These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Why do people assume how we play the game reflects us in real life?

First post
Author
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#761 - 2016-09-19 07:40:00 UTC
Teckos Pech wrote:
The stupid is strong in this post....

Must CCP include a mechanic so that there is an automatic consequence for everything? Clearly not. Suspect flags bear this out. Further, there is no mechanic that directly penalizes a player for being a fool and overloading his freighter. Instead it is players in both cases that impose consequences. Neither is automatic.

It is consequence free, then pull up your pants an impose some consequences instead of being a *****.
You can't impose consequences of disposable alts in disposable ships. If gankers actually had to put something of value on the line, a lot more people would be happy to hand them consequences. As it stands, anything you do to a gankers as a consequence is irrelevant.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#762 - 2016-09-19 07:43:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Shae Tadaruwa
Lucas Kell wrote:
IYou can't impose consequences of disposable alts

Other than banning the player right?

That is CCP's policy on recycling alts to avoid sec status consequences. Seems like a pretty good consequence.

Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#763 - 2016-09-19 07:46:05 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
The stupid is strong in this post....

Must CCP include a mechanic so that there is an automatic consequence for everything? Clearly not. Suspect flags bear this out. Further, there is no mechanic that directly penalizes a player for being a fool and overloading his freighter. Instead it is players in both cases that impose consequences. Neither is automatic.

It is consequence free, then pull up your pants an impose some consequences instead of being a *****.
You can't impose consequences of disposable alts in disposable ships. If gankers actually had to put something of value on the line, a lot more people would be happy to hand them consequences. As it stands, anything you do to a gankers as a consequence is irrelevant.


There is no such thing as disposable alts or disposable ships.

Frankly, if ganking is so easy and risk free then why are you not ganking the gankers? Their ships are profitable to gank.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#764 - 2016-09-19 07:48:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucas Kell
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:
Other than banning the player right?

That is CCP's policy on recycling alts to avoide sec status consequences. Seems like a pretty good consequence.
But there are no sec status consequences if your alt is designed to be disposable, so you can happily continue on with that alt for as long as you want. Also, you can just ramp the sec status back up to zero then delete it when you are done. Additionally I've seen people delete and remake negative sec status alts and not once seen someone banned or even warned for it.

The point is that all the time alts with limited skills and no other goal but to gank are used, pretending there are consequences for ganking is laughable. You don't even have to pay clone costs for getting podded anymore since CCP buffed ganking by removing clone grades.

baltec1 wrote:
There is no such thing as disposable alts or disposable ships.

Frankly, if ganking is so easy and risk free then why are you not ganking the gankers? Their ships are profitable to gank.
Of course there is, don't be ridiculous. Ganking profit is based on target selection. I find it odd that you continue to use such terrible arguments and think you're actually making a point. If anything your sarcasm is disproving the points you're trying to make.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Giaus Felix
Doomheim
#765 - 2016-09-19 07:51:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Giaus Felix
Dracvlad wrote:
Well I start from a point of view of being respectful, but if someone starts being an ass then I give it back to them, there was one thread where I went after someone from the off, but I did add an edit that I was being a bit harsh with him. So yes holier then thou.

So many gankers and ganker aligned players sprout the same rubbish, the purity of Eve being one such line. For me Eve is a challenge, it should not be easy, I happen to think due to my activities in game doing AG stuff that some of the mechanics make it too easy for gankers and would like some hardness put in their face. For you lot that is what, changing the purity of Eve, for me they have already got around the purity of Eve for having such non-existent risk for such huge gains.

HTFU is CCP's tagline, however that should apply to everyone, especially gankers...

Well I paid for my accounts with RL money, I find grinding too much of a pain and I hate invention with a passion, I looked at certain things and decided that Eve was not worth supporting with RL cash due to CCP's failure in certain areas which is why from the 6th October you won't see me on the forums which will make you happy.

For me the fun part is seeing exactly what I expected to happen with their player base happening and yet I am sad because I put a lot of time into the game, had some great times and met a lot of great people, but not on the Eve forums... Lol well some....
Your past actions speak way louder than your current words Shocked

Your moral high ground is built upon sand, without the use of a proper foundation it's likely to collapse, IMHO you failed to used one.

What you see as rubbish others see as valuable, as I stated earlier in the thread subjectivity is a wonderful thing.

Why should HTFU apply more to one group than it does the others?

Not paying a sub is unlikely to stop you posting on the forums, come the rise of the alpha clones, ie unsubbed accounts, and you'll be back spouting your usual line of "thought".

I came for the spaceships, I stayed for the tears.

Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#766 - 2016-09-19 07:56:41 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:
Other than banning the player right?

That is CCP's policy on recycling alts to avoide sec status consequences. Seems like a pretty good consequence.
But there are no sec status consequences if your alt is designed to be disposable,....

What BS conspiracy are you on about now?

This explains a lot:

https://puu.sh/rgnh6/4a18b44542.jpg

Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."

Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#767 - 2016-09-19 07:58:23 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
The stupid is strong in this post....

Must CCP include a mechanic so that there is an automatic consequence for everything? Clearly not. Suspect flags bear this out. Further, there is no mechanic that directly penalizes a player for being a fool and overloading his freighter. Instead it is players in both cases that impose consequences. Neither is automatic.

It is consequence free, then pull up your pants an impose some consequences instead of being a *****.
You can't impose consequences of disposable alts in disposable ships. If gankers actually had to put something of value on the line, a lot more people would be happy to hand them consequences. As it stands, anything you do to a gankers as a consequence is irrelevant.



Jesus, you just stop over loading your freighter. That's it. That is all that needs to be done. You are so blind on this one.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online

Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#768 - 2016-09-19 08:00:47 UTC
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
IYou can't impose consequences of disposable alts

Other than banning the player right?

That is CCP's policy on recycling alts to avoid sec status consequences. Seems like a pretty good consequence.


No don't fall into Lucas' lie. The issue is that there does not need to be consequences...just take away the ******* opportunity. Don't over load the ******* freighter.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online

oiukhp Muvila
Doomheim
#769 - 2016-09-19 08:02:58 UTC
Teckos Pech wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
The stupid is strong in this post....

Must CCP include a mechanic so that there is an automatic consequence for everything? Clearly not. Suspect flags bear this out. Further, there is no mechanic that directly penalizes a player for being a fool and overloading his freighter. Instead it is players in both cases that impose consequences. Neither is automatic.

It is consequence free, then pull up your pants an impose some consequences instead of being a *****.
You can't impose consequences of disposable alts in disposable ships. If gankers actually had to put something of value on the line, a lot more people would be happy to hand them consequences. As it stands, anything you do to a gankers as a consequence is irrelevant.



Jesus, you just stop over loading your freighter. That's it. That is all that needs to be done. You are so blind on this one.



You mean the empty ones, that are not on autopilot and just happen to not have a webbing char available atm.
Yeah, even empty actively piloted Freighters get ganked.

But I'm sure you knew that.

Elite Harvester
Elite Harvesters
#770 - 2016-09-19 08:03:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Elite Harvester
Lucas Kell wrote:
But there are no sec status consequences if your alt is designed to be disposable, so you can happily continue on with that alt for as long as you want.

While being -10 and legally attackable by anyone else while simultaneously being hunted by faction police, right? That's not a consequence at all... Nope. Sure isn't. Lol
Lucas Kell wrote:
Also, you can just ramp the sec status back up to zero then delete it when you are done.

For a price, of course. But, in your mind that's not a cost, right? Somehow the character in question is still "just disposable." Lol
Lucas Kell wrote:
The point is that all the time alts with limited skills and no other goal but to gank are used, pretending there are consequences for ganking is laughable. You don't even have to pay clone costs for getting podded anymore since CCP buffed ganking by removing clone grades.

Oh, right. How could I forget? Clone grades were only usable by ganking characters. Silly me. Lol
Lucas Kell wrote:
I find it odd that you continue to use such terrible arguments and think you're actually making a point.

Oh, the irony. Lol

Visit www.MinerBumping.com to find out how you can help save Highsec.

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#771 - 2016-09-19 08:04:39 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:


baltec1 wrote:
There is no such thing as disposable alts or disposable ships.

Frankly, if ganking is so easy and risk free then why are you not ganking the gankers? Their ships are profitable to gank.
Of course there is, don't be ridiculous. Ganking profit is based on target selection. I find it odd that you continue to use such terrible arguments and think you're actually making a point. If anything your sarcasm is disproving the points you're trying to make.


There wasn't any sarcasm there. All ganking ships can be ganked for profit so why don't you do it? You keep on saying how easy and consequence free it is.
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#772 - 2016-09-19 08:04:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Teckos Pech
oiukhp Muvila wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
The stupid is strong in this post....

Must CCP include a mechanic so that there is an automatic consequence for everything? Clearly not. Suspect flags bear this out. Further, there is no mechanic that directly penalizes a player for being a fool and overloading his freighter. Instead it is players in both cases that impose consequences. Neither is automatic.

It is consequence free, then pull up your pants an impose some consequences instead of being a *****.
You can't impose consequences of disposable alts in disposable ships. If gankers actually had to put something of value on the line, a lot more people would be happy to hand them consequences. As it stands, anything you do to a gankers as a consequence is irrelevant.



Jesus, you just stop over loading your freighter. That's it. That is all that needs to be done. You are so blind on this one.



You mean the empty ones, that are not on autopilot and just happen to not have a webbing char available atm.
Yeah, even empty actively piloted Freighters get ganked.

But I'm sure you knew that.



And how many of those are there?

Edit: To be clear....

How many freighters passing through Uedama get ganked out of all the freighters passing through Uedama? Of those how many are empty?

Seriously, does it happen? I'm sure it does. Does it happen often? Probably not.

So, again....stop overloading your freighters. Use a scout. Be prudent. And you won't get ganked.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online

Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#773 - 2016-09-19 08:10:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Shae Tadaruwa
oiukhp Muvila wrote:
You mean the empty ones, that are not on autopilot and just happen to not have a webbing char available atm.

On your 96% zkill dangerous main, how many times after killing a pod, or a shuttle, or blobbing someone alone do you blame your fleet rather than the guy who was dumb enough to get caught?

If the guy doesn't have a webbing alt and falls on the wrong side of that decision, then that's surely just as much the fault of the freighter pilot as it is the guy in a pod who warps straight to gate and lands in a bubble.

Neither deserve any sympathy.

Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."

Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#774 - 2016-09-19 08:12:49 UTC
Elite Harvester wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
But there are no sec status consequences if your alt is designed to be disposable, so you can happily continue on with that alt for as long as you want.

While being -10 and legally attackable by anyone else while simultaneously being hunted by faction police, right? That's not a consequence at all... Nope. Sure isn't. Lol
Lucas Kell wrote:
Also, you can just ramp the sec status back up to zero then delete it when you are done.

For a price, of course. But, in your mind that's not a cost, right? Somehow the character in question is still "just disposable." Lol
Lucas Kell wrote:
The point is that all the time alts with limited skills and no other goal but to gank are used, pretending there are consequences for ganking is laughable. You don't even have to pay clone costs for getting podded anymore since CCP buffed ganking by removing clone grades.

Oh, right. How could I forget? Clone grades were only usable by ganking characters. Silly me. Lol
Lucas Kell wrote:
I find it odd that you continue to use such terrible arguments and think you're actually making a point.

Oh, the irony. Lol


Lucas does not grasp the basic concept of cost, let alone opportunity cost.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online

Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#775 - 2016-09-19 08:22:05 UTC
Elite Harvester wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
But there are no sec status consequences if your alt is designed to be disposable, so you can happily continue on with that alt for as long as you want.

While being -10 and legally attackable by anyone else while simultaneously being hunted by faction police, right? That's not a consequence at all... Nope. Sure isn't. Lol
Lucas Kell wrote:
Also, you can just ramp the sec status back up to zero then delete it when you are done.

For a price, of course. But, in your mind that's not a cost, right? Somehow the character in question is still "just disposable." Lol
Lucas Kell wrote:
The point is that all the time alts with limited skills and no other goal but to gank are used, pretending there are consequences for ganking is laughable. You don't even have to pay clone costs for getting podded anymore since CCP buffed ganking by removing clone grades.

Oh, right. How could I forget? Clone grades were only usable by ganking characters. Silly me. Lol
Lucas Kell wrote:
I find it odd that you continue to use such terrible arguments and think you're actually making a point.

Oh, the irony. Lol


If that alt is just used for ganking it is no consequence, that is of course why AG players don't gank, one of the obvious points that gankers and ganker aligned players ignore when saying you can gank tooo....

The cost of getting security status back to 0 is nothing for the amount of ISK they make.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#776 - 2016-09-19 08:24:49 UTC
Giaus Felix wrote:
Why should HTFU apply more to one group than it does the others?.


Actually you should read the sentence again, it was that HTFU should be applied to everyone and especially the gankers, meaning that gankers actually don't HTFU currently based on the mechanics I detailed... Roll

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

Elite Harvester
Elite Harvesters
#777 - 2016-09-19 08:25:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Elite Harvester
Dracvlad wrote:
The cost of getting security status back to 0 is nothing for the amount of ISK they make.

They only make as much ISK as someone puts in their cargohold. Lol

Case in point: Ganking is only as easy and as profitable as the target makes it. Blink

Visit www.MinerBumping.com to find out how you can help save Highsec.

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#778 - 2016-09-19 08:35:45 UTC
Quote:


If that alt is just used for ganking it is no consequence, that is of course why AG players don't gank, one of the obvious points that gankers and ganker aligned players ignore when saying you can gank tooo....

The cost of getting security status back to 0 is nothing for the amount of ISK they make.


So because a ganker chooses to take on the consequences of ganking and locks his character into just that one activity in highsec these consequences stop being consequences...

As for the tags comment, do you even know the cost of buying the tags needed to get yourself from -10 to 0?
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#779 - 2016-09-19 08:48:55 UTC
Elite Harvester wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
The cost of getting security status back to 0 is nothing for the amount of ISK they make.

They only make as much ISK as someone puts in their cargohold. Lol

Case in point: Ganking is only as easy and as profitable as the target makes it. Blink


Lol

Still it is absolutely zero risk and massive rewards... ShockedRoll

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

oiukhp Muvila
Doomheim
#780 - 2016-09-19 09:03:47 UTC  |  Edited by: oiukhp Muvila
Dracvlad wrote:
Elite Harvester wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
The cost of getting security status back to 0 is nothing for the amount of ISK they make.

They only make as much ISK as someone puts in their cargohold. Lol

Case in point: Ganking is only as easy and as profitable as the target makes it. Blink


Lol

Still it is absolutely zero risk and massive rewards... ShockedRoll



Yeah the few times I've ganked mission runners or Orcas in high sec was because I was bored.
The losses and penalties were essentially non existent.

Oh noes, I lost a 10 mil isk catalyst and some sec status! Well, that will certainly put a dent in my 50 bil wallet. Roll
Love you Skill Extractor mechanic! and especially Security Tags!

Consequences of a night a ganking fixed with a 5 min visit to your local security office.