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Excessive Griefing

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Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#141 - 2016-10-19 17:08:07 UTC
Mark Marconi wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
Mark Marconi wrote:

Yes you did get an insurance payout now its gotten so easy to gank, you dont need it.


And who do you have to thank for that? Gankers? No, CCP. You are so blinkered you cannot see that CCP has been playing you for fools. If you had just shut up and stopped whining you could autopilot between Jita and whereever so long as you kept the cargo load low enough. Classic case of you got what you asked for dumbass.

Quote:
So maybe you should stop acting like it is your right to be able to destroy hundreds of millions of isk ships for a few ratty destroyers, while you pretend that ganking has gotten so hard. Meanwhile most of the industrialists have left this game.


How about you exercise some prudence. Why are you sitting here stamping our foot like an impetuous and spoiled child who thinks the game resolves around them. Stop moving multiple billions of ISK in one fell swoop vs. several low risk trips, or get a JF and just jump past such problem systems?

Seriously you sit here whining like a little ***** that there is nothing you can do when in fact the power has always been with you.

It is well past time you grew up and started acting in a prudent and reasonable matter.

So we are down to the cant attack the argument, attack the person part.

It does not change the fact that it takes 11 catalysts with T2 guns and Ammo costing 9.09 mill each to kill a freighter empty or not. The gankers are making billions from little to no effort because even a freighter carrying 200 mill in goods covers the cost when half of it blows up.

No Industrialists did not get what they wanted, I can't remember any industrialist ever saying :Please buff the destroyers" that was the PvP types.

You don't seem to get it there is no low risk trips. Newbie ships are being ganked for fun, hulks and macks for chuckles and freighters for massive profits.

And yet you say i am acting like a child because I want risk vs reward reinstated because at the moment the Industrialists are taking all the risks and the gankers are getting all the rewards.

While you just want the gravy train to continue.


There is plenty of argument in there and it applies to both RL and the game. If you are prudent you'll be fine, if you are imprudent you won't be fine...well unless you work on Wall Street in which case you'll get a bail out.

That's it. CODE. Miniluv, and the rest impose consequences for being imprudent. That's it.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#142 - 2016-10-19 17:39:09 UTC
Mark Marconi wrote:

Very nice so proved that older/richer characters are producing more per capital. Industrialists exist but a lot of these are Null alts producing in Hi-sec. Not Hi-sec miner/Industrialists.


How do you know industrialists are NS alts?

Quote:
As can be seen here in newer figures, the supplies of Hi-Sec minerals are falling even after the expansion that increased mineral content. While Null/WH minerals are on the increase.


Actually looks like they declined then stabilized. And that change...isn't that when minerals in NS got a major re-work? Not seeing the ganking narrative here.

Quote:
And then if you look at the numbers of mining barges and exhumers, they are approximately the same as battleships.


So? Not seeing the point here.

Quote:
So a lot of hi-sec producers exist but not many miners which is what I am referring to as Industrialists. Those who mine and produce in Hi-Sec.
Also if there were so many Hi-Sec miners, how could the value of Hi-Sec minerals double?
And if there are so many casual miners left why is the cost of plex so high?


Miners are industrialists but industrialists are not miners. When I mine it is exactly the kind of casual thing you talk about. I myself do not produce in HS as it is cheaper to do so in LS or NS, and if you know what you are doing moving stuff in and out is not tough or risky.

The cost of plex is related to a number of factors. For example, CCP has been using PLEX for more and more of their services. IIRC it was like $10 to transfer a character between accounts, now it costs a PLEX. Skill injectors also likely played a factor as well. As for the long term trend, that is probably due to the growth in ISK and also the fact that PLEX started out so damn cheap.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#143 - 2016-10-19 17:42:14 UTC
PsiMin wrote:


When I used to mine in high sec its annoying as sustained bumping in a system is still classed as harassment and can be logged, however CCP tend not to do much about it.


No it is not harassment. The guy is trying to claim those resources and using a valid in game tactic. Either shoot the bumping ship, try to bump his ships, get to the resources before he does, or move.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Anne Dieu-le-veut
Natl Assn for the Advancement of Criminal People
#144 - 2016-10-19 17:50:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Anne Dieu-le-veut
Ima Wreckyou wrote:
pajedas wrote:
Do not allow "any" weapons into so-called high security space.

I am sure the mission runners would be thrilled. Another quality idea brought to you by AG. You guys are amazing.


Possible Veers Alt? Same undeserved smugness despite being totally clueless
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#145 - 2016-10-19 17:51:24 UTC
pajedas wrote:
Galaxy Duck wrote:
I guess dozens of combat pilots shouldn't be able to bring down one imprudent guy with no backup, in his philosophy.

Correct. Eve is set far into the future.

Do not allow "any" weapons into so-called high security space.

They have the technology and future bureaucrats would make it happen.

You're just afraid you might actually have to "work" for a living.


No. HS is not supposed to be safe space. HS is "safer" space, and you are supposed to take some precautions.

The first rule of EVE has always been, do not undock in anything you cannot afford to lose, and that goes for haulers too.

Your imagination of what the future would be like IRL is irrelevant because in part this is a game balance issue. For example, in the future with advanced technology couldn't I set up a condition so that if my drones take say 35% shield damage they automatically return to the drone bay, and that after 10 seconds they are launched again? Why don't my crew start firing the guns when reloaded. How come I can't issue a "weapons free" command? I supposedly have a crew but not a damn one of them can think for themselves?

And you keep implying that ganking is lazy, but they set up comms, they have scouts, they have cargo scanners, somebody is probably plugging it into evepraisal and checking the value. Then there is the bumping ships, the logistics of getting ships and ammo into staging systems. Then there is all the work of reimbursing people for ships, or assembling the ships and handing them out.

But you do not take even the slightest of precautions and they are the lazy ones?

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Anne Dieu-le-veut
Natl Assn for the Advancement of Criminal People
#146 - 2016-10-19 17:54:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Anne Dieu-le-veut
pajedas wrote:
I almost forgot how dedicated the ganker trolls are.

It's like trying to take welfare from people that have lived off of it for generations.

They'll do anything to hold onto it.

What are you so afraid of?


Says the guy that thinks miners should be able to generate ISK AFK in total safety

pajedas wrote:
I don't have to dodge anything.

I've seen hundreds of lame ducks like you come and go over the years.

Fact: CCP has ran the game down so far that they're having to give it away.

I guess they listened to the wrong voices.


Yes, they're listening to voices of people like you
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#147 - 2016-10-19 17:55:29 UTC
pajedas wrote:
I don't have to dodge anything.

I've seen hundreds of lame ducks like you come and go over the years.

Fact: CCP has ran the game down so far that they're having to give it away.

I guess they listened to the wrong voices.


Except ganking has gotten harder not easier. So much for your narrative.

So in way you are right, they listened to the wrong voices...and tried to make HS have a broader appeal and looking at the numbers it has failed miserably.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
pajedas
Doomheim
#148 - 2016-10-19 18:05:46 UTC
Teckos Pech wrote:
Except ganking has gotten harder not easier. So much for your narrative.

So in way you are right, they listened to the wrong voices...and tried to make HS have a broader appeal and looking at the numbers it has failed miserably.

Your childlike interpretation of the facts is almost cute.

For the record, you're saying that "ganking is hard"?

🐇
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#149 - 2016-10-19 18:11:33 UTC
Ye gods, there's some people posting in this thread that have absolutely no clue about the kind of game that they're playing.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Gadget Helmsdottir
Gadget's Workshop
#150 - 2016-10-19 18:19:45 UTC
pajedas wrote:

Correct. Eve is set far into the future.

Do not allow "any" weapons into so-called high security space.

They have the technology and future bureaucrats would make it happen.

You're just afraid you might actually have to "work" for a living.



I seriously don't want to get involved in this clown-show, but I do feel the need to point out that EvE is supposed to be a DYSTOPIAN future.



--Supposedly Evil Gadget

Work smarter, not harder. --Scrooge McDuck, an eminent old-Earth economist

Given an hour to save New Eden, how would respected scientist, Albertus Eisenstein compose his thoughts? "Fifty-five minutes to define the problem; save the galaxy in five."
Brokk Witgenstein
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#151 - 2016-10-19 18:25:29 UTC
Yesterday's dystopian future is today.
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#152 - 2016-10-19 18:36:03 UTC
pajedas wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
Except ganking has gotten harder not easier. So much for your narrative.

So in way you are right, they listened to the wrong voices...and tried to make HS have a broader appeal and looking at the numbers it has failed miserably.

Your childlike interpretation of the facts is almost cute.

For the record, you're saying that "ganking is hard"?


I said it was harder. Now you have have to have a fleet with more players, a bumper, and so forth. Before it could be done where you'd pretty much take advantage of people using auto pilot.

And the amusing thing is you insisting that imprudent play should be rewarded.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#153 - 2016-10-19 18:38:28 UTC
pajedas wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
Except ganking has gotten harder not easier. So much for your narrative.

So in way you are right, they listened to the wrong voices...and tried to make HS have a broader appeal and looking at the numbers it has failed miserably.

Your childlike interpretation of the facts is almost cute.

For the record, you're saying that "ganking is hard"?


Its a hell of a lot harder than it used to be.
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#154 - 2016-10-19 18:39:22 UTC
Gadget Helmsdottir wrote:
pajedas wrote:

Correct. Eve is set far into the future.

Do not allow "any" weapons into so-called high security space.

They have the technology and future bureaucrats would make it happen.

You're just afraid you might actually have to "work" for a living.



I seriously don't want to get involved in this clown-show, but I do feel the need to point out that EvE is supposed to be a DYSTOPIAN future.



--Supposedly Evil Gadget


No, no! Don't you see with the wonderful technology and the wonderful bureaucrats of the far future will take care of people in HS like they are little children who need their hand held all the time. Via technology and benevolent leaders who are kind and caring people will remove all risk and concerns for everyone. Utopia will have finally been achieved. Roll

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
pajedas
Doomheim
#155 - 2016-10-19 18:40:37 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Ye gods, there's some people posting in this thread that have absolutely no clue about the kind of game that they're playing.

Truth (RMS 2011.05.31)

Gadget Helmsdottir wrote:
I seriously don't want to get involved in this clown-show, but I do feel the need to point out that EvE is supposed to be a DYSTOPIAN future. (*removed link)

  • You shouldn't call people clowns with the current state of affairs with them.

  • I'm pretty sure they moved past that stage of evolution.

    • 🐇
    SurrenderMonkey
    State Protectorate
    Caldari State
    #156 - 2016-10-19 18:40:40 UTC
    pajedas wrote:
    Teckos Pech wrote:
    Except ganking has gotten harder not easier. So much for your narrative.

    So in way you are right, they listened to the wrong voices...and tried to make HS have a broader appeal and looking at the numbers it has failed miserably.

    Your childlike interpretation of the facts is almost cute.

    For the record, you're saying that "ganking is hard"?


    I think we can all agree that, at a minimum, it's harder than exclusively engaging things that Concord was going to kill anyway. Blink

    "Help, I'm bored with missions!"

    http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
    Teckos Pech
    Hogyoku
    Goonswarm Federation
    #157 - 2016-10-19 18:41:14 UTC
    baltec1 wrote:
    pajedas wrote:
    Teckos Pech wrote:
    Except ganking has gotten harder not easier. So much for your narrative.

    So in way you are right, they listened to the wrong voices...and tried to make HS have a broader appeal and looking at the numbers it has failed miserably.

    Your childlike interpretation of the facts is almost cute.

    For the record, you're saying that "ganking is hard"?


    Its a hell of a lot harder than it used to be.


    Which is why ganking has become something alliances and groups are dedicated too. Yes freighter ganking has always been in game, but the groups like Miniluv and CODE. formed later. Why? Why did it take so long for such groups to form?

    Why has there been no Hulkaggedons in years?

    "The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

    8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
    Owen Levanth
    Sagittarius Unlimited Exploration
    #158 - 2016-10-19 18:44:36 UTC
    Nero Jove wrote:
    All good advice. Just hard to pick up and leave when you call a system home for two years. Fighting options in high security when he is an NPC corp are pretty limited.


    Sounds like this guy is a bot-aspirant. Have you thought of contacting CODE to deal with him? Or if that is too repulsive for you, try to gather 1-2 friends and spool up some ganking characters to beat the everloving **** out of him.
    Jonah Gravenstein
    Machiavellian Space Bastards
    #159 - 2016-10-19 18:52:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
    pajedas wrote:
    Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
    Ye gods, there's some people posting in this thread that have absolutely no clue about the kind of game that they're playing.

    Truth (RMS 2011.05.31)
    What has my character's D.O.B got to do with it? My oldest character was sold a couple of weeks after creating this one.

    I take it that you are aware of the existence of multiple accounts, alts and the practice of selling characters via the character bazaar?

    In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

    New Player FAQ

    Feyd's Survival Pack
    Teckos Pech
    Hogyoku
    Goonswarm Federation
    #160 - 2016-10-19 18:53:40 UTC
    pajedas wrote:
    Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
    Ye gods, there's some people posting in this thread that have absolutely no clue about the kind of game that they're playing.

    Truth (RMS 2011.05.31)


    He was talking about you.

    EVE stands for everyone vs. everyone.

    EVE is in a dystopian future. Try reading some of the fiction articles about what life is like in the game. Even in the democratic Gallente Empire there are some pretty grim stories....and the Caldari...

    And capsuleers are...well our immortality has made us out of touch with our fellow humans who are still planet side.

    "The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

    8 Golden Rules for EVE Online