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Dev Blog: EULA Changes Coming With EVE Online: Ascension

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FOl2TY8
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#281 - 2016-10-12 21:52:32 UTC
Vicata Heth wrote:


Well it would look less like a knee-jerk blanket ban because of RMTers, and more like something that was necessary to protect the game from legal troubles. I know I'd be a lot less inclined to look at this in a negative light if it was made clear that this was necessary because of the new developments around cs:go, etc. From a PR perspective, it would be pretty wise of them to make it clear, if this was the case.


Now one cares about how this looks to you.
Vicata Heth
Sensible People
Sigma Grindset
#282 - 2016-10-12 21:53:14 UTC
Teckos Pech wrote:


You haven't even read about Valve and Seam and their problems have you?

Nope CCP is doing just to troll you and Grath Telkin. Roll

BTW, a reason they may not want to disclose it....don't go looking for trouble. So far CCP has not had an issue over this with State or the Federal U.S. government. Best move....keep it that way.


Because making it clear they did something to stop people from gambling ISK because they believe it's illegal would obviously open them up for legal troubles. Solid logic.
Vicata Heth
Sensible People
Sigma Grindset
#283 - 2016-10-12 21:54:19 UTC
FOl2TY8 wrote:
Vicata Heth wrote:


Well it would look less like a knee-jerk blanket ban because of RMTers, and more like something that was necessary to protect the game from legal troubles. I know I'd be a lot less inclined to look at this in a negative light if it was made clear that this was necessary because of the new developments around cs:go, etc. From a PR perspective, it would be pretty wise of them to make it clear, if this was the case.


Now one cares about how this looks to you.


Irrelevant.
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#284 - 2016-10-12 21:55:47 UTC
Why is anyone surprised by this in the slightest?!
Even I picked up enough about current affairs in-between drunken haze's to have seen this coming from several miles away.

This was a fairly obvious move.

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#285 - 2016-10-12 21:59:32 UTC
Teckos Pech wrote:
AMGSiR wrote:
Querns wrote:
Grath Telkin wrote:
So ban RMT'ers and let the legit sites keep going is what you're saying?

Sites like the eve poker site that has existed for years?

I mean seriously boat, I know you're supposed to carry the hate boner flag for GSF after the war happened but this is dumb, people will still gamble, gambling has been in eve since time began, shutting down the sites that power the community wont do a damn thing to stop it and only serve to hurt the community.

In order for game balance to be restored, all gambling must perish. The game should not be dictated by who has the better out-of-game wealth concentration scheme. Your bloviating about the how casinos "power the community" is no different than Al Capone's soup kitchens.


I find it quite iron you and the other GSF dudebros are talking about gambling sites as if you didn't create your own gambling site only to have it fail, then went on a tirade about how much you all hated gambling sites and wanted to see them gone. Not to mention half your damn alliance gambled on IWI.


Guilt by association is so easy and awesome! Roll


Says the guy who thinks its ok to ban all gambling sites on a guilt by association basis.

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.
KaarBaak
Squirrel Team
#286 - 2016-10-12 22:00:36 UTC
IWI was killed for RMT. But the other was killed for "multiple and sustained breaches of our Developer License Agreement."

I assume that distinction was made for a reason?

KB

Dum Spiro Spero
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#287 - 2016-10-12 22:03:23 UTC
Grath Telkin wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
AMGSiR wrote:
Querns wrote:
Grath Telkin wrote:
So ban RMT'ers and let the legit sites keep going is what you're saying?

Sites like the eve poker site that has existed for years?

I mean seriously boat, I know you're supposed to carry the hate boner flag for GSF after the war happened but this is dumb, people will still gamble, gambling has been in eve since time began, shutting down the sites that power the community wont do a damn thing to stop it and only serve to hurt the community.

In order for game balance to be restored, all gambling must perish. The game should not be dictated by who has the better out-of-game wealth concentration scheme. Your bloviating about the how casinos "power the community" is no different than Al Capone's soup kitchens.


I find it quite iron you and the other GSF dudebros are talking about gambling sites as if you didn't create your own gambling site only to have it fail, then went on a tirade about how much you all hated gambling sites and wanted to see them gone. Not to mention half your damn alliance gambled on IWI.


Guilt by association is so easy and awesome! Roll


Says the guy who thinks its ok to ban all gambling sites on a guilt by association basis.


No, because it represents a potential threat to their business, trying to avoid that threat means they have to allocate time and resources to vetting and auditing these websites.

This was coming for quite awhile now and was obvious to those who knew about other instances of this.

Oh, and for all the "XXX gambling site never did RMT" that is what people thought about IWI and Somer Blink. It isn't like they make it obvious, they try and hide it. Does Eve Bet RMT? I don't know....and neither do you. That is the honest answer.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Vicata Heth
Sensible People
Sigma Grindset
#288 - 2016-10-12 22:05:16 UTC
Teckos Pech wrote:

No, because it represents a potential threat to their business, trying to avoid that threat means they have to allocate time and resources to vetting and auditing these websites.

This was coming for quite awhile now and was obvious to those who knew about other instances of this.

Oh, and for all the "XXX gambling site never did RMT" that is what people thought about IWI and Somer Blink. It isn't like they make it obvious, they try and hide it. Does Eve Bet RMT? I don't know....and neither do you. That is the honest answer.


To be fair, I don't know if anyone in EVE RMTs. Ban EVE.
Querns
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#289 - 2016-10-12 22:05:55 UTC
AMGSiR wrote:
Querns wrote:
Grath Telkin wrote:
So ban RMT'ers and let the legit sites keep going is what you're saying?

Sites like the eve poker site that has existed for years?

I mean seriously boat, I know you're supposed to carry the hate boner flag for GSF after the war happened but this is dumb, people will still gamble, gambling has been in eve since time began, shutting down the sites that power the community wont do a damn thing to stop it and only serve to hurt the community.

In order for game balance to be restored, all gambling must perish. The game should not be dictated by who has the better out-of-game wealth concentration scheme. Your bloviating about the how casinos "power the community" is no different than Al Capone's soup kitchens.


I find it quite ironic you and the other GSF dudebros are talking about gambling sites as if you didn't create your own gambling site only to have it fail, then went on a tirade about how much you all hated gambling sites and wanted to see them gone. Not to mention half your damn alliance gambled on IWI.


Half our alliance gambled on IWI? Interesting admission, and from a Care For Kids character to boot.

And, yes, we did try to create our own gambling site. We did this strictly to generate ISK, and didn't try to cause flak by claiming that our site, failure that it was, was going to do all of this good work by sponsoring community events. That's my issue, and it's a legitimate one.

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
Marsha Mallow
#290 - 2016-10-12 22:05:58 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Why is anyone surprised by this in the slightest?!
Even I picked up enough about current affairs in-between drunken haze's to have seen this coming from several miles away.

This was a fairly obvious move.

Shush, please. The screaming from both sides is delightful.

I do feel a bit bad here for longterm sites like EOH, eve-bet and the older lottos who have a really good rep. But as soon as Somer, IWI and co started throwing that amount of ISK about and being associated with large scale RMT operations, the niche was doomed. Add to that changes in the gaming industry and CCP would be daft not to intervene.

Some clarification for Twitch streamers wrt to giveaways, and a review of selling services such as comms/forums for ISK as well as players hosting Patreon/GoFundMe links might be in order. This isn't an isolated topic.

ps. for all the gons flopping about declaring victory, bear in mind CCP waited until after you got your faces pushed in and your homes burned down before acting on this. Apparently it was so as not to affect the outcome of the war. Really I think they just enjoyed watching you squirm along with the rest of us. So flounce off on your victory chariots, back to Delve or lowsec or wherever. You still lost the north. And 25k useless scrub allies. Might be a worthwhile trade long-term.

Ripard Teg > For the morons in the room:

Sweets > U can dd my face any day
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#291 - 2016-10-12 22:06:58 UTC
Grath Telkin wrote:
Says the guy who thinks its ok to ban all gambling sites on a guilt by association basis.
Guilt by association = history of EULA violations by some major participants?

If this was isolated then it would make sense, but historically it doesn't look to be.
Ruddger
Vande-lay Industries
#292 - 2016-10-12 22:09:11 UTC
Quote:
As for prohibiting gambling...online gambling is illegal in the U.S. It is illegal to use such sites and to run such sites




Everything we do in eve is a gamble. I can buy plex with real money, then gamble it on the market. Or undock in a shuttle and fly around.....


Eve by nature is a gamble, so to compare it to say online poker using real money is silly.
Querns
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#293 - 2016-10-12 22:09:20 UTC
Grath Telkin wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
AMGSiR wrote:
Querns wrote:
Grath Telkin wrote:
So ban RMT'ers and let the legit sites keep going is what you're saying?

Sites like the eve poker site that has existed for years?

I mean seriously boat, I know you're supposed to carry the hate boner flag for GSF after the war happened but this is dumb, people will still gamble, gambling has been in eve since time began, shutting down the sites that power the community wont do a damn thing to stop it and only serve to hurt the community.

In order for game balance to be restored, all gambling must perish. The game should not be dictated by who has the better out-of-game wealth concentration scheme. Your bloviating about the how casinos "power the community" is no different than Al Capone's soup kitchens.


I find it quite iron you and the other GSF dudebros are talking about gambling sites as if you didn't create your own gambling site only to have it fail, then went on a tirade about how much you all hated gambling sites and wanted to see them gone. Not to mention half your damn alliance gambled on IWI.


Guilt by association is so easy and awesome! Roll


Says the guy who thinks its ok to ban all gambling sites on a guilt by association basis.

Don't worry your pretty little head. For just 5 ISK a day, you too can aid starving community initiatives in need.

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#294 - 2016-10-12 22:13:38 UTC
Ruddger wrote:
Quote:
As for prohibiting gambling...online gambling is illegal in the U.S. It is illegal to use such sites and to run such sites




Everything we do in eve is a gamble. I can buy plex with real money, then gamble it on the market. Or undock in a shuttle and fly around.....


Eve by nature is a gamble, so to compare it to say online poker using real money is silly.


So long as it is an in-game item it has no RL value and thus is not gambling.

The problem is when it becomes RMT.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Kaoraku Shayiskhun
Simple Designs
#295 - 2016-10-12 22:18:27 UTC
Toobo wrote:
But again, I stress the point, surely not EVERYONE in the whole process of IWI committed, unless CCP has evidences proving that ALL of them did. I trust some of the bankers I got to know decently through the community, but obviously I cannot say for a fact they RMT or not.


It would the owner's responsibility to prevent RMT. You gave your money for foreings, who are criminals. They got sentenced, their belongings got taken. This is CCP's gaming area. No matter how this thing would work in outside of the game, there this happened. Next time everybody will think twice, who they give their money.
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#296 - 2016-10-12 22:21:20 UTC
Vicata Heth wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:

No, because it represents a potential threat to their business, trying to avoid that threat means they have to allocate time and resources to vetting and auditing these websites.

This was coming for quite awhile now and was obvious to those who knew about other instances of this.

Oh, and for all the "XXX gambling site never did RMT" that is what people thought about IWI and Somer Blink. It isn't like they make it obvious, they try and hide it. Does Eve Bet RMT? I don't know....and neither do you. That is the honest answer.


To be fair, I don't know if anyone in EVE RMTs. Ban EVE.


Roll

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Lyra Everstar
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#297 - 2016-10-12 22:24:07 UTC
The one good thing about this change is it bans isk doublers.
Kaoraku Shayiskhun
Simple Designs
#298 - 2016-10-12 22:26:09 UTC
Teckos Pech wrote:
Ruddger wrote:
Quote:
As for prohibiting gambling...online gambling is illegal in the U.S. It is illegal to use such sites and to run such sites




Everything we do in eve is a gamble. I can buy plex with real money, then gamble it on the market. Or undock in a shuttle and fly around.....


Eve by nature is a gamble, so to compare it to say online poker using real money is silly.


So long as it is an in-game item it has no RL value and thus is not gambling.

The problem is when it becomes RMT.


I think people refered to this article
Elenahina
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#299 - 2016-10-12 22:26:16 UTC
Marsha Mallow wrote:
EVE-Bet Bam wrote:
WTS: Low SP toon mostly sat in Jita for SP farming and corp contracting.

WTB: A level 4 mission or Incursion alt or anything that will make ISK. Oh god please someone help me.

I have 17m, can I help? P


I'll trade you for my catalyst bpo.

Eve is like an addiction; you can't quit it until it quits you. Also, iderno
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#300 - 2016-10-12 22:26:34 UTC
Lyra Everstar wrote:
The one good thing about this change is it bans isk doublers.


How do you figure that?

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online