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Matari: Where are we now and where are we headed?
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Felise Selunix
Keyholder Investment Group
#241 - 2016-09-13 06:33:23 UTC
Elmund Egivand wrote:
Felise Selunix wrote:
Arrendis wrote:
Neph wrote:
EDIT: Also, I think the Republic and the State would both stand to gain from greater economic ties. It's a first step to strengthening bonds with the Federation after that stupid war and also to bring the Republic into a stronger interclusteral position. Frankly, I think the more trade, the more peace. After all, you don't want to shoot the guy you're earning a living off of.


I completely agree - but the military balance of power prevents either side from seeking significant economic ties with the other.


Well, at least the significant economic ties that show up on official ledgers at least Blink

The good thing about military stalemates is that it provides a stable platform upon which to maneuver in areas outside of obvious military issues, for the people in the know anyway. Perhaps a third party might be able to facilitate shall we say...non-traditional economic relationships?


Such a third party already exists. It's called 'CONCORD'. CONCORD is also the reason why the cluster hasn't broken out into a full-fledged war, with hostilities confined to the lowsec systems under the Emergency Militia War Powers Act.


Oh, yeah, yeah. They definitely keep the military balance in place and facilitate trade the the Powers Act, but I was thinking more about Neph's point about strengthening economic bonds between 'adversaries.' CONCORD can't make it politically acceptable to initiate any open trade between us and the State, not in any organized fashion anyhow. I was thinking more about maybe some private actors in the market, maybe private corporate interests that might be able to balance those relationships, maybe a trusted NGO of some sort, or maybe the type of organization that's used to moving goods, 'discreetly?'

Just some thoughts.
Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#242 - 2016-09-13 06:35:10 UTC
Matar Ronin wrote:
Just perhaps you misunderstand or I say it poorly. I am referring to a vassal state arrangement, between the Big Eight and the slavery cult empire. The Caldari State system does not allow for the citizens to have direct input on how the megacorps run the government. The terms of the mutual aide agrrement has never been distributed, no one here on IGS can provide a full copy but many here will say that the empress makes requests and does not make demands, lol. Offered by someone who clearly has had little direct involvement with amarr holders and the ruling class. Basing vassalage on land for individuals would undermine the Caldari system from the point of view of the megacorps so that is not going to happen again. Lesson learned from Mordu.

If the slavery cultists were offering land to the Big Eight, baseliners and capsuleers would be hard pressed to learn of it, not exactly a vigorous free press in the Caldari State. What we do know is that the Caldari State needed an ally and the slavery cultists view everyone else as body and souls to reclaim for their sadistic evil diety. It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out how this will end, even though I must admit I actually am a rocket scientists, lol.


So-- what you're positing is a conspiracy within the Big Eight to trade Caldari sovereignty for ... what? Help against the Gallente?

They get that for free.

Even if it were so, the Caldari people have already risen up against corporate rule in recent memory. They trust authority more than some other nationalities, but they're not exactly passive.

That kind of betrayal would result in a very fast revolt, a few cups of tea, and--

Well. I know of some Amarr who do actually kind of hope the Caldari State will one day peacefully convert to the Amarrian faith and join the Empire. I'm afraid they're being a little optimistic. The Citadel region of Caldari space isn't called that because someone was being creative and thought it looked like a castle. It's literally a military fortification, an entire built-up region prepared specifically to repel invaders. As far as I'm aware, it's never been called to full wartime alert. I'm also pretty sure, knowing the Caldari, that this doesn't at all imply that they're not ready to use it.

These observations aren't unrelated. The Caldari invitation to those who would change them from outside kind of boils down to: "Bring it on."
Elmund Egivand
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#243 - 2016-09-13 07:00:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Elmund Egivand
Felise Selunix wrote:
Elmund Egivand wrote:
Felise Selunix wrote:
Arrendis wrote:
Neph wrote:
EDIT: Also, I think the Republic and the State would both stand to gain from greater economic ties. It's a first step to strengthening bonds with the Federation after that stupid war and also to bring the Republic into a stronger interclusteral position. Frankly, I think the more trade, the more peace. After all, you don't want to shoot the guy you're earning a living off of.


I completely agree - but the military balance of power prevents either side from seeking significant economic ties with the other.


Well, at least the significant economic ties that show up on official ledgers at least Blink

The good thing about military stalemates is that it provides a stable platform upon which to maneuver in areas outside of obvious military issues, for the people in the know anyway. Perhaps a third party might be able to facilitate shall we say...non-traditional economic relationships?


Such a third party already exists. It's called 'CONCORD'. CONCORD is also the reason why the cluster hasn't broken out into a full-fledged war, with hostilities confined to the lowsec systems under the Emergency Militia War Powers Act.


Oh, yeah, yeah. They definitely keep the military balance in place and facilitate trade the the Powers Act, but I was thinking more about Neph's point about strengthening economic bonds between 'adversaries.' CONCORD can't make it politically acceptable to initiate any open trade between us and the State, not in any organized fashion anyhow. I was thinking more about maybe some private actors in the market, maybe private corporate interests that might be able to balance those relationships, maybe a trusted NGO of some sort, or maybe the type of organization that's used to moving goods, 'discreetly?'

Just some thoughts.


CONCORD can't do it without pissing off everyone else, so they did the next best thing: Installing SCC as the comptroller of all trades and provide the platform for adversaries to trade with each other without supervision and in a way that's too easily lost under the red tape. Then disavow that such trades are taking place under their watch.

And then there's Interbus, who couldn't care about where the money comes from and where the goods are going for as long as they are getting paid for the job. If Interbus wouldn't suffice, there's also Red Frog and Push Industries, though far as I know, only capsuleers use their services.

So as long as we do not make it too bloody obvious that adversaries are exchanging goods and information with each other, everyone can disavow that such exchanges are taking place and go back to flinging mud at each other in Yulai.

A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.
Eve Talaminada
Chao3
#244 - 2016-09-13 07:43:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Eve Talaminada
The Minmatar Republic is currently meek, and spineless.

The collaborationist policies of the Republic toward Amarr must stop, and we will not recognize its authority while it is trying to buy peace and wealth while allowing our tribesfolks to remain enslaved.

The only viable path for all tribes to bring the Day of Light is to stop all compromise of principles and back room deals with Amarrs.

Many in the tribes have lost track of who we really are, some have been lured by greed, and participate and/or condone the harvesting of the moons, the very act that brought the Day of Darkness upon us all, while others carry ambivalent allegiances, exchanging with Amarrs information and/or goods, instead of using the Khumaaks to crack their skulls, the same way Drupar Maak did at the start of the great rebellion.

I am an outcast. and it is as much because I chose to reject what most of our people have become as it is for the mark of the Pale Eye I received at my Voluval. But the Pale Eye has opened my mind so I can look unto the souls of the warriors we need in order to rise once more to greatness: uncompromising, lethal and fiercely loyal to our cause. Only when those become an army can we change our destiny and roam freely the space of New Eden like we used to roam the plains of Matar instead of submitting to the imperialistic influences of other races.

This is what our minarchist revolution stands for. This is the only path toward the advent of the Day of Light.

Talaminada's Voluval
Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#245 - 2016-09-13 14:09:42 UTC
Eve Talaminada wrote:
The Minmatar Republic is currently meek, and spineless.

The collaborationist policies of the Republic toward Amarr must stop, and we will not recognize its authority while it is trying to buy peace and wealth while allowing our tribesfolks to remain enslaved.

The only viable path for all tribes to bring the Day of Light is to stop all compromise of principles and back room deals with Amarrs.

Many in the tribes have lost track of who we really are, some have been lured by greed, and participate and/or condone the harvesting of the moons, the very act that brought the Day of Darkness upon us all, while others carry ambivalent allegiances, exchanging with Amarrs information and/or goods, instead of using the Khumaaks to crack their skulls, the same way Drupar Maak did at the start of the great rebellion.

I am an outcast. and it is as much because I chose to reject what most of our people have become as it is for the mark of the Pale Eye I received at my Voluval. But the Pale Eye has opened my mind so I can look unto the souls of the warriors we need to have to be able to rise to greatness again: uncompromising, lethal and fiercely loyal to our cause. Only when those become an army can we change our destiny and roam freely the space of New Eden like we used to roam the plains of Matar instead of submitting to the imperialistic influences of other races.

This is what our minarchist revolution stands for. This is the only path toward the advent of the Day of Light.


Okay, that's interesting. "Minarchist," "Day of Light."

Could Ms. Talaminada or someone else who knows about this maybe talk a little about the ideas here?
Matar Ronin
#246 - 2016-09-13 14:50:55 UTC
Felise Selunix wrote:
Matar Ronin wrote:
When you didn't like my response (see it above) you then brought forth a new laundry basket of items that every capsuleer running for leader of the Republic should answer. (also see it above) That is a position I must confess I am not running for. If you wanted a thread full of what are your gripes with the current Republic perhaps you should have asked that directly. It is really not admirable to ask for opinions and then blast away at them when they are posted.


Now that I've had a couple of nice cocktails, I'll try to explain my position.

First, I didn't like you're response and I was pretty clear as to why. In my eyes, that constitutes discussion. Sometimes it's a bit sharper than others, as you might have seen throughout this discussion thus far. Passions run high, and quite frankly when you start off a post talking about the glory of killing others, some people might have strong opinions about that. I get that you don't like that and I don't blame you, but thems the breaks. As for me, I'm a weapons dealer who twists every deal for the most isk and who will generally sell to anyone. Some people might find this offensive, and if they told me so after I started talking about it, I guess I'd have to take it on the chin.

Since we're recapping, the reason that I gave you that 'laundry basket' was because of how you ended your original statement

Matar Ronin wrote:
The state of the Matari People is strong and growing stronger, we are found in every Empire and our numbers continue to swell. Our cause is just and our supporters continue to rally to our side. We have improved our self governance in the Republic and continue to refine those best practices. Across the Cluster Matari people are still connected and will always be connected by the call for freedom, justice, and liberty for all of humanity.


While this sounds great, I suspected (accurately apparently) that you didn't have the slightest clue about the people, the structures, or the Republic that you claim to be fighting for.

My dad's the Commandant of a military academy on Magiko, and so over my lifetime, I've seen a lot of people come and go who say the same things that you've been saying. It's all 'Down with the Empire!' 'Avenge the Day of Darkness!' 'Free the Slaves with Empire Blood!' That sort of thing. They give my dad a headache because he knows that they're the most likely to put their crews or fellow soldiers in danger, the last to look for any strategy that doesn't involve heavy casualties, and the most willing to make dumb, unnecessary sacrifices that ultimately hurt them in the long run. Worst of all, these are the soldiers who tend to have the least respect for the logistics, effort, and sacrifice that it takes to support their efforts, which I suppose is why they often feel comfortable taking extreme and untenable positions about politics, diplomacy, etc. I imagine that they know they don't have to care about these things because someone else will take care of it; that all of their war toys will just appear out of nowhere.

War costs, and while it can't always be avoided, I think it's best to acknowledge that those resources are hard earned and to use them wisely. I don't care if you know every nook and cranny of governance, to be honest, I might have been jivving about some of those examples. The point was that they deserved more than an after mention in a long monologue about the glories of war and, in my mind, simplistic analysis of international diplomacy.

Look, I dunno. Maybe you're not the type of person that I described above, I just met you. You seem like a patriotic fella and if I mischaracterized you, I'm sorry. But if you really think that a long war of attrition with the Empire is going to bring peace, victory, of universal emancipation, all I can say is that I hope you don't run into any scammers or grifters anytime soon.
I said nothing about war being glorious, war is hell, it dehumanizes combatants on all sides and slays, traumatizes, or maims countless civilians in it's wake. Fighting is a better option then enslavement, and a long fight against a centuries old evil is reality.

Being the CEO of a corp and the leader of a small/ aka tiny alliance of industrialist explorers I can assure you I am very familiar with logistics. Having to create and maintain a supply line in actual fact, far surpasses reading about it in school or listening to second hand tales passed down from Daddy.

Having to keep POS and Citadels operational and profitable within the boundaries of the Minmatar Republic means that we employ many thousands of jobs for citizens of the Republic.

Also being violently opposed to the ongoing inhuman slave trade and prosecuting combat activities against the slavery cult empire and it's numerous vassals we have to be extremely strategic in picking our fights because we are self funded and can not dream of matching the resources of any of the state level forces we encounter. Making sure as many as possible of our crews and ships survive engagements is the only viable strategy that can lead to victory.

I think perhaps you jumped to some simplistic conclusions without knowing anything about me, that is okay even we capsuleers are still basically only human.

I have had more than enough blood on my hands, i do not lust for one drop more, if we could emancipate our people tomorrow and put an end to the abominable slave trade, I for one would happily never target another amarr or Caldari warship in Minmatar space for the rest of what might be a very long capsuleer lifespan.

However until that does happen I will continue along the path of the long struggle and will not waiver in the prosecution of hostilities against those engaged in supporting the abomination of human slavery.

‘Vain flame burns fast/and its lick is light/Modest flame lasts long/and burns to the bone.’

" We lost a war we chose not to fight." Without a doubt this is the best way to lose any war and the worst excuse to explain the beating afterwards.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#247 - 2016-09-13 15:15:27 UTC
Matar Ronin wrote:
Just perhaps you misunderstand or I say it poorly. I am referring to a vassal state arrangement, between the Big Eight and the slavery cult empire.


Nope, I'm pretty sure I just pointedly reminded you that you were, in fact, talking about a vassal state arrangement between the State and the Empire when you said - and keep up here, because I know actually being expected to remember what you wrote is difficult, especially when the words are persistent:

Quote:

the Caldari State is by definition clearly a vassal state of the amarr empire


I'm going to give you a pass on this latest twisting. I think you've demonstrated a poor enough grasp on all of this for that. We can all agree you aren't likely to understand the subtle difference between the 'Big Eight' individually or in aggregate, and the State as a whole (that whole pesky other layer of things like the CEP and (when there is one) the Executor, or whatever Heth called himself, that function semi-independently of, and a check/oversight on, the Megas whose CEOs comprise it)

Quote:
.
The Caldari State system does not allow for the citizens to have direct input on how the megacorps run the government. The terms of the mutual aide agrrement has never been distributed, no one here on IGS can provide a full copy but many here will say that the empress makes requests and does not make demands, lol. Offered by someone who clearly has had little direct involvement with amarr holders and the ruling class. Basing vassalage on land for individuals would undermine the Caldari system from the point of view of the megacorps so that is not going to happen again. Lesson learned from Mordu.


By that standard, you should be claiming everyone is a 'vassal state' of CONCORD. After all, CONCRD does make demands, and everyone else is expected to obey them. We also don't have the complete text of the Yulai Accords available anywhere. You'd think that's the sort of 'peace in our time' document all six entities (the Empires, CONCORD, and the Jove) would have wanted to enshrine with some public awareness. Maybe a catch little holo commercial with kids singing the opening paragraph or something...

Point is: you can say 'oh, we don't have the documents that prove me wrong' all you like, but here's the thing: You're the one making a claim that contradicts the public positions of these entities. Phrase it however you like; you're making a claim, accusing the State and Empire of lying and concealing the true nature of their relationship, whatever you like. You're the one pushing it.

So you have the burden of proof. If you want to say 'no one here on the IGS can provide a full copy', well, that goes for you, too. So: Prove that the Amarr can make demands that the State is compelled to meet. Because you've tried all sorts of complicated obfuscation and twisting of the meanings of words, all sorts of painful torturings of language itself, and all you've managed to come down to in the end is 'well you can't prove I'm wrong!'

And that's weak. You know how weak that is, Ronin? That's 'well, you can't prove there's no god' weak.

Quote:
I actually am a rocket scientists, lol.


Note to my XO: Make sure we never buy a rocket this dim bulb worked on.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#248 - 2016-09-13 15:41:02 UTC
Eve Talaminada wrote:
we need to have to be able to rise to greatness again


Two too many 'to's. Really. You're clearly trying to make this a kind of clarion call public statement, but you've made yourself difficult to parse here. It's not impossible, mind, but enough that it break's the reader's immersion. Once they're jolted from your flow of thoughts. they need to make sure they're not misreading you. That gives them the chance to realize what you're calling for: The commitment of the entire population to a program of total war to achieve mass emancipation.

It's a lovely idea. It's also a terrible idea.

We haven't been able to fully absorb the last round of mass emancipations, and that wasn't the bulk of them. You talk a good game about the advent of a 'Day of Light', but what you're actually talking about is a second, self-inflicted Day of Darkness. We would be taking our people and throwing them into misery and squalor en masse. The infrastructure of the Tribes cannot help but fail and crumble under that massive expansion of its burden. Both the physical - stations, food production, transportation, manufacturing, and on and on - and the intangible - the social bonds, the trust between Clan and Clan, the ability for our people to aid one another in need - would be pushed beyond their breaking points.

You would annihilate the Matari people, not free them.

Also, the corrected construction would've been:

'We need in order to rise once more to greatness' - you have to break up that string of 'VERB! to VERB! to VERB! to VERB! to FINALLY A NOUN'.
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#249 - 2016-09-13 15:42:42 UTC
Matar Ronin wrote:
The Caldari State system does not allow for the citizens to have direct input on how the megacorps run the government.


Like every corporation, the Big Eight are answerable to Shareholders. It's not just Executives and rich investors that own stock in the Okusaiken, it's workers, pensioners and ordinary citizens. Admittedly people like myself are able to own a larger bloc of shares than most folk but, when you think about it, there isn't a place in the Cluster where being rich beyond the dreams of the common man doesn't give you an advantage.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#250 - 2016-09-13 16:21:00 UTC
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
there isn't a place in the Cluster where being rich beyond the dreams of the common man doesn't give you an advantage.


I dunno, being superwealthy in TEST seems to barely get you back to 'as meaningful as your average factory drone'.
Valerie Valate
Church of The Crimson Saviour
#251 - 2016-09-13 16:42:16 UTC
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
there isn't a place in the Cluster where being rich beyond the dreams of the common man doesn't give you an advantage.


What about Nation ? I'm not sure that "wealth" is a thing there.

Doctor V. Valate, Professor of Archaeology at Kaztropolis Imperial University.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#252 - 2016-09-13 16:44:36 UTC
I think the only way to have any wealth in the Nation requires having some self-determination, right? So, it's already an advantaged state!
Teinyhr
Ourumur
#253 - 2016-09-13 16:49:53 UTC
Eve Talaminada wrote:
The Minmatar Republic is currently meek, and spineless.

The collaborationist policies of the Republic toward Amarr must stop,



Do enlighten me, since I have not heard of these before.


How I also enjoy so much everyone telling me what is a true Minmatar, true Sebiestor, true Vherokior, and so on. You purists are really so much alike with what you hate, it is kind of sad.
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#254 - 2016-09-13 17:39:30 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
there isn't a place in the Cluster where being rich beyond the dreams of the common man doesn't give you an advantage.


I dunno, being superwealthy in TEST seems to barely get you back to 'as meaningful as your average factory drone'.


Damn. I should have said that there isn't a culture in the Cluster... That would have exceptioned TEST out.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
Eve Talaminada
Chao3
#255 - 2016-09-13 18:37:51 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
Eve Talaminada wrote:
we need to have to be able to rise to greatness again



Also, the corrected construction would've been:

'We need in order to rise once more to greatness' - you have to break up that string of 'VERB! to VERB! to VERB! to VERB! to FINALLY A NOUN'.


Thanks,I have updated accordingly

Arrendis wrote:

That gives them the chance to realize what you're calling for: The commitment of the entire population to a program of total war to achieve mass emancipation.

It's a lovely idea. It's also a terrible idea.

We haven't been able to fully absorb the last round of mass emancipations, and that wasn't the bulk of them. You talk a good game about the advent of a 'Day of Light', but what you're actually talking about is a second, self-inflicted Day of Darkness. We would be taking our people and throwing them into misery and squalor en masse. The infrastructure of the Tribes cannot help but fail and crumble under that massive expansion of its burden. Both the physical - stations, food production, transportation, manufacturing, and on and on - and the intangible - the social bonds, the trust between Clan and Clan, the ability for our people to aid one another in need - would be pushed beyond their breaking points.

You would annihilate the Matari people, not free them.


We are not talking about emancipation, as to "emancipate" means already accepting the status of slavery. Our ancestors were born free, and we must fight to destroy those that put the shackles on our people.

Anything less is just fancy semantics of collaborationism used for perpetuating the current statu-quo. Minmatars that fight for imperialistic powers, like you do, have lost the ways of their ancestors. Shame.

Talaminada's Voluval
Matar Ronin
#256 - 2016-09-13 18:45:21 UTC
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
Matar Ronin wrote:
The Caldari State system does not allow for the citizens to have direct input on how the megacorps run the government.


Like every corporation, the Big Eight are answerable to Shareholders. It's not just Executives and rich investors that own stock in the Okusaiken, it's workers, pensioners and ordinary citizens. Admittedly people like myself are able to own a larger bloc of shares than most folk but, when you think about it, there isn't a place in the Cluster where being rich beyond the dreams of the common man doesn't give you an advantage.
You make some good points. A lot of corp culture is naturally more familiar with capsuleers because we operate in corps ourselves. I certainly don't want to pretend I am an expert on the Caldari State political system and it's specific minutia. I know in non-Caldari corps a lot of contracts and proprietary data is never released to the shareholders. They are not lying about the contents of the contracts agreements or proprietary data it would just be imprudent to allow unrestricted access. Logic seems to dictate on a larger scale, lets say on the level of megacorps, the stockholders would never have access to the vast majority of corp documents. Good or bad thing is subjective, but to say otherwise is the case would seem completely inaccurate.

Even as a wealthy capsuleer I doubt the corps you have invested in allow you free access to their database.

Subsequently the transparency needed by citizens to judge the performance of their governing organizations is a little more difficult to obtain. The degree of difficulty in the Federation or the Republic might be more or less depending on what you were trying to ascertain but I made no implication that an otherwise perfect system existed.

‘Vain flame burns fast/and its lick is light/Modest flame lasts long/and burns to the bone.’

" We lost a war we chose not to fight." Without a doubt this is the best way to lose any war and the worst excuse to explain the beating afterwards.
Eve Talaminada
Chao3
#257 - 2016-09-13 18:49:22 UTC
Teinyhr wrote:
Eve Talaminada wrote:
The Minmatar Republic is currently meek, and spineless.

The collaborationist policies of the Republic toward Amarr must stop,



Do enlighten me, since I have not heard of these before.



http://eve.wikia.com/wiki/Minmatar

"In YC 109, Karin Midular gave a speech as a result of the discovery of the secret talks between the Republic Parliament and the Ammatar Consulate. The government wished to cease the fighting of the Vindication Wars. Though many were discontented with this, most have quieted down; even the Tribal Council had voted in support of talks with the Ammatar."

"In YC 110 she continued to maintain peace with the Amarr Empire even during the assassination attempt on Court Chamberlain Dochuta Karsoth."

We also have already highlighted the meekness of the Republic here. The right time to strike them has not been seized.

Teinyhr wrote:

How I also enjoy so much everyone telling me what is a true Minmatar, true Sebiestor, true Vherokior, and so on. You purists are really so much alike with what you hate, it is kind of sad.


The main question is not if you are a true Minmatar, it is "are you true to your ancestors?"

Talaminada's Voluval
Eve Talaminada
Chao3
#258 - 2016-09-13 18:59:01 UTC
Aria Jenneth wrote:


Okay, that's interesting. "Minarchist," "Day of Light."

Could Ms. Talaminada or someone else who knows about this maybe talk a little about the ideas here?


Our minarchist revolution aims at creating a minarchist space.

We follow the guidance of our ancestors and have been working to create the conditions of the advent of the Day of Light for all Minmatars when the True Elder returns, without compromise of principles.

Talaminada's Voluval
Teinyhr
Ourumur
#259 - 2016-09-13 19:36:07 UTC
Eve Talaminada wrote:
"In YC 109, Karin Midular gave a speech as a result of the discovery of the secret talks between the Republic Parliament and the Ammatar Consulate. The government wished to cease the fighting of the Vindication Wars. Though many were discontented with this, most have quieted down; even the Tribal Council had voted in support of talks with the Ammatar."

"In YC 110 she continued to maintain peace with the Amarr Empire even during the assassination attempt on Court Chamberlain Dochuta Karsoth."

We also have already highlighted the meekness of the Republic here. The right time to strike them has not been seized.

Teinyhr wrote:

How I also enjoy so much everyone telling me what is a true Minmatar, true Sebiestor, true Vherokior, and so on. You purists are really so much alike with what you hate, it is kind of sad.


The main question is not if you are a true Minmatar, it is "are you true to your ancestors?"


Republic of damn near ten years ago is not the Republic of today. You know, the Elder Fleet thing and all. However personally I had great respect for Midular and her desire for peace. She was the Ray of Matar after all, so who are you to question her decisions?

Am I true to my ancestors? I at least think I am. I suspect that is not enough for you, however.
Eve Talaminada
Chao3
#260 - 2016-09-13 20:17:59 UTC
Teinyhr wrote:
However personally I had great respect for Midular and her desire for peace. She was the Ray of Matar after all, so who are you to question her decisions?



She bore the Ray of Matar mark, so there must have been a purpose to her life, or her death, that has not been revealed yet.

Talaminada's Voluval