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CCP, plz fix the build requirements of the excavator drones. The blueprints are down to 300mil but that doesn't stop a full set of squishy drones costing 2.5bil at the very least. CMON. This is ridiculous on all counts.

Does anyone else see the bonus's applied to the Rorqs dps and mining drones when in indy mode? The damage modifiers, speed, mining amounts do not change ounce the indy mode is onlined.

Possibly, then again we're talking about something that replaces a ship worth about 300m with fittings, and the Rorqual itself isn't *that* expensive after insurance.

That said, I do agree that 400m for a drone that's pretty easily killed does seem like a bit much. Kind of amazed no one looked at the build requirements for these and brought it up though.

1. Those saying the cost is right compared to how much they mine! Either you know nothing about mining or indy play for that matter or your just one of the many grps wanting to farm for nice Rorq kills with 5B worth of capital mining drones in it belly.

2. The Risk = Reward , Many of you hardcore PvP players like content and hunting indy players along with hunting ratters, and if you get lucky catching a carrier or super with your bomber fleet in range to jump in.

The rorq if maxed skilled could mine 18,000 m3 /min which let me relate it in terms you non indy players can understand. Every hr a Rorq could mine 1m m3 of ore /Hr which is about 250m isk/hr for reg ore.

3. It would take a rorq 20hrs just to mine 5B isk worth of ore to pay for the capital drones but that is only if a rorq is right up against the rocks it mines.

4. The risk , does not out way the reward so the only option is to either mine with just a porpise or indy players switch to just ratting.

5. There are not many grps in eve that are able to form a grp fast enough to help a Rorq if caught, so the 2000dps, which if fitted right can shield boost 7800k dps for 5mins with resist at 75%.

So now Rorq will not be used nearly as much once enough ppl lose there rorqs risking them in the belts.

6. If you want a mining drone to mine the same as a hulk then they should cost about the same as a hulk. 1B isk per capital drone is way to high even though it was just implemented this week.

7. boost the drop rate of the Elite drone AI's till the prices drop and reset it. that simple.

First off I agree that the price of these drones is pretty prohibitive right now and should be looked at.

That said, I take issue with a few of your logical points here.

First off, the idea that not many people are able to scramble a fleet in 10 minutes to protect a Rorqual. Speaking as someone who spent *years* with Eve Uni helping newbies I can say from experience that this is mostly a matter of numbers and practice on the part of those in charge. If you have leadership that is practiced at getting people into a fleet and deployed quickly then even if you're working with week old newbies you can absolutely get a fleet out and shooting things in under 10 minutes. So while this may be true right now there's no reason it has to remain true except for laziness and a lack of organization.

It's also not really true that the cost of the drones is going to make Rorquals used less than they are right now considering the only use for a Rorqual before this patch was an off-grid booster, which is a role that could have been seamlessly replaced with an anchorable structure. There's also still a fairly strong incentive to use a boosting Rorqual without the Excavator Drones. It's not like you *need* the Excavators to make the Rorqual worth using in a mining fleet, they're just very nice to have.

1. Most people probably can't form a fleet and travel to rescue in that time. Best ive heard recently was PL getting in blops in just under 5 minutes. So for any group that doesn't have 40 blops on standby, geuss they're screwed?
2. "Hostiles that might gun for your Rorqual" so what's that? 50k people in eve? Couple hundred different staging systems? Might get lucky if you have eyes in a pipe. Hopefully.
3. Ok?
4. Geuss it depends on what situations think will happen more. Matter of opinion I geuss.
5. youll never reach 1.8m/hr, gauruntee it. In the most efficient of scenarios you're probably looking at closer to 1.4 - 1.5. And of course, under the absolute best circumstances, you could potentially mine 400m/hr. But that's absolutely perfect circumstances. Which don't happen often, unless you've figured out a way to spawn 1.8mil m/3 Prime Ark asteroid. And of course them we have to consider whether or not you fit modules to get closer to that max yield, otherwise we're back down to the more reasonable 250m/hr average, which comes at the cost of that buffer tank you were looking at earlier. A fair decision to make, but let's not pretend we can do everything at once.

12B fittings? Honestly I'd probably geuss 7-8 bil once the prices come down (assuming they get to 400mil). But even once they reach that low, you're still using a drone that costs as much as a flight of T2 fighter bombers. Doesn't seem quite fair to make them cost as much as the only pirate faction fighter. Or a full carrier hangar of T2 fighters. If the price doesn't drop substantially in the next few months, then it is definitely broken.

I'm very loathe to seriously consider the math of someone who spent 5b on a ratting carrier. Refits or not, unless you've got officer mods in there, you got scammed. I think my fit only ranges around 2.5-3 bil? Also I make 200m/r running some really ****** sites in bad truesec. And of the two ships, I'm pretty confident that carriers have a much higher chance of escaping from a threat. I geuss we'll have to how the rorq plays out in the future a bit more. If you're going to assume the best case for the rorq, I think it's a little unfair of you to use average numbers for your counter argument.

The rorqual isn't as big of a money grinding machine as you play it out to be. It's definitely good, especially as mining is concerned. However, it's a bit off balance to its costs.

Not sure if serious but we have fax on standby at all times so if carriers or rorquals get tackled while jewing first thing that goes in is a ton of combat carriers and a few fax.. and if then there is still a need you have all the time in the world to form a subcap fleet. So ya if your alliance can't figure out to have a standing fleet with fax alts on standby maybe they should not use rorquals. And nop Ratting carrier which for our alliance is simply our combat carriers with all the refits and **** is about 5b atleast they life and dont just die before triage loads grid when bombersbar unloads 80 bombers. Which did happen and guess what we didnt loss **** all. Jewing is fine everyone has to make isk somehow the difference is doing it in non ******** ways.

As for the argument that there are 50k people in eve no not really most of the time its more like 25k... and even then dudes from WH's arent really something you'd fear because they can't cap escalate you while you can unload everything on them at reasonable risk. The real risk is the dudes living around the corner which in our case is goons and they have tried to snagg our **** multiple times yet never get it because we see them coming exit industry mode and **** off.. Like having eyes also means having a freaking brain.

The only thing I'd argue for is more base speed on the drones given the price tag and given that they are supposed to be the big brother of the other augmented harvester drones yet they only got 1/3 of their base speed. Otherwise everything else is perfectly fine.

Did you even read the post? Give it a try!

One of my corpmates got tackled in his Rorqual the other day. He was already on comms and stayed calm. Hostiles brought a 40-man Gila gang. They had around 25 Gilas, 8 logistics, 2 HIC's, and the rest tackle. He tanked that gang easily while we formed. We had FAX ready to jump to him inside of a minute, but we did not drop it. He just tanked them. He did not even have to use the PANIC module. We ended up letting him tank them for 25 minutes while we took Machariels by bridge and then five gate jumps to trap the hostile fleet. Then we killed most of them. I think the Rorqual might be a little bit OP.

If you don't have friends who can support you, don't Siege your Rorqual. Just fit a Higgs Anchor to it and mine aligned out of Siege. Or just use an Orca.

It feels kind of strange: I agreed with every single thing Baki Yuku said. Good posts, man. I always heard you were batshit crazy.

New rorquals are not possible to use as afk ratting ships, because frigate and cruiser npcs keep focusing on drones no matter the aggro mechanics you use(command links, ecm burst, shield emissions, warp scramblers).

CCPLS

Make afk Ishtars great again.