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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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Alpha Clone Feedback

Author
Kaendra Udan
Late Night Emissions
#1 - 2016-12-06 00:46:00 UTC
Okay, I have been going through the work of building myself and my corporation from the ground up, as an Alpha Clone.

A little bit of feedback and suggestions for you.

In my mind, Alphas should have all the basic functionality of EVE, but not the advanced functionality.

They should be able to fly T1 ships perfectly, with anything less than a T2 (or higher) module fitted. Their skills should support this. Right now they are very hobbled, by design I am sure, so I am hoping that improvements are coming.


Suggestions:

  1. Corporation Management should not be limited to level 1, you should increase that to level 5. (reasoning is that you want people to be drawn into corporations that interest them, which will keep them interested, and I am not finding many Omega clones that are interested in an Alpha corp)
  2. If you are dead set on keeping Alphas limited to Frigates, Destroyers and Cruisers, you should allow them to fully skill up all supporting skills, as if people aren't having fun, they aren't going to stick around...and always struggling to do anything, even as a group, isn't fun, especially knowing that your limitation is basic skill limitations.


To those naysayers that say "Just upgrade to Omega", once again, in my mind Omega should be what you go for to expand above basic game play...flying T2 ships, running mega corporations, owning tracts of space, et.al., not doing the things that are trying to "hook" you into playing EVE more.

Other than that, I like Alpha and the New Player Experience as well.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#2 - 2016-12-06 01:37:08 UTC
Kaendra Udan wrote:
In my mind, Alphas should have all the basic functionality of EVE, but not the advanced functionality.




no it shouldn't alpha is nothing more than an indefinite trial do not confuse it as more than that.


ever heard beggars can't be choosers?
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#3 - 2016-12-06 03:01:06 UTC
Pretty sure its not lack of SP that's keeping you from having fun. There are alpha corps forming all over the place, Null included.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Lugh Crow-Slave
#4 - 2016-12-06 04:29:55 UTC
i have alphas flying with me all the time seem to be having heaps of fun
Laendra
Universalis Imperium
Goonswarm Federation
#5 - 2016-12-06 04:42:36 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:

no it shouldn't alpha is nothing more than an indefinite trial do not confuse it as more than that.


No it isn't. I am on Alpha clone at the moment, and I have a hell of a lot more skill points than a trial account ever would P
Lugh Crow-Slave
#6 - 2016-12-06 04:45:09 UTC
and yet you can actually do less than a trial could of
Manurtia
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2016-12-06 04:54:11 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
and yet you can actually do less than a trial could of


Are you for or against the OP? You seem to be going both ways.

I think the point that the OP is making is that if CCP is trying to keep people interested, they shouldn't give the alphas so much limitations that they aren't being sucked into the game.
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#8 - 2016-12-06 07:20:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Rivr Luzade
What limitations are you talking about? Please elaborate.

Limitations on how many market orders you can have? 3 characters without any account overhead cost (subscription, PLEX) with lets say 30 slots each make 90 slots without any minimal maintenance cost for the account. That's a lot of money that you can make per month. This is nothing new people need, this is something that existing players would exploit.
Not contracts? Same problem as above. 5 contracts or something like that per completely free character makes 15 contracts on a completely free account, which again is something that veterans can exploit way more efficiently for bigger monetary gains than new players. However, if you want to move things around between characters on an account, you can easily do that in citadels with the Deliver To feature.
Gank ships not good enough? From what I know, Thrashers and Vexors are awesome to gank ships.
More industry jobs or mining capabilities? Again, same problems as above.
You can't have more than 10 people in your corp? Judging by this very topic, that is a good idea. If you want to form a bigger corp, you have to show some commitment and invest in the game and in your corp members by actually demonstrating that you want to stay and not just fold everything (and grab everything from the hangars) as soon as something unpleasant hits the fan. Someone who can't demonstrate even a little staying power, which alphas as extended trails clearly can't, should not be able to form something that requires a lot of just this.
Ship performance limitations? Those were put in place because your clone's capacity is that of a slightly above average NPC. The performance of the alpha ships is sufficient for what they are intended to do, not what you would like to do with them. A fully skilled Omen or Stabber can do a lot more things than just "basic gameplay", especially in groups.

What you want is way beyond "basic gameplay", you want the full gameplay experience without any need to upgrade to Omega.

What your "suggestion" would also create are completely free SP farmers unless CCP increases the threshold beyond which you can't extract SP.

Also: a big "told you so". Didn't take long until people weren't satisfied with what they get for free. Roll

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.

Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#9 - 2016-12-06 07:42:17 UTC
But if I could fly any t1 hull with a full t2 fit and maxed supports, why would I need a subscription, ever?
Tabyll Altol
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#10 - 2016-12-06 07:49:39 UTC
Kaendra Udan wrote:
Okay, I have been going through the work of building myself and my corporation from the ground up, as an Alpha Clone.

A little bit of feedback and suggestions for you.

In my mind, Alphas should have all the basic functionality of EVE, but not the advanced functionality.

They should be able to fly T1 ships perfectly, with anything less than a T2 (or higher) module fitted. Their skills should support this. Right now they are very hobbled, by design I am sure, so I am hoping that improvements are coming.


Suggestions:

  1. Corporation Management should not be limited to level 1, you should increase that to level 5. (reasoning is that you want people to be drawn into corporations that interest them, which will keep them interested, and I am not finding many Omega clones that are interested in an Alpha corp)
  2. If you are dead set on keeping Alphas limited to Frigates, Destroyers and Cruisers, you should allow them to fully skill up all supporting skills, as if people aren't having fun, they aren't going to stick around...and always struggling to do anything, even as a group, isn't fun, especially knowing that your limitation is basic skill limitations.


To those naysayers that say "Just upgrade to Omega", once again, in my mind Omega should be what you go for to expand above basic game play...flying T2 ships, running mega corporations, owning tracts of space, et.al., not doing the things that are trying to "hook" you into playing EVE more.

Other than that, I like Alpha and the New Player Experience as well.



No more features for alpha clones ! If you like what you play buy a plex or subscribe ! Thats what the game keeps alive.

-1
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#11 - 2016-12-06 08:54:57 UTC
Tabyll Altol wrote:
If you like what you play buy a plex or subscribe ! Thats what the game keeps alive.

That's the problem s/he "sees" and "tries to fix" by making more of the non-basic gameplay available, but in turn removes a lot of the reasons to actually go beyond that introductory level of gameplay alphas are supposed to offer.

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.

Kenrailae
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2016-12-06 09:26:19 UTC
Eh.... I still kinda think alpha's should be able to train battlecruiser 3.

Certainly not BS in any capacity ofc.

As it is they can really only do frigs and dessies and gutted cruisers. They should be able to fill out cruisers a bit more, and squeeze by with BC's. Still leaves vast areas of eve to lure for subs, but gives just a bit more flexibility to sink that hook a bit more.

The Law is a point of View

The NPE IS a big deal

Tabyll Altol
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#13 - 2016-12-06 09:51:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Tabyll Altol
Kenrailae wrote:
Eh.... I still kinda think alpha's should be able to train battlecruiser 3.

Certainly not BS in any capacity ofc.

As it is they can really only do frigs and dessies and gutted cruisers. They should be able to fill out cruisers a bit more, and squeeze by with BC's. Still leaves vast areas of eve to lure for subs, but gives just a bit more flexibility to sink that hook a bit more.


Why should the be able?
The alpha is no more than an extended trial version. First of all this includes the should not be able to make much isk (so only Lv 1/2 missions no bigger mining ships etc.) If this should be changed please include how the employees and severs should be payed.

The current alpha clones allow a very good incom without any costs at all (exept for the time to play). They should rather be nerved than buffed.
Kenrailae
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2016-12-06 11:02:53 UTC
Tabyll Altol wrote:
Kenrailae wrote:
Eh.... I still kinda think alpha's should be able to train battlecruiser 3.

Certainly not BS in any capacity ofc.

As it is they can really only do frigs and dessies and gutted cruisers. They should be able to fill out cruisers a bit more, and squeeze by with BC's. Still leaves vast areas of eve to lure for subs, but gives just a bit more flexibility to sink that hook a bit more.


Why should the be able?
The alpha is no more than an extended trial version. First of all this includes the should not be able to make much isk (so only Lv 1/2 missions no bigger mining ships etc.) If this should be changed please include how the employees and severs should be payed.

The current alpha clones allow a very good incom without any costs at all (exept for the time to play). They should rather be nerved than buffed.


Blah blah, doom and gloom about mass unsubbing, inaccurate statements about massive isk farming with poorly fit BC's and gimped cruisers....


Got it, worthless post is worthless.

The Law is a point of View

The NPE IS a big deal

Kaendra Udan
Late Night Emissions
#15 - 2016-12-06 23:30:14 UTC
Danika Princip wrote:
But if I could fly any t1 hull with a full t2 fit and maxed supports, why would I need a subscription, ever?


No, I said anything less than T2, so meta 0-4. T2 modules and above (meta 5+) would be advanced functionality to me.

I'm saying that I feel you should be able to train all the non-specialized or advanced skills to level 5 (e.g. Corporation Management, Controlled Bursts, Small Medium and Large Turrets, Surgical Strike, Trajectory Analysis, Rapid Firing, Light Medium Heavy and Mining Drones, Shield Operation, Shield Management, Shield Upgrades, Tactical Shield Manipulation, Warp Drive Operation, Afterburner, High Speed Maneuvering, Evasive Maneuvering, Navigation, Acceleration Control, et.al.)

Probably to summarize it best, being able to at least get up to level 4 mastery on all ships that alphas are able to fly. Things listed as "Core" skills, should not be reserved only for Omegas. Skills to fly T2 ships and items, should be, in my opinion.

I'm fine with the racial limitations, too, by the way, so even if it was all T1 ships of the race you choose, it would only be 1/4 of the T1 ships, which is definitely limiting in and of itself.

It's funny, actually, that it seems that the Omegas feel threatened by getting people more engaged in the game, to the point where they want to take it to the "next level" and subscribe or plex the game. I mean really, an Omega clone with multiple accounts is surely superior in all regards to an Alpha clone account that cannot multibox and is limited to T1 ships and gear. What are you all so afraid of?

Kaendra Udan
Late Night Emissions
#16 - 2016-12-06 23:33:40 UTC
As for skill extractors and such, once again, a feature for Omega clones, only, in my mind.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#17 - 2016-12-07 03:57:28 UTC
Danika Princip wrote:
But if I could fly any t1 hull with a full t2 fit and maxed supports, why would I need a subscription, ever?


that's exactly what the OP wants. They don't want to need to sub ever
Kaendra Udan
Late Night Emissions
#18 - 2016-12-07 04:17:49 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Danika Princip wrote:
But if I could fly any t1 hull with a full t2 fit and maxed supports, why would I need a subscription, ever?


that's exactly what the OP wants. They don't want to need to sub ever


No it isn't. I love how everyone is reading more into what I am suggesting than what is intended. Apparently you didn't read my OP or my responses.
Kaendra Udan
Late Night Emissions
#19 - 2016-12-07 04:20:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Kaendra Udan
*sigh*, your troll skills are good. I just overreacted.
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#20 - 2016-12-07 05:10:46 UTC
Kaendra Udan wrote:


Probably to summarize it best, being able to at least get up to level 4 mastery on all ships that alphas are able to fly. Things listed as "Core" skills, should not be reserved only for Omegas. Skills to fly T2 ships and items, should be, in my opinion.

I'm fine with the racial limitations, too, by the way, so even if it was all T1 ships of the race you choose, it would only be 1/4 of the T1 ships, which is definitely limiting in and of itself.

It's funny, actually, that it seems that the Omegas feel threatened by getting people more engaged in the game, to the point where they want to take it to the "next level" and subscribe or plex the game. I mean really, an Omega clone with multiple accounts is surely superior in all regards to an Alpha clone account that cannot multibox and is limited to T1 ships and gear. What are you all so afraid of?


With the above 'limits' you just described, you would be able to fly incursions quite happily, because Alpha's can use faction/deadspace items, and in fact any T2's that you meet the skills for as well. So you could run an incursion alt with no subscription at all. You could take part in high end WH play. You could take part in Null sec doctrine fleets. I can't think of a single area of game play you wouldn't be able to play at the 'top' end of the game with those limits, meaning nearly everyone unsubscribes to save money, and EVE dies.
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