These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
Previous page123Next page
 

Spying is like cancer (just venting my opinion).

Author
Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari
End of Life
#21 - 2016-10-01 04:14:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Scipio Artelius
Mike Adoulin wrote:
It's good practice for IRL, BTW.

Get that promotion at work, for example.


Really?

That Machiavellian that you spy on your colleagues to get an edge against them for promotion?*



* Disclaimer: If you are actually in intelligence, ignore the above.
Brokk Witgenstein
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#22 - 2016-10-01 04:38:33 UTC
Bumblefck wrote:

Money can't buy everything, you know

That quote has been copyrighted by people with money; that's why poors never use it.
InterStellar Architect
InterStellar Architects Corporation
#23 - 2016-10-01 04:48:38 UTC
Bumblefck wrote:
InterStellar Architect wrote:
Related Sidenote: I've been playing Eve for over five years. I have assets worth over 2 tril, and I will not lose any sleep if I lose a ship worth 100 bil. Or even if I somehow lose my entire wealth (no you can't have my stuff).





Quote:
Likes received: 16




Money can't buy everything, you know


If only I actually care about being liked.
Look at my forum posts and you will see I make no such attempt.
Morgan Agrivar
Doomheim
#24 - 2016-10-01 04:52:32 UTC
InterStellar Architect wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
Entropia Universe is built to allow RMT, it would not work if you could have more than one account, there is a huge difference.

The meta game is all that keeps the game fresh. You might think you don't like it but you would have become bored long ago without it.


Related sidenote: This is what happens to people who leave the game because they can never be totally safe even in high sec. They rage quit loudly and go play some other MMO that doesn't have non-consensual pvp....and get bored really really quick because they are totally safe in that game... They didn't realize that the constant danger while playing EVE made their game experience more valuable, and so they come right back to EVE grumbling the whole way at the unfairness of it all Twisted


Related Sidenote: I've been playing Eve for over five years. I have assets worth over 2 tril, and I will not lose any sleep if I lose a ship worth 100 bil. Or even if I somehow lose my entire wealth (no you can't have my stuff).

This is more like a bittervet rant about a certain aspect of the game that I hate, after playing it for so many years. It is not an illogical rant, because I pointed out Eve Online is a great game, but this is just a certain aspect that I hate.

Unrelated sidenote: I am jealous. I have been playing 3 years and might have 1.3b in isk and assets total.

Wow, I must be doing something really...really wrong in this game.
Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#25 - 2016-10-01 05:20:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Shae Tadaruwa
Morgan Agrivar wrote:
InterStellar Architect wrote:
Related Sidenote: I've been playing Eve for over five years. I have assets worth over 2 tril, and I will not lose any sleep if I lose a ship worth 100 bil. Or even if I somehow lose my entire wealth (no you can't have my stuff)

Unrelated sidenote: I am jealous. I have been playing 3 years and might have 1.3b in isk and assets total.

Wow, I must be doing something really...really wrong in this game.

Yes. Telling the truth.

Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."

Drago Shouna
Doomheim
#26 - 2016-10-01 05:47:22 UTC
InterStellar Architect wrote:
I've been playing Eve for over 5 years and I like the game. But there is a certain aspect of the game that I've developed a hatred towards - that's meta gaming.

I've participated in fleet fights where the fight did not happen because of spies.

Imagine a bunch of guys sitting down at a table playing poker. There are spectators in the background watching, and each competitor has a spy in the spectator area, reporting which cards the opponent has. This is like a perfect analogy to spies in Eve. Nobody would watch or be interested in the world poker tournament if this happened.

Now I am not sure why the spies do it, perhaps because they want to feel important, or maybe for certain ISK incentives.

In Entropia Universe, I read each player can only have one account/character, and if you have more than one character that's a ban-able offense. This would fix the Spy problem, but Eve Online will never be like that because the game is based on pure sandbox. And so many people have multiple accounts already (I have 5 accounts myself).

Eve Online is the only game that I know of, where people involved in alliance / corporation leadership are so uptight about what they say, because they are worried about leaking intel. Basically everyone can be a potential spy, until they are proven not. And even when they are proven not, they can still be a spy.

So my attitude towards all of this is: hey this is a fricking game, don't you get enough of this crap in real life?

Anyway, just I'm just venting about the certain aspect of this game that I hate, anybody feel the same way?



Yes it's a game, now how about NOT using a vile deadly disease as an analogy......

Solecist Project...." They refuse to play by the rules and laws of the game and use it as excuse ..." " They don't care about how you play as long as they get to play how they want."

Welcome to EVE.

Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#27 - 2016-10-01 09:25:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Bumblefck
InterStellar Architect wrote:
If only I actually care about being liked.
Look at my forum posts and you will see I make no such attempt.




*Whoosh*



also, rants are frowned upon

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log

Mike Adoulin
Happys Happy Hamster Hunting Club
#28 - 2016-10-01 11:14:38 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Really?

That Machiavellian that you spy on your colleagues to get an edge against them for promotion?


Sure. It's called 'politics'. People who claim to not play politics at work simply play it badly.


Scipio Artelius wrote:
* Disclaimer: If you are actually in intelligence, ignore the above


Nah, when I was in Intel we saved it for the bad guys.

Also, you have clearly never been in Sales.

Everything in EVE is a trap.

And if it isn't, it's your job to make it a trap...:)

You want to know what immorality in EVE Online looks like? Look no further than Ripard "Jester" Teg.

Chribba is the Chuck Norris of EVE.

Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#29 - 2016-10-01 14:58:10 UTC
To the OP, this is one of the things that ruined the game for me, I had played other games as a very successful leader but in this one the ease of spying based on multiple accounts without doing out of game stuff to counter made it immersion breaking, so I crossed running a corp or alliance off my list of things that are fun. I did build a successful corp and was second in command of a sov holding alliance and tried my hand at a virtual alliance, but saw some stuff while doing that that made me think not worth the time to continue as it was just too easy to break up.

The worst one was using your cap assets as a up and coming alliance, it was nail biting stuff which I suppose gives you a buzz when it comes off, but my god the stress level was just a bit much and some people were like oh my god oh my god the entire time they were in space. Quite funny at times though I have to admit.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

Brokk Witgenstein
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#30 - 2016-10-01 17:00:59 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
To the OP, this is one of the things that ruined the game for me, I had played other games as a very successful leader but in this one the ease of spying based on multiple accounts without doing out of game stuff to counter made it immersion breaking, so I crossed running a corp or alliance off my list of things that are fun. I did build a successful corp and was second in command of a sov holding alliance and tried my hand at a virtual alliance, but saw some stuff while doing that that made me think not worth the time to continue as it was just too easy to break up.

The worst one was using your cap assets as a up and coming alliance, it was nail biting stuff which I suppose gives you a buzz when it comes off, but my god the stress level was just a bit much and some people were like oh my god oh my god the entire time they were in space. Quite funny at times though I have to admit.


This is the best propaganda statement ever. Which other game offers such nail biting action? Last night my hands were shaking man. Nothing on the killboard - neither losses nor kills; yet I was out all night shooting, getting shot at, dodging camps, scanning, alt-tabbing to dotlan to plot an escape hatch ... same goes for fielding caps. Any other game, you'd just grab your biggest boat and start grinding. In EvE, you're already sweating before undocking it, crossing your fingers nothing goes wrong despite all that power at your command. Ahhh... Best of times <3
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#31 - 2016-10-01 19:53:37 UTC
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
To the OP, this is one of the things that ruined the game for me, I had played other games as a very successful leader but in this one the ease of spying based on multiple accounts without doing out of game stuff to counter made it immersion breaking, so I crossed running a corp or alliance off my list of things that are fun. I did build a successful corp and was second in command of a sov holding alliance and tried my hand at a virtual alliance, but saw some stuff while doing that that made me think not worth the time to continue as it was just too easy to break up.

The worst one was using your cap assets as a up and coming alliance, it was nail biting stuff which I suppose gives you a buzz when it comes off, but my god the stress level was just a bit much and some people were like oh my god oh my god the entire time they were in space. Quite funny at times though I have to admit.


This is the best propaganda statement ever. Which other game offers such nail biting action? Last night my hands were shaking man. Nothing on the killboard - neither losses nor kills; yet I was out all night shooting, getting shot at, dodging camps, scanning, alt-tabbing to dotlan to plot an escape hatch ... same goes for fielding caps. Any other game, you'd just grab your biggest boat and start grinding. In EvE, you're already sweating before undocking it, crossing your fingers nothing goes wrong despite all that power at your command. Ahhh... Best of times <3


I understand exactly what you mean, it is the same buzz as a close fight where you end up with a sliver of hull and you are the last one standing. The thing is I was not so keen on the issue of spying being so easy, I wanted my opponents to have to commit not some third party who will utterly crush me, which was not fun at all. I know you will see the difference, I am totally with you, damn that you are my kinda guy because you really get Eve and are not one of these fake Eve players.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#32 - 2016-10-01 20:12:40 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:


I understand exactly what you mean, it is the same buzz as a close fight where you end up with a sliver of hull and you are the last one standing. The thing is I was not so keen on the issue of spying being so easy, I wanted my opponents to have to commit not some third party who will utterly crush me, which was not fun at all. I know you will see the difference, I am totally with you, damn that you are my kinda guy because you really get Eve and are not one of these fake Eve players.


Its only as easy as the target makes it.
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#33 - 2016-10-01 20:51:35 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Mike Adoulin wrote:
It's good practice for IRL, BTW.

Get that promotion at work, for example.


Really?

That Machiavellian that you spy on your colleagues to get an edge against them for promotion?*



* Disclaimer: If you are actually in intelligence, ignore the above.

You've never been to Insider Threats training I see.
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#34 - 2016-10-01 21:11:42 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:


I understand exactly what you mean, it is the same buzz as a close fight where you end up with a sliver of hull and you are the last one standing. The thing is I was not so keen on the issue of spying being so easy, I wanted my opponents to have to commit not some third party who will utterly crush me, which was not fun at all. I know you will see the difference, I am totally with you, damn that you are my kinda guy because you really get Eve and are not one of these fake Eve players.


Its only as easy as the target makes it.


I just found it rather tedious to have to gather real life data for a video game, something I was not prepared to do, so I guess that makes me easy... Shocked

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

Conrad Makbure
Trident Expedition
#35 - 2016-10-02 16:52:09 UTC
On a side note, I'd like to put an entire account on red standings, even if I can't see what pilot goes to what account.
Chopper Rollins
hahahlolspycorp
Brave Collective
#36 - 2016-10-03 04:14:00 UTC
Anyone who thinks spying is easy / risk free / bad for the game has never done it.
It's a hunting play-style that requires patience, self control and organisation.
Great thing about EvE is you can use someone's trust, cost them billions upon billions and like any fight they can say "Well played."
I'm still friends with people i've destroyed, from venture up to captive market level of treachery. Been on both ends of the stick, too.
It's a whole 'nother level of play and if you feel bad about it you should shake it off or just...

Git gud.


Goggles. Making me look good. Making you look good.

L DOPA
Dark 0rder.
#37 - 2016-10-03 09:50:38 UTC
InterStellar Architect wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
Entropia Universe is built to allow RMT, it would not work if you could have more than one account, there is a huge difference.

The meta game is all that keeps the game fresh. You might think you don't like it but you would have become bored long ago without it.


Related sidenote: This is what happens to people who leave the game because they can never be totally safe even in high sec. They rage quit loudly and go play some other MMO that doesn't have non-consensual pvp....and get bored really really quick because they are totally safe in that game... They didn't realize that the constant danger while playing EVE made their game experience more valuable, and so they come right back to EVE grumbling the whole way at the unfairness of it all Twisted


Related Sidenote: I've been playing Eve for over five years. I have assets worth over 2 tril, and I will not lose any sleep if I lose a ship worth 100 bil. Or even if I somehow lose my entire wealth (no you can't have my stuff).

This is more like a bittervet rant about a certain aspect of the game that I hate, after playing it for so many years. It is not an illogical rant, because I pointed out Eve Online is a great game, but this is just a certain aspect that I hate.

Just part of EvE. In Pandemic horde we have spies who relay intel, spies who awox, spies who create warpins for ganks, spies who suss out the best hot drop opportunities, we have spies in comms, we probably even have spies who FC and spies who make us dinner after a long day of being spied on...

Its amusing to be scouting for a fleet or gang and something is said on coms and straight away the enemy fleet takes action to react to what we just said...

While I feel a little embarassed for people who go to such lengths to "win" its an accepted part of life in EvE.

L Dopa : Infinity Ziona
Inxentas Ultramar
Ultramar Independent Contracting
#38 - 2016-10-03 14:53:34 UTC
L DOPA wrote:
While I feel a little embarassed for people who go to such lengths to "win" its an accepted part of life in EvE.


I feel the same way. In general, about Eve. Not knowing whether to applaud going to extreme lengths to win, or not. It does mean the other party must go to equal lengths to even stand a chance. I think a lot of people are willing to put extreme amounts of effort into the game, no matter what aspect, and I'm always lagging behind because I'm just a filthy casual that, well... doesn't.
PopeUrban
El Expedicion
Flames of Exile
#39 - 2016-10-03 19:19:36 UTC  |  Edited by: PopeUrban
You're kidding right? EVE is probably the least metagame risky PvP game I've ever encountered.

Corp history, local, too much live statistical info on the map, the massive insane thing that the EVE API has morphed in to, killboards, all that combines in to a game where there is a lot of free and easy intel floating around.

There's not a whole lot a spy can tell your enemy that you can't reliably source from an algorithm anyway. The fact that people PvP more to pad stats than to actually control space or make a profit is an indication of a systemic problem with intelligence avaliability in EVE. There's so little valuable intel that spies actually have to operate at an insanely high level to do anything useful in the first place.

What's left is limited tactical data or day one fleet comps, which are useful, and can decide a battle, but the fact that you're so starved for content that you find fleet ops cancelled often enough to be irritating is due to the conflict of having a game that thrives on entropy coupled with an information mechanism that gives people entirely too many ways to avoid that entropy in the first place. Assets at risk on the field are a pittance compared to the contents of most alliance's banks. Spies aren't all that dangerous in EVE. Thieves on the other hand are potentially catastrophic against the unprepared. The well being of any entity, from the two man corp up to the largest alliance isn't decided by the performance of its fleets. It's decided by the size of its bank.

Here's an experiment:

Remove local.

Remove the API.

Remove corp histories.

Remove the ability to warp anywhere at all with a combat timer active.

THAT is a situation in which spies are actually a constant threat factor to every organization in the game.

What you have now is just a minor inconvenience and an extended job interview.
Sonya Corvinus
Grant Village
#40 - 2016-10-03 19:25:16 UTC
Mike Adoulin wrote:
Sure. It's called 'politics'. People who claim to not play politics at work simply play it badly.


Or they are good enough at their jobs that they can be effective without lying and spinning stories to get ahead.

But you know, whatever you need to say to justify your actions IRL.
Previous page123Next page