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Dev blog: Command Bursts and the New World of Fleet Boosting

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Laurens Punani
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1341 - 2016-09-17 06:21:34 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
yet people already use boost fit orcas in belts -.-

and by "not sure" its not they don't know how the server will treat it but that they are not sure if they are going to make it so you go suspect.




they do... in HIGH SEC which is only a small part of all mining ops. In Low- or Nullsec, people dont field them .(partly because there is no point right now...)

But Balder Verdandi in not completly right... in Sov-Null and Highsec people are gonna field Rorquals and Orcas. It's just not feasable to do it in Lowsec or NRDS space or ANYWHERE you are not completly sure you are safe or can be safed.

as i said earlier (it must have been 10 pages ago :D ) if there was no need to siege the rorqual, people might be able to safe it and therefore field it. (if they dont watch the intel or dont warp off if a WH pops up you can still kill them tho) (same goes fot the orca... thats why i said Balder is not right ;) )

- T2 Industrial Core (while active)

+30% bonus to Mining Foreman Burst strength
combine that with 15% overall bonus from skills and people being boosted by a porpoise might have to mine significantly longer than rorqual boosted people, who will ALSO be able to mine more ore due to Mining-Fighters

--> More work for less minerals. a great way to promote the industrial part of the game for new players :D Well Played CCP :D
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#1342 - 2016-09-17 07:31:49 UTC
Balder Verdandi wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:

if you don't have enough to feel safe using it use the new one they are adding. it's only a what 5% dip?



It's quite a bit more than that. The numbers have been posted already and we're talking on the order of roughly 10% to 20% loss compared to what we were previously getting. The range boost loss is a good example:

Previous: 25.7km

Now: 23km

25.7-23=2.7 or roughly a 10.5% loss in range.


Now if this is supposed to HELP miners, and new players that want to mine, I want the devs to explain how the loss is supposed to help. The numbers and math don't lie.



Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:

also why are you becoming suspect fozzie even said they are not sure if combat boosts will flag you....




These are active boosts, which means you're basically "shooting" them from the new high slot boosting device. Now the way I understand this is if you shoot the boosts, it's a form of combat the way current game mechanics work, and will flag you as suspect. Even Fozzie isn't sure that you won't get flagged suspect, so that tells you:

1. This new boosting mechanic has NOT been the subject of serious thought.

2. This new boosting mechanic has NOT been prepared for testing, and has clearly NOT been tested otherwise Fozzie and the groupies would know.

3. The balance of game play using an Orca has gone from no risk/high reward to high risk/low reward. Unless the Orca gets a major update, no one will use the Orca for boosts because no one wants to lose a boost fitted Orca worth at least 1.5b ISK. In effect, CCP has done to the Orca what it's done to the Rorqual.




All this speculation no facts

He said that they're not sure if they want it to yet which means it could be implemented that way but it also might not.

I love your arbitrary descriptions too, instead of using bland words like low high and medium, let's have some numbers?

Art of Explosions
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#1343 - 2016-09-17 07:33:27 UTC
Laurens Punani wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
yet people already use boost fit orcas in belts -.-

and by "not sure" its not they don't know how the server will treat it but that they are not sure if they are going to make it so you go suspect.




they do... in HIGH SEC which is only a small part of all mining ops. In Low- or Nullsec, people dont field them .(partly because there is no point right now...)

But Balder Verdandi in not completly right... in Sov-Null and Highsec people are gonna field Rorquals and Orcas. It's just not feasable to do it in Lowsec or NRDS space or ANYWHERE you are not completly sure you are safe or can be safed.

as i said earlier (it must have been 10 pages ago :D ) if there was no need to siege the rorqual, people might be able to safe it and therefore field it. (if they dont watch the intel or dont warp off if a WH pops up you can still kill them tho) (same goes fot the orca... thats why i said Balder is not right ;) )

- T2 Industrial Core (while active)

+30% bonus to Mining Foreman Burst strength
combine that with 15% overall bonus from skills and people being boosted by a porpoise might have to mine significantly longer than rorqual boosted people, who will ALSO be able to mine more ore due to Mining-Fighters

--> More work for less minerals. a great way to promote the industrial part of the game for new players :D Well Played CCP :D


As I've tried to explain to you multiple times already, more work for less minerals means prices go up. People pay for the effort required to mine the minerals, not the actual mineral itself.

Art of Explosions
Lugh Crow-Slave
#1344 - 2016-09-17 07:59:39 UTC
What do you mean ppl didn't use orcas in belts out in null? That is where I was talking about before the mtu we would use them all the time. After the mtu was added there was no need anymore so they stayed in the position.


Like I said I have no issue with the orca/rorqual getting a buff if it is needed, however we will need to see if that is the case

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
TrinityNZXT
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1345 - 2016-09-17 10:02:11 UTC
Just so I understand correctly that the leadership skills are going away, does this mean I know longer need to have the following skills to get maximum boost for range, yield, and cycle time:

Mining Foreman 5
Mining Director 5
Ware Link Specialist 5

Just want to understand this a tad more, and if I will no longer need these skills will CCP refund the SP associated with them?

Thanks much,

Trinity
HandelsPharmi
Pharmi on CharBazaar
#1346 - 2016-09-17 10:12:01 UTC
TrinityNZXT wrote:
Just so I understand correctly that the leadership skills are going away, does this mean I know longer need to have the following skills to get maximum boost for range, yield, and cycle time:

Mining Foreman 5
Mining Director 5
Ware Link Specialist 5

Just want to understand this a tad more, and if I will no longer need these skills will CCP refund the SP associated with them?

Thanks much,

Trinity


Leadership, Wing Commander and Fleet Commander for maximum range!
TrinityNZXT
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1347 - 2016-09-17 10:14:25 UTC
So i will no longer need the 3 skills i listed above for cycle time and yield per cycle? I don't understand this sorry.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#1348 - 2016-09-17 10:25:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
TrinityNZXT wrote:
So i will no longer need the 3 skills i listed above for cycle time and yield per cycle? I don't understand this sorry.


Yes You will.

Leadership wing command and fleet command are no longer needed to boost a fleet but they will boost your range

The yield bonus from mining Forman is being removed but you still need the skill to use the boosts

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
HandelsPharmi
Pharmi on CharBazaar
#1349 - 2016-09-17 10:34:41 UTC  |  Edited by: HandelsPharmi
TrinityNZXT wrote:
So i will no longer need the 3 skills i listed above for cycle time and yield per cycle? I don't understand this sorry.


Have you read this already?

https://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/command-bursts/?utm_source=discussion&utm_medium=eveforum&utm_campaign
TrinityNZXT
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1350 - 2016-09-17 11:01:13 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
TrinityNZXT wrote:
So i will no longer need the 3 skills i listed above for cycle time and yield per cycle? I don't understand this sorry.


Yes You will.

Leadership wing command and fleet command are no longer needed to boost a fleet but they will boost your range

The yield bonus from mining Forman is being removed but you still need the skill to use the boosts



what about warfare link specialst for the 10% bonus to the mining boosts will i need that still?
Lugh Crow-Slave
#1351 - 2016-09-17 11:08:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
TrinityNZXT wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
TrinityNZXT wrote:
So i will no longer need the 3 skills i listed above for cycle time and yield per cycle? I don't understand this sorry.


Yes You will.

Leadership wing command and fleet command are no longer needed to boost a fleet but they will boost your range

The yield bonus from mining Forman is being removed but you still need the skill to use the boosts



what about warfare link specialst for the 10% bonus to the mining boosts will i need that still?


if you want 10% bonus to your.... you know what go read the blog there is a table at the bottom that shows you what skills do what after the change

But if you are just using it for mining probably not iirc it's just cycle time

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
TrinityNZXT
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1352 - 2016-09-17 11:09:52 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
TrinityNZXT wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
TrinityNZXT wrote:
So i will no longer need the 3 skills i listed above for cycle time and yield per cycle? I don't understand this sorry.


Yes You will.

Leadership wing command and fleet command are no longer needed to boost a fleet but they will boost your range

The yield bonus from mining Forman is being removed but you still need the skill to use the boosts



what about warfare link specialst for the 10% bonus to the mining boosts will i need that still?


if you want 10% bonus to your.... you know what go read the blog there is a table at the bottom that shows you what skills do what after the change



It doesn't say anything about the warfare link specialist skill
Lugh Crow-Slave
#1353 - 2016-09-17 11:11:22 UTC
TrinityNZXT wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
TrinityNZXT wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
TrinityNZXT wrote:
So i will no longer need the 3 skills i listed above for cycle time and yield per cycle? I don't understand this sorry.


Yes You will.

Leadership wing command and fleet command are no longer needed to boost a fleet but they will boost your range

The yield bonus from mining Forman is being removed but you still need the skill to use the boosts



what about warfare link specialst for the 10% bonus to the mining boosts will i need that still?


if you want 10% bonus to your.... you know what go read the blog there is a table at the bottom that shows you what skills do what after the change



It doesn't say anything about the warfare link specialist skill


Yes it does 10%reduction to cycle time

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
TrinityNZXT
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1354 - 2016-09-17 11:13:15 UTC


Ok so I still need that skill at 5. sorry im only 13 its hard to understand this.
Laurens Punani
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1355 - 2016-09-17 12:15:16 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
Laurens Punani wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
yet people already use boost fit orcas in belts -.-

and by "not sure" its not they don't know how the server will treat it but that they are not sure if they are going to make it so you go suspect.




they do... in HIGH SEC which is only a small part of all mining ops. In Low- or Nullsec, people dont field them .(partly because there is no point right now...)

But Balder Verdandi in not completly right... in Sov-Null and Highsec people are gonna field Rorquals and Orcas. It's just not feasable to do it in Lowsec or NRDS space or ANYWHERE you are not completly sure you are safe or can be safed.

as i said earlier (it must have been 10 pages ago :D ) if there was no need to siege the rorqual, people might be able to safe it and therefore field it. (if they dont watch the intel or dont warp off if a WH pops up you can still kill them tho) (same goes fot the orca... thats why i said Balder is not right ;) )

- T2 Industrial Core (while active)

+30% bonus to Mining Foreman Burst strength
combine that with 15% overall bonus from skills and people being boosted by a porpoise might have to mine significantly longer than rorqual boosted people, who will ALSO be able to mine more ore due to Mining-Fighters

--> More work for less minerals. a great way to promote the industrial part of the game for new players :D Well Played CCP :D


As I've tried to explain to you multiple times already, more work for less minerals means prices go up. People pay for the effort required to mine the minerals, not the actual mineral itself.




You really are as stupid as i thought :D

More work for less minerals in Lowsec und NRDS space while Sov-Null gets MORE minerals for LESS work means the price will stay roughly the same. Since its less effort for me and other sov-null industrials and more effort for Lowsec and NRDS Industrialists i will get paid more and Lowsec and NRDS-Industrialists will get paid less...

not that difficult, he?
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#1356 - 2016-09-17 12:36:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Tsukino Stareine
No, they get the SAME minerals for MORE work

Solo miners get LESS minerals for the SAME work

Art of Explosions
Laurens Punani
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1357 - 2016-09-17 13:51:46 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
No, they get the SAME minerals for MORE work

Solo miners get LESS minerals for the SAME work



They dont siege rorquals --> LESS minerals
I siege a rorqual --> More minerals

--> Lowsec and NRDS get less money for more work

solo miners dont get any boosts --> Almost no minerals for the same amount of work.
get your facts right son
TrinityNZXT
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1358 - 2016-09-17 14:08:09 UTC
I mine in null with 7 toons and a rorq booster. I like billions.
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#1359 - 2016-09-17 18:21:36 UTC
Laurens Punani wrote:
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
No, they get the SAME minerals for MORE work

Solo miners get LESS minerals for the SAME work



They dont siege rorquals --> LESS minerals
I siege a rorqual --> More minerals

--> Lowsec and NRDS get less money for more work

solo miners dont get any boosts --> Almost no minerals for the same amount of work.
get your facts right son


how is the current 97% yield bonus from a sieged rorqual LESS than the maximum proposed boost of 57% ???

Like do you know what you're talking about, AT ALL?

Art of Explosions
HandelsPharmi
Pharmi on CharBazaar
#1360 - 2016-09-17 18:35:33 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
Laurens Punani wrote:
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
No, they get the SAME minerals for MORE work

Solo miners get LESS minerals for the SAME work



They dont siege rorquals --> LESS minerals
I siege a rorqual --> More minerals

--> Lowsec and NRDS get less money for more work

solo miners dont get any boosts --> Almost no minerals for the same amount of work.
get your facts right son


how is the current 97% yield bonus from a sieged rorqual LESS than the maximum proposed boost of 57% ???

Like do you know what you're talking about, AT ALL?


The roqual bonus will be more, with a T2 industrial core than now.
But the effect of the Mining Mindlink will be lost (so around 85 % without the imp, but a little bit more with a T2 rorqual).