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Is it RMT?

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Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
EDENCOM DEFENSIVE INITIATIVE
#21 - 2016-11-25 17:55:26 UTC
RMT is punished. Amount of items on ebay is only indication of how much people are going after clients.
But those who buy from those sources will be in the worst situation. If he will receive items, he will be banned, if he will not receive them, he cant complain and will lose money.

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Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#22 - 2016-11-25 18:45:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
@the OP, you should be fine but as others have advised it may be wise to raise a support ticket; if you have to ask "is it RMT?" then it's a good idea.



Salvos Rhoska wrote:
I just ran some searches on ebay and google, and there seem to be any number of accounts, injectors, PLEX etc on sale for money across many sites.

Frankly, I was shocked at the proliferation.

All accounts, injectors, PLEX etc exist ingame.
They cannot exist outside of it. (Barring some batches of legacy style PLEX/time and other codes.
To my mind, these ebay and other sales services constitute RMT, as exchanging ingame assets for cash,but its up to CCP.
Out of game sales of any ingame items, except the sale of PLEX and other official packs by authorised resellers, is RMT; it should should be reported to CCP either via a support ticket or to team security (security@ccpgames.com)

Quote:
I ch3cked the support site and couldnt find any article on this specific topic of selling ingame assets for cash, nor any prominent thread on official forum withofficial CCP statements on this.If someone finds one, please link it.
Closest I could find, was:

"However, scams that affect areas outside of the game may not be tolerated in the same manner, such as, but not limited to:

Scams involving Character Transfers, mainly via the Character Bazaar where scamming is explicitly forbidden
Scams mimicking services provided by CCP while providing modified data via third party websites
Scams using exploits (fake or existing)
Scams involving the "PLEX for Good" campaigns"

https://support.eveonline.com/hc/en-us/articles/203218892-Scams

Bottomline:
I cba to re-read through TOS/EULA for the upteenth time I have done so for the specific clauses.
Suffice to say, CCP basically reserves the right to just about anything, at their own discretion.

But if sales of ingame assets such as accounts, injectors, PLEX etc for money are already this widespread as I even briefly researched, you making a deal with your friend, in good faith, no profit and contract between you, to share a purchase of 6 PLEX, is barely a molecule in that ocean.
The bit you missed, because you were too damn lazy to read or hit CTRL F and type "selling" (for which there are only 2 results, and they're both relevant to RMT), is as follows:

EULA wrote:
B. Selling Items and Objects

You may not transfer, sell or auction, or buy or accept any offer to transfer, sell or auction (or offer to do any of the foregoing), any content appearing within the Game environment, including without limitation characters, character attributes, items, currency, and objects, other than via a permitted Character Transfer as described in section 3 above. You may not encourage or induce any other person to participate in such a prohibited transaction. You may not use, transfer or assign any game assets for games of chance operated by third parties. The buying, selling or auctioning (or any attempt at doing so) of characters, character attributes, items, currency, or objects, whether through online auctions, newsgroups, postings on message boards or any other means is prohibited by the EULA and a violation of CCP's proprietary rights in the Game.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Geronimo McVain
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2016-11-25 20:10:47 UTC
Salvos Rhoska wrote:

1) Yes, all PLEX is originally paid to CCP. But in RMT, PLEX is resold for profit that CCP does not get. RMT PLEX is cheaper than PLEX from CCP. Since PLEX price ingame doubled in one year, PLEX purchased for ISK before that change in price can now be resold ingame for twice the value of the cost in ISK, so that 2 PLEX bought 1 year ago in ISK, can now be re-sold as 4 RMT PLEXes.

Jeah, thats right but that still doesn't hurt CCP. It hurts the players but not CCP. Each and every Plex is bought from CCP for real Money without any chance of discount. High PLEX Prices may hurt CCP because it makes it more difficult to maintain multiple accounts but it doesn't directly hurt CCP. Injectors sold for real Money is Money that CCP doesn't get for PLEX. So you need less Plex which will raise the the Plex price cause there is less Plex on the market.
Salvos Rhoska
#24 - 2016-11-25 20:57:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Salvos Rhoska
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
The bit you missed, because you were too damn lazy to read or hit CTRL F and type "selling" (for which there are only 2 results, and they're both relevant to RMT), is as follows:


I didnt miss it. I've read it dozens of times. Just cba to re-read/re-link a document i've read dozens of times, again, for the + dozenth time.. Not because I'm lazy, but because the existence of these RMT services is objectively readily apparent, and apparently not enforced against by CCP to sufficient effect, regardless of the document.

Thanks for the linking of one (there are many others) of the specific relevant clauses, for the benefit of the thread, but that is in everyone's signed agreement anyways, and legally is read and agreed to by them before signing anyways.

Geronimo McVain wrote:
Jeah, thats right but that still doesn't hurt CCP. It hurts the players but not CCP. Each and every Plex is bought from CCP for real Money without any chance of discount. High PLEX Prices may hurt CCP because it makes it more difficult to maintain multiple accounts but it doesn't directly hurt CCP. Injectors sold for real Money is Money that CCP doesn't get for PLEX. So you need less Plex which will raise the the Plex price cause there is less Plex on the market.


A) Yes, CCP has benefited from all initial introduction sale of PLEX.
B) RMT today re-sell those same PLEX, that where with-held from the ingame market, for twice the ISK profit as 1 yr ago, for cheaper than CCP sells PLEX in money.
C) Since those PLEX have been with-held from the ingame market for RMT sales, they artificially drive up the demand of PLEX ingame, hence increasing their own RMT value.
D) RMT in PLEX, convert ISK into money. They have re-invested their isk into PLEX, and are now selling them OUTSIDE of the game, for money. There is no way this is beneficial for CCP or the game community.
E) These PLEX and other assets belong exclusively in the ingame market for re-sale in isk. Their sale outside of that market belongs exclusively to CCP (whom is the owner of said assets in every case).

Hypothetical:
Consider if I buy 1000 PLEX off the ingame market with isk. Sit on them for a year, and then (illegally) re-sell them for money on the internet.
My action of withdrawing 1000 PLEX off the market will have reduced supply, thereby increasing ISK price. The very intent of with-holding these PLEX from the market already increases their value and demand (as a function of reduced supply)
Meanwhile, CCPs price for PLEX in money has not changed.
So a year later, I can sell 1000 PLEX for real money, for less than CCP charges for them, of a product that cost me nothing but isk, and which I never produced.

Its pure profit and extremely illegal breaking all manner of laws.
Its also extremely detrimental to the ingame markets from which these items/assets are removed inorder to increase their RMT demand.

PvE v PvP <> Old School Exploration <> CODE Licenses <> CODE Special Agent
ISD Max Trix
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#25 - 2016-11-26 03:51:37 UTC
22. Posting regarding RMT (Real Money Trading) is prohibited.

Posts discussing, linking to, or advertising RMT, including but not limited to the sale of in game items, assets, currency, characters or game accounts for real life money are strictly prohibited.

Closed

ISD Max Trix

Lieutenant

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department

I do not respond to EVE mails about forum moderation.
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