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Bounty Hunting/Piracy

First post
Author
Miranda Kaysen
Miranda's Pleasure Hub
#21 - 2016-11-26 15:02:43 UTC
Dark Lord Trump wrote:
Miranda Kaysen wrote:
I Had some quick thoughts on adjusting the Bounty Hunting system, maybe it gives some inspiration :P


1. Change the system to kind of that only people who get flagged as criminal can get placed a bounty on.

2. To get flagged you either do a playerkill or scam, than the victim and only the victim is authorised to place a bounty on the agressor.

3. Add a conversation dialogue in the Bounty Office in a station to check via script or something like that, a players last conversation/transaction to convinve the Officer to flag the scamer so he can get placed a bounty on him.

4. Add some sort of Space Prison

5. Prison could like something like this: Player reached Bounty amount X, and is prohibited to dock at any NPC corp station, Player reches Tier 2 of Bounty amount and is eligible to get imprisoned by concord, duration can vary from 24 hours to 7 days depends on bounty, maybe even more than 2 tiers.

6. Players with a Bounty which is at least Tier 1 will always be shown on the system map.

7. In Prison a Character is unable to train skills, active training gets paused.

8. Add each Month, or every 3 Months like a season a special Ship skin to the Top 5 or 10 Bounty Hunters :)

9. If a Player reaches the Tier where hes eligible to get imprisoned by concord, he will always get that penalty regardless where he gets shot down, he will picked up immediately by a concord convoid after his ship gets destroyed.

It would add some extra spice to the current system :D

1. Why can't I place a bounty on someone I just don't like, or kills me in low/nullsec? Unless you plan on adding criminal flags to all sec levels.
2. How do you propose that a scam criminally flags you? Are you planning to have a GM look over each and every business transaction that someone complains about, thus increasing the workload on the already overworked GMs?
3. The whole point of a scam is that it's hard to detect. Please show us this magic script that is smarter than the human that fell for the scam in the first place. What about scams like citadel contracts from people who change docking rights?
4. No.
5. So if you kill a rich player, or say something that trips the scam filter, he has carte blanche to lock you out of the vast majority of high, low, and some of nullsec. That won't be abused. Also, tempbanning your character after he gets killed? You're effectively banning any sort of PvP since you kill someone->bountied->characterbanned.
6. So if I pretty much kill anyone a big flashing neon sign appears above my that says "kill me pls".
7. RIP any new players who want to PvP.
8. Why can't the bounty alone be reason to hunt for bounties? Why do you have to be given 100 billion ISK too? Because those skins are worth at least as much as AT ships.
9. Why does CONCORD care about what happens in nullsec. Give a lore reason, and a game reason since the entire point of null is unrestricted PvP.

In conclusion, your idea is bad. In fact, it's a cut above the other bad ideas in F&I, and for that I salute you. I nominate you as the first person to be criminally flagged and thrown in space jail for trying to scam CCP out of subscription money in your attempt to improve the game for yourself at the detriment of everyone who isn't a carebear of monumental levels.


1. Yeah it should apply to all sec levels of course :)
2. The script was just a idea not fleshed out ( do you have any good idea for it ), but for example the contract scam: Player X accepts the scam contract and gets rekt, than he could show the contract to a bounty officer who can identify the scam and flags that scamer, would be possible to script something like that. ( Could mybe need some general trade rework to simple the script code needet for that )
3. Its not impossible
4. Yes, criminals should be punished according to their crime :D
5. Well thats part of it, in that situation iam sure there would be corps specific in which only crriminals hide in their respective Outpost, ( some sort of reward should be granted to them too, maybe like if they can stand the bounty for 2 weeks or month, they get something special )
6. Only if you reach a certain ammount, and only in a system ( Tier numbers would need testing which amount is appropriate.
7. No one of us can judge that right now how it would play out, cause it would be a huge shifting, corps that are specialized on that would need to change their approach.
8. these special skins should be untradeable, so they will be realy something special :)
9. CCP could lorewise add something like " the player who wants to claim the bounty, activated a transport beacon for the concord to pin down their location to grab the criminal"



Dark Lord Trump
0.0 Massive Dynamic
Pandemic Horde
#22 - 2016-11-26 15:23:24 UTC
Miranda Kaysen wrote:
Dark Lord Trump wrote:

1. Why can't I place a bounty on someone I just don't like, or kills me in low/nullsec? Unless you plan on adding criminal flags to all sec levels.
2. How do you propose that a scam criminally flags you? Are you planning to have a GM look over each and every business transaction that someone complains about, thus increasing the workload on the already overworked GMs?
3. The whole point of a scam is that it's hard to detect. Please show us this magic script that is smarter than the human that fell for the scam in the first place. What about scams like citadel contracts from people who change docking rights?
4. No.
5. So if you kill a rich player, or say something that trips the scam filter, he has carte blanche to lock you out of the vast majority of high, low, and some of nullsec. That won't be abused. Also, tempbanning your character after he gets killed? You're effectively banning any sort of PvP since you kill someone->bountied->characterbanned.
6. So if I pretty much kill anyone a big flashing neon sign appears above my that says "kill me pls".
7. RIP any new players who want to PvP.
8. Why can't the bounty alone be reason to hunt for bounties? Why do you have to be given 100 billion ISK too? Because those skins are worth at least as much as AT ships.
9. Why does CONCORD care about what happens in nullsec. Give a lore reason, and a game reason since the entire point of null is unrestricted PvP.

In conclusion, your idea is bad. In fact, it's a cut above the other bad ideas in F&I, and for that I salute you. I nominate you as the first person to be criminally flagged and thrown in space jail for trying to scam CCP out of subscription money in your attempt to improve the game for yourself at the detriment of everyone who isn't a carebear of monumental levels.


1. Yeah it should apply to all sec levels of course :)
2. The script was just a idea not fleshed out ( do you have any good idea for it ), but for example the contract scam: Player X accepts the scam contract and gets rekt, than he could show the contract to a bounty officer who can identify the scam and flags that scamer, would be possible to script something like that. ( Could mybe need some general trade rework to simple the script code needet for that )
3. Its not impossible
4. Yes, criminals should be punished according to their crime :D
5. Well thats part of it, in that situation iam sure there would be corps specific in which only crriminals hide in their respective Outpost, ( some sort of reward should be granted to them too, maybe like if they can stand the bounty for 2 weeks or month, they get something special )
6. Only if you reach a certain ammount, and only in a system ( Tier numbers would need testing which amount is appropriate.
7. No one of us can judge that right now how it would play out, cause it would be a huge shifting, corps that are specialized on that would need to change their approach.
8. these special skins should be untradeable, so they will be realy something special :)
9. CCP could lorewise add something like " the player who wants to claim the bounty, activated a transport beacon for the concord to pin down their location to grab the criminal"




1. The entire point of nullsec is there is no law.
2+3. It's probably not impossible but most likely incredibly difficult and the amount of developer time required to implement it is not worth it.
4. They already are, flying a ship in hisec with a criminal flag subjects you to immediate destruction. I see no reason why a temporary ban is necessary for doing something explicitly allowed. Any further punishment is your job.
5. So now you want to reward people for not PvPing in a PvP game? Are you trying to destroy EvE?
6. Because there aren't people with loads of money that will abuse knowing your exact location in a system. Have fun trying to rat or anything that isn't PvP when the enemy can warp to you almost immediately, by warping to your anom or by using probes.
7. Here's how it would play out, new players would fear PvP lest they lose training time and fall even further behind the vets.
8. Everything is tradeable in EvE by design, there are no 'soulbound' items. Why should player freedom be restricted in this case?
9. Again, why does Concord care about this guy if he's not in hisec? If I'm in nullsec, I can't break the laws as there are none. The cops don't come and arrest me for not breaking the law, or after I've paid my penance.

I'm going to build a big wall that will keep the Gallente out, and they're going to pay for it!

Miranda Kaysen
Miranda's Pleasure Hub
#23 - 2016-11-26 15:35:23 UTC
What would you change than in the current Bounty system to encourage players to go after them, but also offer some sort of punishment for criminals, cause right now its just useless, no one gives a **** abount Bountys :P
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#24 - 2016-11-26 16:10:15 UTC
Miranda Kaysen wrote:
Danika Princip wrote:
But all of those are completely unworkable and actively encourage people to unsub and play other games.



In other games systems like this work too, and it goes well :) Criminals should be punished thats the whole point of it ^^
And it encourages people to hunt their Bountys to punish them 1 get their rewards, but its ok that a goon doesnt agree with that :D


At no point has any game, ever, presented 'and if you are naughty you're going to get a seven day ban' as a feature, while simultaneously presenting itself as an open universe where you can do just about anything.

And can you please explain what my corp tag has to do with anything?
Dark Lord Trump
0.0 Massive Dynamic
Pandemic Horde
#25 - 2016-11-26 16:17:22 UTC
Miranda Kaysen wrote:
What would you change than in the current Bounty system to encourage players to go after them, but also offer some sort of punishment for criminals, cause right now its just useless, no one gives a **** abount Bountys :P

Having a bounty should encourage people to go after you, (and that should be the only punishment) the problem is that the mechanics of EvE don't really support that. The previous version incentivized killing yourself with an alt, the current one effectively means you're either shooting a juicy target in hisec or a 'because I can' target in low/null, both of which you'd kill without the bounty anyway. Changing the aggression mechanics using a bounty is a no go, because that means rich players can gank whoever they like. I'm afraid I don't have a solution for the bounty system, but that doesn't make your solution any less wrong.

I'm going to build a big wall that will keep the Gallente out, and they're going to pay for it!

Conogan Blitzkreig
Induced Warfare
#26 - 2016-11-27 07:04:44 UTC
Keep up the responses, people. I'm sure we'll find some way to save this game's ass. Saw some **** about this stuff on Reddit that was interesting. Oh, and as for Miranda's prison idea... Uh, no... >.>
Conogan Blitzkreig
Induced Warfare
#27 - 2016-11-27 07:16:11 UTC
Here's an example https://m.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/4270k1/how_to_make_bounty_hunting_a_profession/ except omit the part where it says "edited to be hisec only" as if care bear can't swallow their tears and afford counter-bounties then they shouldn't be in this game.
Mykal Omara
State War Academy
Caldari State
#28 - 2016-11-27 08:09:41 UTC
Given the nature of Eve maybe there doesn't need to be a bounty mechanic at all? If you want someone to suffer for hurting you, hire a mercenary corp to go after them. I don't think there is any way to solve the problem of people collecting their own bounties. So trash the whole mechanic. It's not needed. Capsuleers are immortal and shoot each other all the time for any reason or no reason at all.
Conogan Blitzkreig
Induced Warfare
#29 - 2016-11-27 14:50:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Conogan Blitzkreig
I just realized this and it's so dumb....but why is there the problem that people can collect their own bounties?? CCP should just FIX THE DAMN CODE so alts can't collect a bounty and neither can someone with either good standing to that person, on their contact/friend list, in the same Corp or in the same alliance. Also, have to turn in the person's corpse to collecyt on the bounty with a minimum of 3 required and each corpse being "worth" whatever the ship it was destroyed from costs to build+fits. When enough damage/corpses are collected to add up to 125% the bounty, pay bounty. You can't turn in your own corpse or a corpse from someone on your contact/friends list or someone in your Corp or alliance or has good standing with you. Because the game:S code won't let you. Duh >.>
Conogan Blitzkreig
Induced Warfare
#30 - 2016-11-27 15:07:19 UTC
Maybe set it up so that you also cant benefit from the bounty of someone who is on a FRIENDS/CONTACTS)CORPMATES/ALLIANCEMATES contact/friend/Corp/alliance list or has good standing with that person OR AN ALT of any such persons. nd THAT will be relatively cheap roof. God, CCP...
Mykal Omara
State War Academy
Caldari State
#31 - 2016-11-27 19:46:58 UTC
All of those can be circumvented. Real life friends need not have characters in good standing with each other. And a person could make a deal with an in-game "enemy". Honestly, I've thought about all sorts of ways to try and prevent this but I've come to the conclusion that it's just not possible. There will always be a way for people to collect their own bounties.

The only way to make bounty hunting meaningful is to make the consequence of being caught by a bounty hunter something the hunted person actually wants to avoid. Something that they cannot possibly benefit from themselves. But the catch is that it cannot be so severe that the player decides to just quit the game. It's a delicate balance and one I don't have an answer to right now.
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#32 - 2016-11-27 20:02:18 UTC
you cannot get around alts. as far as the game is concerned, an alt is just another player. You cannot make bounties pay out well, because alts will just claim bounties on themselves.

The current system may be as good as it gets. you can provide some incentive for attacking people, but as long as perma death isnt a thing, bounties and hunting them can NEVER be the glamorous career you're thinking of.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Azerick Koslova
The Azerick Corporation
#33 - 2016-11-27 22:01:55 UTC
Personally...I think you just need to get rid of sec status hits for PVP in lowsec.

Let's face it....nobody who knows ANYTHING...expects to go into low sec and be safe. And penalizing people for doing what you want them to do (pvp) seems stupid.

Let the gates and stations continue to attack the aggressors...but why penalize them? It makes entering that style of play less attractive if you know it will ultimately hinder your ability to move in highsec for things you did in low sec. I'm not grinding back up from -10 one more time (twice was enough) and I don't care about tags that's still a grind in my opinion though perhaps less of one.

How many people could you get into lowsec to try it out if not for the sec status hits?
Conogan Blitzkreig
Induced Warfare
#34 - 2016-11-28 05:22:25 UTC
Azerick Koslova wrote:
Personally...I think you just need to get rid of sec status hits for PVP in lowsec.

Let's face it....nobody who knows ANYTHING...expects to go into low sec and be safe. And penalizing people for doing what you want them to do (pvp) seems stupid.

Let the gates and stations continue to attack the aggressors...but why penalize them? It makes entering that style of play less attractive if you know it will ultimately hinder your ability to move in highsec for things you did in low sec. I'm not grinding back up from -10 one more time (twice was enough) and I don't care about tags that's still a grind in my opinion though perhaps less of one.

How many people could you get into lowsec to try it out if not for the sec status hits?


This is a very good point - something CCP definitely needs to fix cuz it's definitely broke as ****.
Revis Owen
Krigmakt Elite
Safety.
#35 - 2016-11-28 17:47:49 UTC
Miranda Kaysen wrote:
Criminals should be punished thats the whole point of it


Right premise, wrong mechanics. Eve is a PvP-centric MMO. Punishing criminals should be left to players either directly taking revenge or hiring others to do so.

Agent of the New Order http://www.minerbumping.com/p/the-code.html If you do not have a current Mining Permit, please contact me for issuance.

Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#36 - 2016-11-28 18:00:10 UTC
The fact that we are immortal make bounties a dead on arrival system. Bounties worked IRL because they were issued by an entity with power to impose penalty once the target was brought to them. In EVE, you can't have that and CCP sure as hell won't add it.

The closest thing to a realistic bounty system in EVE would be CONCORD issuing bounty on criminal for past crime and you would ahve a way to trap them and take them to a CONCORD. You would then hand over the target to a CONCORD officer in exchange for the previously agreed-upon price. At this point, CONCORD would apply punishment on the target like a jail time where he is locked of activities or downright killed.

There are OBVIOUS reasons why this will never happen.

As long as kills aren't "final", bounties will always be irrelevant and gamed so there is no point on working on them.
Conogan Blitzkreig
Induced Warfare
#37 - 2016-12-03 04:04:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Conogan Blitzkreig
EvilThis post is the saiemese twin to Satchel Dark matter's other post, "Bounty System", and they support each other.
Conogan Blitzkreig
Induced Warfare
#38 - 2016-12-04 04:39:54 UTC
I love cake... And BH mechanics that don't suck monkeyballs, and Piracy.
ISD Max Trix
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#39 - 2016-12-05 02:02:46 UTC
Thread Necromancy is not permitted.

Closed.

ISD Max Trix

Lieutenant

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department

I do not respond to EVE mails about forum moderation.

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