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is the game all about the blob?
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Zimmy Zeta
Perkone
Caldari State
#61 - 2012-01-15 17:11:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Zimmy Zeta
Fon Revedhort wrote:


You seem to be confusing Allgemeine and Waffen-SS, btw.


No I am not. For decades we were told that the SS consisted of ruthless babykilling monsters, while the Waffen-SS was full of noble warriors that were paragons of valor. This is wrong, since both were different branches of the same organization.

Fun fact of the day: the vow of fidelity of the SS and Waffen-SS was not a vow to Germany and the german people. It was solely a vow of loyality to the NSDAP and to Adolf H. himself.

I find it somewhat amusing: me, a german, discussing with a russian some of the darkest chapters of our mutual war- while both our countries had engaged in heavy propaganda and kept feeding the media with lies and legends for decades.
Maybe the truth is somewhere in the middle.
As for here in Germany, over the recent 10-15 years more and more evidence is published that tells a different story than the "noble" and "innocent" Wehrmacht and Waffen SS. Maybe we just had to wait until all surviving members died away until the first historians dared to contradict the common conceptions.


Ok, but back to topic:

NERF FALCONS
NERF BLOBS
NERF EVERYTHING

I'd like to apologize for the poor quality of the post above and sincerely hope you didn't waste your time reading it. Yes, I do feel bad about it.
Fon Revedhort
Monks of War
#62 - 2012-01-15 17:47:15 UTC
Zimmy Zeta wrote:

I find it somewhat amusing: me, a german, discussing with a russian some of the darkest chapters of our mutual war- while both our countries had engaged in heavy propaganda and kept feeding the media with lies and legends for decades.
Maybe the truth is somewhere in the middle.

That's the punishment our nations got for overthrowing our crowned heads and turning national states into fugly multikulti communes in 1917-1918, where neither Germans nor Russians owned anything.

As for the recent 'revelations' being published in Germany (or elsewhere), I for one wouldn't treat them as valid. We both know in so-called democracy you can publish (or even say) only something which is 'appropriate'. Denying is a no-no deed!

Can't help quoting one of your best bands:

Meinungsfreiheit, Demokratie,
schöne Worte getaucht in einem Bad von Ironie.
(c) Sleipnir

"Being supporters of free speech and free and open [CSM] elections... we removed Fon Revedhort from eligibility". CCP, April 2013.
Midori Tsu
Evolution
Northern Coalition.
#63 - 2012-01-15 20:10:45 UTC
Fon Revedhort wrote:

As for the recent 'revelations' being published in Germany (or elsewhere), I for one wouldn't treat them as valid. We both know in so-called democracy you can publish (or even say) only something which is 'appropriate'. Denying is a no-no deed!


Not true, at least in the free states of USA you can say whatever you want, you might catch flak for it, but no ones going to stop you.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#64 - 2012-01-15 20:48:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Cearain
Yeah it appears CCP wants people to be social form large fleets and blob. It makes for good press when they get the occassion 1000+ fleet fight.

Years ago CCP designed one mechanic that could yield quality small scale pvp: Faction War occupancy plexing.

However they puked a bunch of npcs in those plexes so you have to fly a pve fit to get in. So then of course you need to warp out when a pvp ship comes. So it's a pretty stupid/broken mechanic right now.

They are saying they will work on faction war soon. Perhaps they will fix it and eve will finally have a mechanic that brings about frequent, quality, small scale pvp. We shall see.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
xxanjoahir
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#65 - 2012-01-16 16:54:26 UTC
Cearain wrote:
Yeah it appears CCP wants people to be social form large fleets and blob. It makes for good press when they get the occassion 1000+ fleet fight.

Years ago CCP designed one mechanic that could yield quality small scale pvp: Faction War occupancy plexing.

However they puked a bunch of npcs in those plexes so you have to fly a pve fit to get in. So then of course you need to warp out when a pvp ship comes. So it's a pretty stupid/broken mechanic right now.

They are saying they will work on faction war soon. Perhaps they will fix it and eve will finally have a mechanic that brings about frequent, quality, small scale pvp. We shall see.


Hot drop - too easy.
10 people trying to have fun versus 30+ - too lame.
Most of eve these days requires NUMBERS - BROKEN MECHANIC for those who have no interest other than to sign in and pvp.
"get more in your fleet" - lame response from someone who doesn't understand the difficulty of creating a well oiled fleet.
Go play wow - no, no sense of loosing something

Seems to be some lame arguements of "can i has your stuff" and "go play wow" when really if you dumbasses had any sort of intelligence you might be saying "you know what the game is seriously missing the 10 man hit and run gang GF's"
Morganta
The Greater Goon
#66 - 2012-01-16 17:10:20 UTC
Zimmy Zeta wrote:
Fon Revedhort wrote:


You seem to be confusing Allgemeine and Waffen-SS, btw.


No I am not. For decades we were told that the SS consisted of ruthless babykilling monsters, while the Waffen-SS was full of noble warriors that were paragons of valor. This is wrong, since both were different branches of the same organization.

Fun fact of the day: the vow of fidelity of the SS and Waffen-SS was not a vow to Germany and the german people. It was solely a vow of loyality to the NSDAP and to Adolf H. himself.

I find it somewhat amusing: me, a german, discussing with a russian some of the darkest chapters of our mutual war- while both our countries had engaged in heavy propaganda and kept feeding the media with lies and legends for decades.
Maybe the truth is somewhere in the middle.
As for here in Germany, over the recent 10-15 years more and more evidence is published that tells a different story than the "noble" and "innocent" Wehrmacht and Waffen SS. Maybe we just had to wait until all surviving members died away until the first historians dared to contradict the common conceptions.


Ok, but back to topic:

NERF FALCONS
NERF BLOBS
NERF EVERYTHING


where were you know-it-alls back in 1936 when you were needed?
Karl Planck
Perkone
Caldari State
#67 - 2012-01-16 18:05:59 UTC
xxanjoahir wrote:

Most of eve these days requires NUMBERS - BROKEN MECHANIC for those who have no interest other than to sign in and pvp.
"get more in your fleet" - lame response from someone who doesn't understand the difficulty of creating a well oiled fleet.


Even though it will go on deaf ears...

This game doesn't require a blob but it sure makes it easier. You don't have to be good at this game to kick ass, just have to group together and follow the work of 1 or 2 people. However, as many come to find out this can be boring and unsatisfying.

Then you switch to working solo or in small gangs and you suddenly find out how good you actually are at this game. Most people are not that good and for some reason nearly all of them think its the game's fault and something with the mechanics, not their ability as a player.

Eve is one of the few games that you can suck at for a long time and think your a bada$$. Most of these responses are because people who suck usually don't want to hear it and usually don't want to improve, they just want to start winning.

I has all the eve inactivity
arcca jeth
Dark Alliance
#68 - 2012-01-16 18:12:01 UTC
Valei Khurelem wrote:
Quote:
Once upon a time there was a smuggler's guide. I'll quote the relevant passage below:


That's it? So you're solution to avoid getting ganked by blobs is to lose an even more expensive ship?


The solution is BETTER RECON and Fight or FLIGHT judgement.

PRO RECON = PRICELESS
Kessiaan
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#69 - 2012-01-16 18:20:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Kessiaan
Any fleet smaller than yours - GF
Any fleet bigger than yours - ZOMGBLOBLAME!!!111one

You can get good fights in any fleet size, provided you have decent players and a good FC. The importance of a good FC cannot be understated - EvE is mostly free from the "one crap player brings the whole team down" problem that infests themepark MMOs, but the FC is most definitely the exception. A good FC who knows his fleet inside out, provides clear, concise, timely, and unambiguous direction to his fleet, and has access to good intel is far and away the most effective method I've seen to fight the blob and win on a regular basis.

EDIT:

We had a good fight last night actually - we were outnumbered, outgunned, and way out-logi'd. But we had the leadership of one of the best FCs I've ever come across in this game and even though we withdrew from the field we still inflicted way more losses than we received ourselves.

KB Link
Lyron-Baktos
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#70 - 2012-01-16 18:24:46 UTC
Sounds like someone that failed to scout correctly and got tricked by a bait fleet
Skydell
Bad Girl Posse
#71 - 2012-01-16 18:40:19 UTC
Karl Planck wrote:
xxanjoahir wrote:

Most of eve these days requires NUMBERS - BROKEN MECHANIC for those who have no interest other than to sign in and pvp.
"get more in your fleet" - lame response from someone who doesn't understand the difficulty of creating a well oiled fleet.


Even though it will go on deaf ears...

This game doesn't require a blob but it sure makes it easier. You don't have to be good at this game to kick ass, just have to group together and follow the work of 1 or 2 people. However, as many come to find out this can be boring and unsatisfying.

Then you switch to working solo or in small gangs and you suddenly find out how good you actually are at this game. Most people are not that good and for some reason nearly all of them think its the game's fault and something with the mechanics, not their ability as a player.

Eve is one of the few games that you can suck at for a long time and think your a bada$$. Most of these responses are because people who suck usually don't want to hear it and usually don't want to improve, they just want to start winning.


LOL
News in from Scope HQ. We all suck at EVE.

We suck at EVE because every ship in EVE is a niche and the only way to fly in EVE "well" is to bring the niche that backs the niche that backs the niche. Have a support squad for the support squad for the support squad. Equals Blob.

You can't make a proper fleet in EVE with support for the holes of each niche without running in to fleets of 500.

Exception? Winmatar. They have speed to break optimal, get clear of Ewar and dictate the fight. They have a true through tank so no other weapon is optimal to kill them, they don't rely on slow secondary dps from drones, they are called Winmatar for a reason. It was the last race to come to power because it took the longest to train but 8 years later it's FoTG because the only way to break it's optimal skill build is to gut it like a fish.

You want to fly small gang? Fly Winmatar. The blobs won't catch you. Ours never could. Am I hating on Minmatar ships? No, not in the least. If it works, do it. You saw it in the Alliance tournie, controlled small gang warfare. Winmatar won. Don't fight the machine.
Skex Relbore
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#72 - 2012-01-16 18:57:15 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
I've noticed that people who whine about "blobs" are rarely above killing a lone guy they caught on the gate with their 7 man gang, but they're quick to complain about being killed by his 50 friends.


Ain't that the truth,.

My experience supports your assertion, from my time in RVB, the guys who whined the most about being blobbed tended to be the very same ones who were camping enemy HQ in frigate popping snipers or refused to do arranged (aka even numbered) battles because they were "boring", telling me that they weren't so much against ganking as they were against being ganked.

Myself I figure it's part of the game. PVP in EVE is less about skill at operating ones ship and more about crafting the field of conflict in a favorable manner. You want to convince the other guy that he is at an advantage while it is actually you who has said advantage. Of course the enemy is doing the same thing which is why the outcome of any given fight is always an open question.

Hell a large part of why I gave up FCing in RVB was I got tired of all the crybabies who would whine any time I miscalculated what was a reasonable response to their gang, either as a result of poor intel, missing the guy who shipped up to a BC when I called for cruisers or when dealing with an opposing FC who couldn't seem to wrap his head around the fact that I had to count that out of fleet corpie of his as a part of the force I was fighting.

People need to consider, if getting relatively even fights in something purposely designed to do so like RVB is difficult, how much more so will it be in an environment of cyno toting hot drop bait ships where any random Kestrel could have a super cap blob backing him up.
Gabriel Karade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#73 - 2012-01-16 19:34:29 UTC
Pinaculus wrote:
Midori Tsu wrote:
Excuse me, but what defines a blob? Is someone bringing slightly more ship than you? Is there a certain percentage between the fleet sizes? Or is there a set number of ships? i would very much like to know exactly how big a fleet has to be to be considered a blob.


A blob is any fight that outnumbers you by 1 or more in which you lose.
This is probably the best definition I've seen Smile

As for what to do about it? - I think MC put it best, oh about 7 years ago during their first contract...

"Embrace teh blob"

War Machine: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=386293