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Crime & Punishment

 
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Griefing still alive and well, I see...

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Sc0rpyon
EZ-Life
#1 - 2016-08-18 15:20:37 UTC
So, I left this game about 10 years back or so (with a brief resurgence about 7 years ago) - mostly because of the sheer amount of pointless griefing that was going on.

Then my mate said I should come back and start playing again. I grudgingly agreed to give it another go and see if the game had improved.

So... 3 days in, I've got my mining barge up and running. All good. I hop on over to a *cough* "safe" space Asteroid belt in 0.8 sec. 0.8 sec.... Not some crappy low sec. 0.8....

All is good for a while until suddenly out of nowhere, I notice warning lights and sirens go off.
Within half a secon, my shields and armour are gone and never enough time to hop back to the station.
Boom.

Shortly after that, the police finally decide to turn up and blow the idiot griefer up.
What for? There was really no point for this idiot to do this other than to just cause someone else problems. The fact that he had a 500,000,000 bounty on him says plenty, I guess.

Yep. Turns out Eve hasn't got any better.
Bit of a shame, really.
:-(
Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#2 - 2016-08-18 15:23:15 UTC
Being shot at in a shooting game is not griefing.

Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."
Sc0rpyon
EZ-Life
#3 - 2016-08-18 15:28:00 UTC
I don't think you seem to understand what the term griefing means.
But that's ok. You tried. That's what counts...
Saeger1737
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#4 - 2016-08-18 15:43:24 UTC
That's called ganking, griefing is if I war Dec you and kill you over and over and over again... Learn your stuff.

MERC WITH A MOUTH, Send me DPS and my fleet will double it back! Special offer!
Sc0rpyon
EZ-Life
#5 - 2016-08-18 15:55:00 UTC
No..... griefing is committing an act for the sole purpose of causing grief.
Ganking is simply attacking someone who wasn't prepared for it.
Maybe you should learn your stuff..

For reference, this could be considered both ganking AND griefing, since the two are in no way exclusive.

Jeez, and I thought Elite players were bad at understanding simple concepts like this...
afk phone
Repo Industries
#6 - 2016-08-18 15:57:01 UTC
You were ganked. If the guy follows you all over Eve and keeps ganking you - that series of actions would constitute griefing.

Report back to us if there is a continued string of ganking by this same pilot. After several occurrences the griefing will become evident.


A review of your kb https://zkillboard.com/character/696775183/ indicates you were in a 0.5 system, not a 0.8. I understand you may be upset or frustrated by you ship loss, but misrepresenting the facts does not help you case. The review also indicates that you were ganked by different pilots over a long period of time and as you implied - the distant past ganks occurred in low sec, so they are not even ganks based on the mechanics of low sec.

I also noticed that you opted for the no tank at all option when fitting your ship. That may or may not have been part of what drew the gankers attention. I recommend you train into a Skiff mining barge, tank it to an acceptable level and enjoy the game.


I had a guy in corp that would routinely lose barges as he continually mostly afk mined in wh space. They guy mined in blank clones and t1 barges. He came out way ahead and figured in the losses as part of the game. He never cared or complained. For him the empty clone and no tank cheapo barge was the way to go.

You seem to be adverse to losing a ship, so I recommend a second time to look into the Skiff as it's a well tanked and serviceable vessel. There are even a few ganker whine threads that it is too tough and needs to have its tank reduced. It sounds like the right ship for you.



Finally, playing Eve casually and being good at Eve are 2 vastly different things. My casual miner friend didn't care about losses or about being good at eve. He just enjoyed being on comms with the guys and casual mining. You seem to want to be good at Eve and also avoid losses. To get you on your way - google 'skiff' and read up on it. If you think it's what you need - load up that training que and get to it!

Finally finally - Eve isn't for everyone. I'm not telling you to gtfo, but over time I have come to terms that the real in game consequences aren't for everyone. If you can't deal with losses and the darker side of Eve game play, there are plenty of games out there that don't have these darker play style options in them.
Scotsman Howard
S0utherN Comfort
#7 - 2016-08-18 15:58:25 UTC
Sc0rpyon wrote:
So, I left this game about 10 years back or so (with a brief resurgence about 7 years ago) - mostly because of the sheer amount of pointless griefing that was going on.

Then my mate said I should come back and start playing again. I grudgingly agreed to give it another go and see if the game had improved.

So... 3 days in, I've got my mining barge up and running. All good. I hop on over to a *cough* "safe" space Asteroid belt in 0.8 sec. 0.8 sec.... Not some crappy low sec. 0.8....

All is good for a while until suddenly out of nowhere, I notice warning lights and sirens go off.
Within half a secon, my shields and armour are gone and never enough time to hop back to the station.
Boom.

Shortly after that, the police finally decide to turn up and blow the idiot griefer up.
What for? There was really no point for this idiot to do this other than to just cause someone else problems. The fact that he had a 500,000,000 bounty on him says plenty, I guess.

Yep. Turns out Eve hasn't got any better.
Bit of a shame, really.
:-(


This is an odd story that I am calling BS on. Below is a list of reasons why with number 4 being the most obvious.

1. The latest kill on your board was from 2 days ago while the next was from a few days ago - Ok, everything lines up here.

2. The mining barge you were in was setup with ZERO tank (no rigs either) and for max yield. Also, it was a retreiver (known to have one of the worst tanks for barges). - Overall, you look like you were just begging to get hit.

3. Your statement "All is good for a while until suddenly out of nowhere," seems to imply you were mining AFK. At the very least, you did not have your overview properly setup to see the ship come on grid. Nor did you have dscan up to see if ships were coming in (and don't give us that crap about not wanting to click the dscan button. There is a hotkey for it you can abuse to no end now.)

4. The loss mail was in a 0.5 system (Diromitur to be precise). I could accept that you may have mistyped 0.5 as 0.8 in you op, but I do not buy that you mistyped it three times. Anyways, a quick check of the killboard in this system shows that the same corp/alliance/toons gank there with some regularity.

In the end, you jumped into the shallow end of the pool that is Eve thinking it was safe, but failed to realize that there is no shallow end and there are sharks everywhere.
Scotsman Howard
S0utherN Comfort
#8 - 2016-08-18 15:59:29 UTC
afk phone wrote:
.......................


Lol, you beat me to the post button.
Paranoid Loyd
#9 - 2016-08-18 16:00:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Paranoid Loyd
May I refer you to section 7?

You can call it what you want and argue semantics until you start to have a sodium deficiency, the bottom line is it's part of the game. Deal with it.

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Faylee Freir
Abusing Game Mechanics
#10 - 2016-08-18 16:01:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Faylee Freir
Good for you. Eve probably isnt for you. Run away before you get "griefed" again

HTFU
afk phone
Repo Industries
#11 - 2016-08-18 16:03:05 UTC
Sc0rpyon wrote:
No..... griefing is committing an act for the sole purpose of causing grief.
Ganking is simply attacking someone who wasn't prepared for it.
Maybe you should learn your stuff..

For reference, this could be considered both ganking AND griefing, since the two are in no way exclusive.

Jeez, and I thought Elite players were bad at understanding simple concepts like this...



I truly doubt the guy ganked you for the sole purpose of causing YOU grief. If I convo'd him I would wager his first question would be: 'Who?' as he probably has no idea who you are. In Eve griefing is fairly well defined. What you have portrayed doesn't fit the EULA definition of griefing. Just because you feel aggrieved does not mean you were griefed. It's defined in the EULA, read it and decide if you can live with it during your allotted game play time on this earth.

I had a Master Chief in the Navy once tell me "Son, you don't have to agree with the rules, you just have to live by them." It helped me at the time (somewhat), perhaps it will help you (somewhat) now.
Sc0rpyon
EZ-Life
#12 - 2016-08-18 16:16:35 UTC
Hmm, at least (most) of the last few responses have been reasonable with legitimate suggestions to consider.
(Aside from a couple of silly childish attempts at one line retorts from a couple of little kids).

So I appreciate the suggestions made.
It's possible I could have misremembered the sec as stated and that it was indeed 0.5 rather than 0.8.
That said, though, I would still expect even 0.5 to have much better protection than it appears to.

As I mentioned, I've only been back a few days after an almost 10 year hiatus from the game, so not familiar with Mining vessels being "tanks". New concept to me.
I'll also look up what a "Skiff" is, as I don't know that either.

Thanks at least to the couple of you who took the effort and maturity to prompt me to try and figure out how to get past this in a sensible way. That's appreciated.
I'm always grateful for reasoned and considerate advice when it comes.
Saeger1737
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#13 - 2016-08-18 16:18:53 UTC
Sc0rpyon wrote:
No..... griefing is committing an act for the sole purpose of causing grief.
Ganking is simply attacking someone who wasn't prepared for it.
Maybe you should learn your stuff..

For reference, this could be considered both ganking AND griefing, since the two are in no way exclusive.

Jeez, and I thought Elite players were bad at understanding simple concepts like this...

Run your mouth some more and you'll be griefed again soon.

MERC WITH A MOUTH, Send me DPS and my fleet will double it back! Special offer!
Sc0rpyon
EZ-Life
#14 - 2016-08-18 16:29:42 UTC
Saeger1737 wrote:
Sc0rpyon wrote:
No..... griefing is committing an act for the sole purpose of causing grief.
Ganking is simply attacking someone who wasn't prepared for it.
Maybe you should learn your stuff..

For reference, this could be considered both ganking AND griefing, since the two are in no way exclusive.

Jeez, and I thought Elite players were bad at understanding simple concepts like this...

Run your mouth some more and you'll be griefed again soon.


Sigh... calm down, dear...
afk phone
Repo Industries
#15 - 2016-08-18 16:57:21 UTC
Sc0rpyon wrote:
Hmm, at least (most) of the last few responses have been reasonable with legitimate suggestions to consider.
(Aside from a couple of silly childish attempts at one line retorts from a couple of little kids).

So I appreciate the suggestions made.
It's possible I could have misremembered the sec as stated and that it was indeed 0.5 rather than 0.8.
That said, though, I would still expect even 0.5 to have much better protection than it appears to.

As I mentioned, I've only been back a few days after an almost 10 year hiatus from the game, so not familiar with Mining vessels being "tanks". New concept to me.
I'll also look up what a "Skiff" is, as I don't know that either.

Thanks at least to the couple of you who took the effort and maturity to prompt me to try and figure out how to get past this in a sensible way. That's appreciated.
I'm always grateful for reasoned and considerate advice when it comes.





"That said, though, I would still expect even 0.5 to have much better protection than it appears to."


CONCORD doesn't provide protection. CONCORD provides consequences. They suicide gank you and CONCORD destroys the ship they are flying. They show up after the gankers have destroyed you ship in most cases. Those that gank miners have a clear understanding of CONCORD response times and how much damage they have to bring to pop you before CONCORD finishes them off.

It's a pretty much just a math problem to the ganker. (like I said, the guy probably has no idea as to the who/what/where/when specifics of ganking you. You're barge was just a math problem that he solved)
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#16 - 2016-08-18 17:14:42 UTC
Hey OP, don't let the griefers gaslight you on this. Your impression and judgment counts most towards what you want to do next.


That the mechanics favor them means there's no dishonor or failure for recognizing a rigged game and moving on. They will also claim they are the ones being nerfed, but they have a CSM and devs on their side.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Zoltan Lazar
#17 - 2016-08-18 17:34:30 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
Hey OP, don't let the griefers gaslight you on this. Your impression and judgment counts most towards what you want to do next.


That the mechanics favor them means there's no dishonor or failure for recognizing a rigged game and moving on. They will also claim they are the ones being nerfed, but they have a CSM and devs on their side.



Gas lighting is when it's false. It's an actual fact (provable via KM) that he was in .5, not .8.

CSM doesn't give a **** about HS, only null. Devs just want HS to be a carebear playground to drive easy subs.

But hey, tell yourself whatever lets you sleep at night. People in a bad enough mental state to go for HS mining don't have the brain cells to try to bother with.
tainted demon
TunDraGon
Goonswarm Federation
#18 - 2016-08-18 17:48:34 UTC
I was playing Call of Duty the other day and while on my way to a sniping vantage point i got a shotgun in the face. I had a sniper rifle and "was not prepared" for close quarters combat what so ever, the griefing in that game is so bad because everyone runs about shooting at others.

Sc0rpyon is absolutely correct how dare someone create their own content in a player driven sandbox mmo.

It's not like he can mine in a higher sec space where concord have a faster response time, or there are other ships with better tank he can use for mining in less secure space... oh wait
Sc0rpyon
EZ-Life
#19 - 2016-08-18 18:00:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Sc0rpyon
tainted demon wrote:
I was playing Call of Duty the other day and while on my way to a sniping vantage point i got a shotgun in the face. I had a sniper rifle and "was not prepared" for close quarters combat what so ever, the griefing in that game is so bad because everyone runs about shooting at others.

Sc0rpyon is absolutely correct how dare someone create their own content in a player driven sandbox mmo.

It's not like he can mine in a higher sec space where concord have a faster response time, or there are other ships with better tank he can use for mining in less secure space... oh wait


You play Call of Douchebags.
Suddenly everything becomes clear.
Your opinion is invalid.
Nitshe Razvedka
#20 - 2016-08-18 18:04:01 UTC
Careful OP Gankers have very fragile ego's esp codies. Challenge their philosophy or methods and they meltdown the worst.

They even may send you RL threats in the mail.Smile

Thieving pirates discuss INTEGRITY; Anarchist gankers give us LAWS; and Whoring merc's cry then blow off clients with INSULTS.

Up is down and down is up in the C&P Forum.
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