Market Discussions

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Stable around 100 bil, al new isk goes into plex / skins and stupid actions on gates.

Getting from 20bil to 100bil shouldn't be too hard.



This seems to be your problem. There are many more items out there that will absorb more of your isk. Simple high-frequency station trading can easily take up more than 20bil but with 20bil you can potentially make c. 1-200mil an hour simply by grinding your order updates. You shouldn't have much trouble identifying 100 or so items worth trading to keep a trading pool of 50-60 billion occupied. Grinding the updates at that point should bring you in from 250-500mil an hour, maybe up to 800-1bil if you are really good at exploiting opportunities to move markets in your favour. By the way, you are trading in Jita aren't you? If not, move there.

That's the simplest way to grow from 20-100bil. Grind, grind, grind those orders and find good items to work.

There are a variety of slower approaches, such as trading the peaks and troughs that become regular features for many items. Buy in the troughs and hold till you see a reasonable peak, then unload (i.e. buy low sell high). This can net you 5-10% a month for really minimal effort. The amount of isk you will earn per active hour will be higher than it would grinding but you have a very low ceiling of active hours per month, whilst the active option is scalable to however much time you have available.

There are a variety of related approaches that bring in similar returns, including slow-sell regional arbitrage, and other options that sit in between these in terms of returns per hour of effort and scalability. However, I incline towards the view that the intermediate range is the worst of both worlds. If you want low effort returns then go the low effort route and if you want maximum returns go the high effort route. If you want returns somewhere in between, just pursue the high effort route for a limited number of hours. You will make more doing this than you will with a limited number of hours in most medium return options.

The real outlier that sits apart from all other trading strategies is patch speculation. Making the right bets on changes CCP makes to the game can let you reap huge returns just making a few plays a year. But you either need to do some serious research or hitch your wagon to someone else who is. Getting this stuff wrong can wipe you out if you are all in on it.

tl;dr is that anyone who can hit 20bil can make it to 100bil without question. The only thing at issue is how hard you have to work to get there.

Yea! Why did isd move this thread to market discussion where it belongs! How can be brag to new players with his shiptoast alt when you move the thread to the appropriate area?! Isd please stop doing your job, it's oppressing this kid.

When I hit 100b or so I gambled and that went crazy and I hit 200b+ jackpots left and right, a few a month for like four five months (after 7 years of playing Toobo, found she has incredible luck). But that's in the past and no more ISK gambling allowed now. So I put ISK into long term speculations and high value BPOs, for research and copy and all that. I think it's actually about 2~300b mark where the game started to change for me. At 100b most of my options were still in station trading and limited low effort production lines. When I went over 200b then I could use 100b for other projects, such as seeding different regions and financing stuff that did not have quick return. 100b is very nice, but IMHO not enough to branch out too far from your main activities, as if somehow you end up losing all on your new ventures, you are back to below 100b. With 200b you can 'risk' 100b in more variety of ways, and still have very stable 100b operation that covers for monthly expenses.

So yeah, aim for 200b then mess around with 100b. If I had 100b on total nav I would not mess around with 50b+ projects. I use 50b as benchmark here as that's what I found to be just about enough capital to do some financing stuff, like fortizar market (fortizar+defence capabilities+ISK left over to trade on those new hubs you are investing in). Fortizar may only cost 20b to set up, but you want to set aside at least similar amount to defend it (so cost for fleet ships and ISK for defence arrangements with entities capable of using these ships to defend). If you are not financing a fortizar itself or its safety, then you can work with less capital on developing someone else's new hub, but you have much less control over what happens. I financed a few fortizars around New Eden, and get 0% broker fees on those. In some heavy trading fortizars the broker fees I have saved alone have already covered more than the fortizar cost I invested initially.