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How to get into loans?

Author
Brock Khanz
Doomheim
#1 - 2016-12-08 21:58:59 UTC
Recently returned player with ~30b in my pocket. As I pursue other ventures I'd like to make some isk, loans are something that has always intrigued me.

How exactly do you get into them?
What 3rd party services are used (saw something about using a player named Grendell for collateral holding?)
How do you vet the person you are potentially lending to?
And finally what are the acceptable interest rates?
RAW23
#2 - 2016-12-08 22:09:12 UTC
Brock Khanz wrote:
Recently returned player with ~30b in my pocket. As I pursue other ventures I'd like to make some isk, loans are something that has always intrigued me.

How exactly do you get into them?
What 3rd party services are used (saw something about using a player named Grendell for collateral holding?)
How do you vet the person you are potentially lending to?
And finally what are the acceptable interest rates?


If you are lending against collateral you don't need to vet the borrower, just the third party who will be holding the collateral on your behalf. The point of this setup is that there is nothing the borrower can do to scam you in this situation as your exposure is to the third party instead. Your risk, then, is that the third party might scam (as Darknesss did recently). When using a third party the normal interest rates you can expect are between 1.5 and 3% per month (normally the lower end). You can also make direct uncollateralised loans. These are considerably riskier and here you do have to do the vetting work yourself (if this is what you are interested in I can link you a rough guide to making risk assessments). For uncollateralised loans you can expect returns of between 1.5% and about 10% typically, depending on what the borrower is willing to offer and how risky they are perceived to be.

Historically, the main third parties used for large loans (100bil plus) on MD have been Chribba and Grendell. A few other people also have a history acting as third parties, although typically for smaller amounts, including myself, Vaerah Vahrokha (VV) and Elizabeth Norn. Both VV and Grendell are either inactive or have dialled back their activity in this field. As far as I know, Chribba is still doing the large deals.

To find borrowers, either make a post saying you are looking to lend isk and wait for customers to come to you, or keep your eye on MD posts and get in quickly on the 'bluechip' offerings. The riskier, uncollateralised loans you will tend to have a bit more time with as they don't fill as fast because potential lenders and MD regulars do the 'due diligence' vetting work first by asking questions in their threads.

There are two types of EVE player:

those who believe there are two types of EVE player and those who do not.

Brock Khanz
Doomheim
#3 - 2016-12-08 22:25:19 UTC
I appreciate the thorough reply, I'd love to see that guide on vetting people and any other info you have, seems you have quite the rep here.
RAW23
#4 - 2016-12-08 22:48:43 UTC
The basics of making a risk assessment are here:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=6719171#post6719171

If you are lending uncollateralised you'll also want to do things like fact check as much of the prospective borrower's claims as possible and, ideally, go through their posting history (using evesearch) to get a sense of their character and to see whether they are a fan of nefarious activities. Also check whether the character has recently been sold and see if anything just doesn't add up (e.g. just sold a different character for 50bil but claiming they desperately need 10bil to start trading). If you have questions about anything, ask them in their thread and see how they respond. Remember to stay polite when doing this. It is normally impossible to be certain if someone is going to scam so even if you think it's likely don't make accusations that can't be 100% backed up.

There are two types of EVE player:

those who believe there are two types of EVE player and those who do not.

The Fukuzawa
New Eden Trade Group
#5 - 2016-12-08 22:56:05 UTC
Just do the opposite of what i do and you will be successful bahhaha

! ! ! New Eden Trade Group is paying monthly interest to investors, contact me if interested ! ! !

If you already assume we are scammers without looking at what we offer objectively, go ahead and F*** off.

Thank you, that is all.

RAW23
#6 - 2016-12-08 23:02:33 UTC
The Fukuzawa wrote:
Just do the opposite of what i do and you will be successful bahhaha


He wants to lend isk, not borrow Blink

There are two types of EVE player:

those who believe there are two types of EVE player and those who do not.

The Fukuzawa
New Eden Trade Group
#7 - 2016-12-08 23:29:21 UTC
RAW23 wrote:
The Fukuzawa wrote:
Just do the opposite of what i do and you will be successful bahhaha


He wants to lend isk, not borrow Blink



No sh*t sherlock

! ! ! New Eden Trade Group is paying monthly interest to investors, contact me if interested ! ! !

If you already assume we are scammers without looking at what we offer objectively, go ahead and F*** off.

Thank you, that is all.

RAW23
#8 - 2016-12-08 23:35:06 UTC
The Fukuzawa wrote:
RAW23 wrote:
The Fukuzawa wrote:
Just do the opposite of what i do and you will be successful bahhaha


He wants to lend isk, not borrow Blink



No sh*t sherlock


Oh! You've been unsuccessful at lending as well as borrowing? My condolences. Some guys just can't get a break.

There are two types of EVE player:

those who believe there are two types of EVE player and those who do not.

The Fukuzawa
New Eden Trade Group
#9 - 2016-12-09 01:01:06 UTC
RAW23 wrote:
The Fukuzawa wrote:
RAW23 wrote:
The Fukuzawa wrote:
Just do the opposite of what i do and you will be successful bahhaha


He wants to lend isk, not borrow Blink



No sh*t sherlock


Oh! You've been unsuccessful at lending as well as borrowing? My condolences. Some guys just can't get a break.


bahahaha

! ! ! New Eden Trade Group is paying monthly interest to investors, contact me if interested ! ! !

If you already assume we are scammers without looking at what we offer objectively, go ahead and F*** off.

Thank you, that is all.

Grendell
Technologies Unlimited
#10 - 2016-12-10 03:51:03 UTC
RAW23 wrote:
Brock Khanz wrote:
Recently returned player with ~30b in my pocket. As I pursue other ventures I'd like to make some isk, loans are something that has always intrigued me.

How exactly do you get into them?
What 3rd party services are used (saw something about using a player named Grendell for collateral holding?)
How do you vet the person you are potentially lending to?
And finally what are the acceptable interest rates?


If you are lending against collateral you don't need to vet the borrower, just the third party who will be holding the collateral on your behalf. The point of this setup is that there is nothing the borrower can do to scam you in this situation as your exposure is to the third party instead. Your risk, then, is that the third party might scam (as Darknesss did recently). When using a third party the normal interest rates you can expect are between 1.5 and 3% per month (normally the lower end). You can also make direct uncollateralised loans. These are considerably riskier and here you do have to do the vetting work yourself (if this is what you are interested in I can link you a rough guide to making risk assessments). For uncollateralised loans you can expect returns of between 1.5% and about 10% typically, depending on what the borrower is willing to offer and how risky they are perceived to be.

Historically, the main third parties used for large loans (100bil plus) on MD have been Chribba and Grendell. A few other people also have a history acting as third parties, although typically for smaller amounts, including myself, Vaerah Vahrokha (VV) and Elizabeth Norn. Both VV and Grendell are either inactive or have dialled back their activity in this field. As far as I know, Chribba is still doing the large deals.

To find borrowers, either make a post saying you are looking to lend isk and wait for customers to come to you, or keep your eye on MD posts and get in quickly on the 'bluechip' offerings. The riskier, uncollateralised loans you will tend to have a bit more time with as they don't fill as fast because potential lenders and MD regulars do the 'due diligence' vetting work first by asking questions in their threads.



Confirming I am taking time off from 3rd party work, to enjoy the simpler things in game for the time being. I suspect I'll start accepting work in roughly 2 months.Smile

◄[♥]►3rd Party Service◄[♥]►

♥ Securing Peace of mind ♥

Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#11 - 2016-12-10 10:09:10 UTC
On smaller loans you can offer to hold the collateral yourself (so no third party involved).

This works best where the collateral is worth about 105-115% of the loan amount, and where the loan amount is of the order 1b-10b.

I've borrowed on that basis many times when I have needed short term liquidity. Each time the lender *could* have refused to return the collateral, but doing so would have only made them a small profit.

If loans on that basis hit 30-50b, the lender defaulting on the loan agreement by selling the collateral becomes a credible risk.

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