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What single change would encourage you to fly solo in lowsec?
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Dirty Forum Alt
Forum Alts Anonymous
#101 - 2016-08-26 13:20:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Dirty Forum Alt
Solecist Project wrote:
Dirty Forum Alt wrote:
...so they can't really learn much from it...

Unless they ask the aggressor, which is easy thanks to the killmail notification...

Sadly enough, even *if* the new player figured out how to open/read that, and asked, and even *if* they were answered the advice would be as follows:

Smartbomber: Don't fly around in a pod.
Gate Camper: Don't Fly into Tama From High Sec Noob

Neither of which is much use for progression - though it is one very small step, and *could* be built on by a certain type of player (which is very rare to find these days I believe)

The dead swans lay in the stagnant pool. They lay. They rotted. They turned Around occasionally. Bits of flesh dropped off them from Time to time. And sank into the pool's mire. They also smelt a great deal.

Paula Nancy Millstone Jennings (Sussex)
Solecist Project
#102 - 2016-08-26 13:20:38 UTC
Kenrailae wrote:
Soel Reit wrote:

ahahahah good fight ahahhaha
people still looking for good fight in 2k16!
how many years have you played eve? ahahah good fights???
it's to live or to die.

Fair/good fights don't exist in eve nor in the real world!
get real dude, you are so hilarious LolLol




Thank you for confirming you're part of the problem.

Go troll elsewhere. Bye!

Well, he's not wrong.

When you look for a fair fight then you're doing it wrong.
Fair fights are for dreamers who want to have fun.
They're meaningless, because they're artificial.

If you instead try to have fun by actually achieving something ...
... instead of looking for a romantic idea ...
... things change considerably.

Then it's not about fair fights, but about crushing the enemy.

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
Kenrailae
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#103 - 2016-08-26 13:25:51 UTC
Solecist Project wrote:
Kenrailae wrote:
Soel Reit wrote:

ahahahah good fight ahahhaha
people still looking for good fight in 2k16!
how many years have you played eve? ahahah good fights???
it's to live or to die.

Fair/good fights don't exist in eve nor in the real world!
get real dude, you are so hilarious LolLol




Thank you for confirming you're part of the problem.

Go troll elsewhere. Bye!

Well, he's not wrong.

When you look for a fair fight then you're doing it wrong.
Fair fights are for dreamers who want to have fun.
They're meaningless, because they're artificial.

If you instead try to have fun by actually achieving something ...
... instead of looking for a romantic idea ...
... things change considerably.

Then it's not about fair fights, but about crushing the enemy.



You're well aware of what I was talking about, and what I meant. You're also well aware I wasn't implying that fights should always be fair and that's the only way it should be. I can ignore a bad who isn't even trolling on his main. I expected better of you though :/

The Law is a point of View

The NPE IS a big deal
Solecist Project
#104 - 2016-08-26 13:28:35 UTC
Kenrailae wrote:

You're well aware of what I was talking about, and what I meant. You're also well aware I wasn't implying that fights should always be fair and that's the only way it should be. I can ignore a bad who isn't even trolling on his main. I expected better of you though :/

hm, maybe i'm missing context... sorry!

And yeah he's a troll, but he's cute and harmless. :)

*pets Soel* good boy!

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
Soel Reit
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#105 - 2016-08-26 13:31:56 UTC
cmon boizzzzz

this is my main! seriously! Cool

Quote:
he's cute and harmless. :)

*blushing*
Valacus
Streets of Fire
#106 - 2016-08-26 13:32:14 UTC
Delete T3Ds from the game. That'd go a long ways.
Dirty Forum Alt
Forum Alts Anonymous
#107 - 2016-08-26 13:35:25 UTC
Valacus wrote:
Delete T3Ds from the game. That'd go a long ways.

Not really.

If anything it would be a step backwards.

T3D's are one of the few ship classes that is OP enough to give a lower SP player *who is not rich* enough advantage that he stands a fair chance solo against those who have high SP and billions of isk to throw at their traps.


While I do realize that insta-locking svipuls have boosted gate camps/blobs... It is a *much smaller* buff there than to the solo players roaming around in them. So removing them would be a step *backwards* for *Solo* PvP.

The dead swans lay in the stagnant pool. They lay. They rotted. They turned Around occasionally. Bits of flesh dropped off them from Time to time. And sank into the pool's mire. They also smelt a great deal.

Paula Nancy Millstone Jennings (Sussex)
Kenrailae
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#108 - 2016-08-26 13:40:20 UTC
Dirty Forum Alt wrote:
Valacus wrote:
Delete T3Ds from the game. That'd go a long ways.

Not really.

If anything it would be a step backwards.

T3D's are one of the few ship classes that is OP enough to give a lower SP player *who is not rich* enough advantage that he stands a fair chance solo against those who have high SP and billions of isk to throw at their traps.


While I do realize that insta-locking svipuls have boosted gate camps/blobs... It is a *much smaller* buff there than to the solo players roaming around in them. So removing them would be a step *backwards* for *Solo* PvP.




I'll invoke Malcanis' Law here.

The Law is a point of View

The NPE IS a big deal
Kaybella Hakaari
State War Academy
Caldari State
#109 - 2016-08-26 13:44:03 UTC
Dirty Forum Alt wrote:
Valacus wrote:
Delete T3Ds from the game. That'd go a long ways.

Not really.

If anything it would be a step backwards.

T3D's are one of the few ship classes that is OP enough to give a lower SP player *who is not rich* enough advantage that he stands a fair chance solo against those who have high SP and billions of isk to throw at their traps.


While I do realize that insta-locking svipuls have boosted gate camps/blobs... It is a *much smaller* buff there than to the solo players roaming around in them. So removing them would be a step *backwards* for *Solo* PvP.

Once the blobs figure it out, they'll use a lot more T3D.

If they aren't already, they're not very bright and/or think the clas is "cheap."
Dirty Forum Alt
Forum Alts Anonymous
#110 - 2016-08-26 13:44:42 UTC
Kenrailae wrote:
Dirty Forum Alt wrote:
Valacus wrote:
Delete T3Ds from the game. That'd go a long ways.

Not really.

If anything it would be a step backwards.

T3D's are one of the few ship classes that is OP enough to give a lower SP player *who is not rich* enough advantage that he stands a fair chance solo against those who have high SP and billions of isk to throw at their traps.


While I do realize that insta-locking svipuls have boosted gate camps/blobs... It is a *much smaller* buff there than to the solo players roaming around in them. So removing them would be a step *backwards* for *Solo* PvP.




I'll invoke Malcanis' Law here.

Ah, but you'll note I didn't mention *new* players.


I told the *new* players not to fly solo just yet.


But yes I could have worded it better - perhaps rather than "not rich" I should say "does not wish to invest billions into pseudo-solo PvP"... and SP is really fairly irrelevant either way - the numbers are the main thing.

The dead swans lay in the stagnant pool. They lay. They rotted. They turned Around occasionally. Bits of flesh dropped off them from Time to time. And sank into the pool's mire. They also smelt a great deal.

Paula Nancy Millstone Jennings (Sussex)
Dirty Forum Alt
Forum Alts Anonymous
#111 - 2016-08-26 13:47:22 UTC
Kaybella Hakaari wrote:
Dirty Forum Alt wrote:
Valacus wrote:
Delete T3Ds from the game. That'd go a long ways.

Not really.

If anything it would be a step backwards.

T3D's are one of the few ship classes that is OP enough to give a lower SP player *who is not rich* enough advantage that he stands a fair chance solo against those who have high SP and billions of isk to throw at their traps.


While I do realize that insta-locking svipuls have boosted gate camps/blobs... It is a *much smaller* buff there than to the solo players roaming around in them. So removing them would be a step *backwards* for *Solo* PvP.

Once the blobs figure it out, they'll use a lot more T3D.

If they aren't already, they're not very bright and/or think the clas is "cheap."

You are right - they will. Indeed they have.

The Svipul is the #1 most flown ship in EVE.

And that helps them out significantly in their battles with other blobs...



But realistically getting caught by 10 svipuls or getting caught by 10 insta-locking hurricanes is much the same to a solo player - instant death.

Whereas the solo player, by flying a T3D, unlocks significantly more power than any other ship they could possibly choose - including instant warping if done right, to avoid those very gate camps.

The dead swans lay in the stagnant pool. They lay. They rotted. They turned Around occasionally. Bits of flesh dropped off them from Time to time. And sank into the pool's mire. They also smelt a great deal.

Paula Nancy Millstone Jennings (Sussex)
Kenrailae
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#112 - 2016-08-26 13:50:05 UTC
Dirty Forum Alt wrote:
Kenrailae wrote:
Dirty Forum Alt wrote:
Valacus wrote:
Delete T3Ds from the game. That'd go a long ways.

Not really.

If anything it would be a step backwards.

T3D's are one of the few ship classes that is OP enough to give a lower SP player *who is not rich* enough advantage that he stands a fair chance solo against those who have high SP and billions of isk to throw at their traps.


While I do realize that insta-locking svipuls have boosted gate camps/blobs... It is a *much smaller* buff there than to the solo players roaming around in them. So removing them would be a step *backwards* for *Solo* PvP.




I'll invoke Malcanis' Law here.

Ah, but you'll note I didn't mention *new* players.


I told the *new* players not to fly solo just yet.


But yes I could have worded it better - perhaps rather than "not rich" I should say "does not wish to invest billions into pseudo-solo PvP"... and SP is really fairly irrelevant either way - the numbers are the main thing.




You did say lower SP players though. And for discussion sake, Malcanis' Law can be applied to both lower SP/experienced players and Space poor players, with the same effect as if it were being applied to new players.


Before CCP introduced the T3D's, the frigate/destroyer/cruiser inter and intra balance was at one of the best places I can ever remember it being(still some work needed done) but it was close. T3D's came in and made all 3 classes irrelevant on a T1 basis and many of the T2's only borderline useful, or only useful at their role.

The Law is a point of View

The NPE IS a big deal
Valacus
Streets of Fire
#113 - 2016-08-26 13:51:23 UTC
Dirty Forum Alt wrote:
Valacus wrote:
Delete T3Ds from the game. That'd go a long ways.

Not really.

If anything it would be a step backwards.

T3D's are one of the few ship classes that is OP enough to give a lower SP player *who is not rich* enough advantage that he stands a fair chance solo against those who have high SP and billions of isk to throw at their traps.


While I do realize that insta-locking svipuls have boosted gate camps/blobs... It is a *much smaller* buff there than to the solo players roaming around in them. So removing them would be a step *backwards* for *Solo* PvP.


Not really. Frigate solo PvP had a good thing going until T3Ds swooped in and wrecked the balance of that entire ship class. They're destroyers that don't act like destroyers. Now frigate solo PvP is garbage.
Dirty Forum Alt
Forum Alts Anonymous
#114 - 2016-08-26 13:55:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Dirty Forum Alt
Valacus wrote:
Not really. Frigate solo PvP had a good thing going until T3Ds swooped in and wrecked the balance of that entire ship class. They're destroyers that don't act like destroyers. Now frigate solo PvP is garbage.

So you don't think that snaked/boosted garmurs upset the balance?
Or Brick/Neut/Boosted Astero's?
Or the buffs to other pirate frigates? (Worm, Succubus, etc)

Solo Frigate PvP still attempts to take place in the novice sites - and last I heard T3Ds were even banished from small sites... But it remains broken.

There are more/bigger issues than just T3Ds.

The dead swans lay in the stagnant pool. They lay. They rotted. They turned Around occasionally. Bits of flesh dropped off them from Time to time. And sank into the pool's mire. They also smelt a great deal.

Paula Nancy Millstone Jennings (Sussex)
Roenok Baalnorn
Baalnorn Heavy Industries
#115 - 2016-08-26 14:06:02 UTC
I came to Eve from a game in which i was a very good solo pvper. I learned very quickly that Eve sucks for true solo. I would impressed if we could could just get more people to leave high sec. I really dont understand why people start playing a pvp game and then want to try to hide from pvp. That is kind of silly.
Andrea Cemenotar
Elena Minasse Operations
#116 - 2016-08-26 15:06:53 UTC
Dirty Forum Alt wrote:
Valacus wrote:
Not really. Frigate solo PvP had a good thing going until T3Ds swooped in and wrecked the balance of that entire ship class. They're destroyers that don't act like destroyers. Now frigate solo PvP is garbage.

So you don't think that snaked/boosted garmurs upset the balance?
Or Brick/Neut/Boosted Astero's?
Or the buffs to other pirate frigates? (Worm, Succubus, etc)

Solo Frigate PvP still attempts to take place in the novice sites - and last I heard T3Ds were even banished from small sites... But it remains broken.

There are more/bigger issues than just T3Ds.


welp as for my opinion, and at least one other person - the T3D got nerfed out of FW [what else in lowsec uses gated sites? if anything then from this as well] bu locking it into same tier as T2 cruisers

and I have heard already quite a few times, that if I want to run FW I should get myself worm, because people does not even engage it.

as for deleting T3D from a game?

welp yeah sure just lemme keep my jackdaw :P
[don't worry I ain't ruining yer precious lowsec balance with it yet, I'm just having some fun flying high sec space exploration in it :P]
Valacus
Streets of Fire
#117 - 2016-08-26 15:54:16 UTC
Dirty Forum Alt wrote:
Valacus wrote:
Not really. Frigate solo PvP had a good thing going until T3Ds swooped in and wrecked the balance of that entire ship class. They're destroyers that don't act like destroyers. Now frigate solo PvP is garbage.

So you don't think that snaked/boosted garmurs upset the balance?
Or Brick/Neut/Boosted Astero's?
Or the buffs to other pirate frigates? (Worm, Succubus, etc)

Solo Frigate PvP still attempts to take place in the novice sites - and last I heard T3Ds were even banished from small sites... But it remains broken.

There are more/bigger issues than just T3Ds.


Ah yes, the good ol' "IT WAS ALREADY BROKEN SO WHAT HARM CAN BREAKING IT MORE POSSIBLY DO?!" argument.

Yes, there were some obvious issues in frigate solo PvP that had yet to be rectified, but adding T3Ds to the mix did nothing on that front but make things worse. Frigate solo PvP was better without T3Ds, even with all of its flaws. Instead of correcting those flaws, CCP elected to just butcher the concept entirely.
Solecist Project
#118 - 2016-08-26 16:07:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Solecist Project
If you people acted intelligently you'd make a thread calling out all solo PvPers ...
... sat down together ...
... and thought about your options and how to improve the situation.


Sheesh, where are the thinking adults??

And no, I don't mean another worthless crapfest like this one.
No one cares about these irrelevant opinions.
They change nothing!

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
Dirty Forum Alt
Forum Alts Anonymous
#119 - 2016-08-26 16:10:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Dirty Forum Alt
Valacus wrote:
Dirty Forum Alt wrote:
Valacus wrote:
Not really. Frigate solo PvP had a good thing going until T3Ds swooped in and wrecked the balance of that entire ship class. They're destroyers that don't act like destroyers. Now frigate solo PvP is garbage.

So you don't think that snaked/boosted garmurs upset the balance?
Or Brick/Neut/Boosted Astero's?
Or the buffs to other pirate frigates? (Worm, Succubus, etc)

Solo Frigate PvP still attempts to take place in the novice sites - and last I heard T3Ds were even banished from small sites... But it remains broken.

There are more/bigger issues than just T3Ds.


Ah yes, the good ol' "IT WAS ALREADY BROKEN SO WHAT HARM CAN BREAKING IT MORE POSSIBLY DO?!" argument.

Yes, there were some obvious issues in frigate solo PvP that had yet to be rectified, but adding T3Ds to the mix did nothing on that front but make things worse. Frigate solo PvP was better without T3Ds, even with all of its flaws. Instead of correcting those flaws, CCP elected to just butcher the concept entirely.

You'll get no argument from me about the fact that CCP butchered solo PvP.

None at all.

See my rant in another threadP

But undoing the least-harmful change to solo PvP? Not going to magically fix things.

Deal with it.

The dead swans lay in the stagnant pool. They lay. They rotted. They turned Around occasionally. Bits of flesh dropped off them from Time to time. And sank into the pool's mire. They also smelt a great deal.

Paula Nancy Millstone Jennings (Sussex)
Dirty Forum Alt
Forum Alts Anonymous
#120 - 2016-08-26 16:13:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Dirty Forum Alt
Solecist Project wrote:
If you people acted intelligently you'd make a thread calling out all solo PvPers ...
... sat down together ...
... and thought about your options and how to improve the situation.


Sheesh, where are the thinking adults??

And no, I don't mean another worthless crapfest like this one.
No one cares about these irrelevant opinions.
They change nothing!

Bah, they don't call us "solo" without a reason P



edit:
And honestly the situation...is what it is. It has been heading this direction for a long time, I don't think it is "fixable".

If you know what you are doing and you put in the time/effort, you can still operate solo in any space you choose. You can't kill "everybody" - but you can find people to kill just fine.

If you don't know what you are doing and/or aren't willing to put in the time/effort (and isk) - then don't do solo PvP until you are prepared to change that. It is that simple.

The dead swans lay in the stagnant pool. They lay. They rotted. They turned Around occasionally. Bits of flesh dropped off them from Time to time. And sank into the pool's mire. They also smelt a great deal.

Paula Nancy Millstone Jennings (Sussex)