possesses a sizeable drone bay, jump drive capability and the capacity to fit a clone vat bay. This combination of elements makes the Rorqual the ideal nexus to build deep space mining operations around.

Due to its specialization towards industrial operations, its ship maintenance bay is able to accommodate only industrial ships, mining barges and their tech 2 variants.



So ... this ship should not mine by it's own, panic module was invented for a reason ... I would love to see large mining fleets (barges) with huge boosts provided by ongrid rorquals, that is the objective of this ship! To provide assistance (panic module), mining boosts (better than current ones) and ore storage/compression ... like an Orca in hisec. CCP took a step further like they always do and provide huge mining capabilities to lone rorquals, didn't worked that way ... nullsec alliances simply mine with these capital ships and they're hundreds of them! The effect ? Big hit into economy prices and ships.

Rorquals have the new PANIC module which renders an entire mining fleet invulnerable for several minutes, enough for the alliance buddies to bridge in and sustain alliance mining operations. This ship drones didn't helped real miners, it just forced ratters to go mining cause it's simple and more profitable than killing NPC's!


CCPlease do something to encourage player interraction at any level, mining is the core of EVE - it should be treated accordingly! Miners should have a boost, a real boost ... not like this stupid thing! Encourage fleets and player-to-player interraction!

Trevize Demerzel
#298 - 2016-12-09 13:03:02 UTC
Lotus Rose wrote:
Hisana wrote:
I don't like this update at all.

The Rorqual and its drones should be very expensive. There should be a huge risk involved in using them. With this update you remove that risk completely. Isn't EVE supposed to be a risk vs. reward game? We just had that and you're taking it away.


It's ok, they're taking away 32% of the reward too. Maybe they'll balance each other out.



How is the risk removed? Rorq's are still stuck for 5 minutes in industrial mode. Zkill has lots of Rorq's being killed every day. I see large gangs every night out killing Rorq's, they are quite effective at it. Kuddos to them for jumping on these changes and becoming very effective at Rorq hunting. Rorq's have a big fat target painted all over them. The 7 minute P.A.N.I.C. module hasn't appeared to be useful in its' intended mode. Works great for the hic rorq, but I've yet to see a [mining] Rorq pilot saved in the 7 minutes.

Anyway, I think CCP has a lot of balancing work to do with Rorq's. The 32% nerf to the drones seems extreme..... I'm annoyed by it and I think it is wrong. That said, I expected a nerf to the mining amount, but felt it should come with a balance. My thought was a 10-12% nerf with a reduction on the cycle time of the Industrial Core and reduced Heavy Water consumption to offset the reduced cycle time. It's too easy to tackle a Rorq. Even with all the intel in the world and a pilot that is paying attention to every system around. The Rorq is an easy target as can been seen by the killboards.

-

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#299 - 2016-12-09 13:10:27 UTC
Trevize Demerzel wrote:



How is the risk removed? Rorq's are still stuck for 5 minutes in industrial mode. Zkill has lots of Rorq's being killed every day. I see large gangs every night out killing Rorq's, they are quite effective at it. Kuddos to them for jumping on these changes and becoming very effective at Rorq hunting. Rorq's have a big fat target painted all over them. The 7 minute P.A.N.I.C. module hasn't appeared to be useful in its' intended mode. Works great for the hic rorq, but I've yet to see a [mining] Rorq pilot saved in the 7 minutes.


You dont see it because zkill doesn't show the ones that live.

Trevize Demerzel wrote:

Anyway, I think CCP has a lot of balancing work to do with Rorq's. The 32% nerf to the drones seems extreme..... I'm annoyed by it and I think it is wrong. That said, I expected a nerf to the mining amount, but felt it should come with a balance. My thought was a 10-12% nerf with a reduction on the cycle time of the Industrial Core and reduced Heavy Water consumption to offset the reduced cycle time. It's too easy to tackle a Rorq. Even with all the intel in the world and a pilot that is paying attention to every system around. The Rorq is an easy target as can been seen by the killboards.



They got the numbers backwards, this isn't a nerf its a fix to that mistake they made.
barkaway
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#300 - 2016-12-09 15:00:56 UTC


Trevize Demerzel wrote:

Anyway, I think CCP has a lot of balancing work to do with Rorq's. The 32% nerf to the drones seems extreme..... I'm annoyed by it and I think it is wrong. That said, I expected a nerf to the mining amount, but felt it should come with a balance. My thought was a 10-12% nerf with a reduction on the cycle time of the Industrial Core and reduced Heavy Water consumption to offset the reduced cycle time. It's too easy to tackle a Rorq. Even with all the intel in the world and a pilot that is paying attention to every system around. The Rorq is an easy target as can been seen by the killboards.



They got the numbers backwards, this isn't a nerf its a fix to that mistake they made. [/quote]

Well then they should come out and say that they made a mistake, instead they give us some sad excuse.

Yes i know it takes balls to admit that you made a mistake, but at least the show that they have them, by giving us a sad excuse, they prove that they don't have them and that makes people even more pissed.