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Research Lab Operation?
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Grasor
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2016-09-07 03:54:13 UTC
Hi all,

I am looking for a guide that follows current rules of Eve outlining the operation of POS structures. Tried searching but keep pulling up articles that are too old.

Also, can anyone tell me if it's still possible to research a BPO in a POS Research Lab where the BPO is physically located in a station within the same system as the POS/lab and my corp has an office in that station? I also have Scientific Networking trained to at least level 1.

Thanks,
-G

Who did who in the what now?
Channce
Spacesheets
#2 - 2016-09-07 04:42:53 UTC
To my knowledge, the BPO must be within the same station that the research is being conducted.

For example:
Station A - Research capable
Station B - Not research capable, current location of BPO.

In this example, the BPO must be physically present in Station A.

Scientific Networking just allows you to start and stop jobs remotely (so long as the BPO is at a research capable station), depending on your level and distance from said research station.
Tillei
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#3 - 2016-09-07 05:01:45 UTC
Channce wrote:
To my knowledge, the BPO must be within the same station that the research is being conducted.

For example:
Station A - Research capable
Station B - Not research capable, current location of BPO.

In this example, the BPO must be physically present in Station A.

Scientific Networking just allows you to start and stop jobs remotely (so long as the BPO is at a research capable station), depending on your level and distance from said research station.



OP is referencing a capability where you could have the BPO in a station but perform research on it at a POS within the same system. I'm also not sure if this is still something that can be done but it used to be.
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#4 - 2016-09-07 05:46:33 UTC
Tillei wrote:
Channce wrote:
To my knowledge, the BPO must be within the same station that the research is being conducted.

For example:
Station A - Research capable
Station B - Not research capable, current location of BPO.

In this example, the BPO must be physically present in Station A.

Scientific Networking just allows you to start and stop jobs remotely (so long as the BPO is at a research capable station), depending on your level and distance from said research station.



OP is referencing a capability where you could have the BPO in a station but perform research on it at a POS within the same system. I'm also not sure if this is still something that can be done but it used to be.



Nope. That was removed in the industry overhaul.
Do Little
Bluenose Trading
#5 - 2016-09-07 07:56:30 UTC
BPO will need to be at risk in the research lab for ME/TE research or the design lab for copying. The ability to use it remotely was removed in the Crius expansion a couple of years ago.

Research and manufacturing will be undergoing another major shakeup in a couple of months with the release of industrial arrays.
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#6 - 2016-09-07 17:42:00 UTC
Grasor wrote:
I am looking for a guide that follows current rules of Eve outlining the operation of POS structures. Tried searching but keep pulling up articles that are too old.

If it is POS related, then it isn't too old.

Roles:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5714014#post5714014
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3766761#post3766761

Defences:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3762692#post3762692

Reactions & Moon Harvesting:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5157041#post5157041
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=56223#post56223
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3034003#post3034003
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5579591#post5579591
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5514424#post5514424

Anything else, just ask.

Grasor wrote:
Also, can anyone tell me if it's still possible to research a BPO in a POS Research Lab where the BPO is physically located in a station within the same system as the POS/lab and my corp has an office in that station? I also have Scientific Networking trained to at least level 1.

Not putting the BPO at risk in the array was removed back in Crius industry overhaul.
Nakota Joe Nakota
Macabre Votum
Northern Coalition.
#7 - 2016-09-10 04:26:13 UTC
citadels were supposed to be a one stop shop of sorts for doing it all in one place. research, copying, invention, manufacturing...all of it. now however ccp has nixed that plan and come out with seperate little wannabee pos's that you put in front of the citadel....not in it as a service. and then in the upcoming update ccp gleefully hyper nerfs mining boosts and production. now i see code members returning to hisec with impunity despite them have -10.0 standings . whats the point ccp? do you want everyone to stop making things and do nothing but pvp? just say that then! do away with industry alltogether and give people the ships so they can pvp all day.
Alicia Dnari
Dnari Mining and Manufacturing
#8 - 2016-09-10 22:13:07 UTC
What does "put in front of the citadel" mean?
Do Little
Bluenose Trading
#9 - 2016-09-11 08:15:53 UTC
My understanding is that you will be able to fit research and manufacturing service modules to Citadels when the modules are released but there will be no bonus for these activities.

The Engineering Complexes will have bonuses for research and manufacturing and, I suspect CCP will make them sufficiently attractive that people currently doing these activities in a POS will want to trade up. We'll find out when we get the devblog.

My concern is there doesn't seem to be a replacement for the small POS currently used by small corporations, which can quickly and easily be deployed and taken down. Again, we need to wait for the devblog and I'm surprised we're this close to release of a major feature and have heard nothing!
Nakota Joe Nakota
Macabre Votum
Northern Coalition.
#10 - 2016-09-11 14:34:59 UTC
i only know that what was supposed to be services are now going to be offered as a pos like structure you anchor out in front of the citadel. i don't know how close it can be, i don' know if it takes seperate fuel....i only know that ccp is releasing manufacturing/research structures and no more services. its really pissing me off because i overpaid dramatically to get this one set up...and properly defended.
to be clear...we will have to fuel the citadel and i assume whatever new arrays that come out so we can kinda do it all in one place..or three.
Nakota Joe Nakota
Macabre Votum
Northern Coalition.
#11 - 2016-09-11 14:43:31 UTC
Do Little wrote:
My understanding is that you will be able to fit research and manufacturing service modules to Citadels when the modules are released but there will be no bonus for these activities.

The Engineering Complexes will have bonuses for research and manufacturing and, I suspect CCP will make them sufficiently attractive that people currently doing these activities in a POS will want to trade up. We'll find out when we get the devblog.

My concern is there doesn't seem to be a replacement for the small POS currently used by small corporations, which can quickly and easily be deployed and taken down. Again, we need to wait for the devblog and I'm surprised we're this close to release of a major feature and have heard nothing!



the medium citadel (astrahus) IS the replacement for the small pos's. nothing easy about taking it down or setting it up. even now the hull will cost 1.2-1.5 bill then to fit it and get proper drones it'll be another billion....then add the 2 services that it can have (for now) and you have another 500million. i spent 5 times this to get mine up because it was one of the first ones up. still.....all that said, it was sold as a stand alone structure where you could do everything you wanted and its not. ccp owes me a refund, think they'll pay? lol
YeuxVerts Belle
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2016-09-12 07:26:45 UTC
Nakota Joe Nakota wrote:
citadels were supposed to be a one stop shop of sorts for doing it all in one place.


Nakota Joe Nakota wrote:
all that said, it was sold as a stand alone structure where you could do everything you wanted and its not.


I'd like to know where you got that understanding of structures and citadels. None of them was supposed to be stand-alone or do-it-all.

Here : https://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/back-into-the-structure/

While it was work in progress, what we have today is fairly close to what is described there. The main difference is that market/office hubs are called citadels.

Nakota Joe Nakota wrote:
ccp owes me a refund, think they'll pay? lol

They wrecked your dream. Op success.

The above message presents my opinions on the topic at hand. If there is a conflict between my views and reality, consider reality to be correct until proven otherwise.
Do Little
Bluenose Trading
#13 - 2016-09-12 08:20:41 UTC
A small POS with a design lab and a couple of assembly arrays is roughly 250 million and the whole thing can be deployed or recovered in half an hour. Astrahus is not a replacement for this functionality.

From the snippets of information CCP have released it doesn't look like the Engineering Complexes will be either. Some will build them because they can but I want a legitimate business case - hopefully we'll get the devblog this month so there is a bit of time for comments.
Tipa Riot
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2016-09-12 11:05:12 UTC
I'm concerned as well that the new complexes will suffer the same "immobility" and high upkeep costs as the current citadels. Also I expect that CCP will severely cripple production out of NPC stations, to make the new stuff more attractive. Unfortunately with how the system index works today, renting out "production slots" to public or concentrating production will be a no-go, since more customers will drive the costs up for everyone.

I'm my own NPC alt.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#15 - 2016-09-12 12:57:05 UTC
Nakota Joe Nakota wrote:
Do Little wrote:
My understanding is that you will be able to fit research and manufacturing service modules to Citadels when the modules are released but there will be no bonus for these activities.

The Engineering Complexes will have bonuses for research and manufacturing and, I suspect CCP will make them sufficiently attractive that people currently doing these activities in a POS will want to trade up. We'll find out when we get the devblog.

My concern is there doesn't seem to be a replacement for the small POS currently used by small corporations, which can quickly and easily be deployed and taken down. Again, we need to wait for the devblog and I'm surprised we're this close to release of a major feature and have heard nothing!



the medium citadel (astrahus) IS the replacement for the small pos's. nothing easy about taking it down or setting it up. even now the hull will cost 1.2-1.5 bill then to fit it and get proper drones it'll be another billion....then add the 2 services that it can have (for now) and you have another 500million. i spent 5 times this to get mine up because it was one of the first ones up. still.....all that said, it was sold as a stand alone structure where you could do everything you wanted and its not. ccp owes me a refund, think they'll pay? lol



They never said it would be a complete POS replacement on day one.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
SurrenderMonkey
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#16 - 2016-09-12 16:37:28 UTC  |  Edited by: SurrenderMonkey
Nakota Joe Nakota wrote:
Do Little wrote:
My understanding is that you will be able to fit research and manufacturing service modules to Citadels when the modules are released but there will be no bonus for these activities.

The Engineering Complexes will have bonuses for research and manufacturing and, I suspect CCP will make them sufficiently attractive that people currently doing these activities in a POS will want to trade up. We'll find out when we get the devblog.

My concern is there doesn't seem to be a replacement for the small POS currently used by small corporations, which can quickly and easily be deployed and taken down. Again, we need to wait for the devblog and I'm surprised we're this close to release of a major feature and have heard nothing!



the medium citadel (astrahus) IS the replacement for the small pos's. nothing easy about taking it down or setting it up. even now the hull will cost 1.2-1.5 bill then to fit it and get proper drones it'll be another billion....then add the 2 services that it can have (for now) and you have another 500million. i spent 5 times this to get mine up because it was one of the first ones up. still.....all that said, it was sold as a stand alone structure where you could do everything you wanted and its not. ccp owes me a refund, think they'll pay? lol


Sorry, but just about everything you have said in this thread has been completely incorrect. It's actually kind of a wonder that you've managed to remain this ignorant on the topic, as there is a wealth of very clear information available in dev blogs.

"New structures" - NOT citadels - will eventually replace POS. Citadels are merely one subset of new structure, and the first to be released. They were never billed as "the replacement for small pos".

They've also never said that all existing functionality will be mapped onto new structures. For instance, the rapid anchoring time of a POS is almost certainly never going to be replicated in the new structure model. Sorry, you're going to have to actually commit. On the other hand, they have asset safety.

Quote:

i only know that what was supposed to be services are now going to be offered as a pos like structure you anchor out in front of the citadel. i don't know how close it can be, i don' know if it takes seperate fuel....i only know that ccp is releasing manufacturing/research structures and no more services.


Can't imagine where you came up with this nonsense.

The Engineering Complexes will be a completely separate set of dockable structures, just like the Astra/Fort/Keepstar, but with different bonuses (perhaps something like a 25% bonus to all structure industrial rigs and a 25% reduction in industrial service module fuel consumption, for instance).

There will also be new service modules that can be installed in dockable structures to give them industrial capabilities. Just as with the existing citadels, they will likely be installable in any new dockable structure, albeit without the bonuses. Some may be limited based on type or size (e.g., the market hub).

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/