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Every year, there are less users playing, why??

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Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
EDENCOM DEFENSIVE INITIATIVE
#381 - 2016-07-28 07:09:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Nana Skalski
This game is so complex and full of quirks that even 2 year old character can be deemed "stupid", some people, bah, even 4 year olds, not hardcore gamers can be deemed "stupid", while they are just inexperienced in all those things about game. Gradually some people can find and learn more about the things this game offers. Deepnes of the gameplay and things there is to learn always strucks, not even now players, but also those who try to do something new in the game, like PvEer who wants to get into PvP.

Another thing is people who try and adapt and their efforts still are not recognized, and cant be, because system is constructed in the way it gives advantage to the other gamer, other style of gameplay. If they see it, they are disappointed with mechanics.

Balancing such game with high PvP content and PvE content as EVE is, is so hard, that we will see these threads emerge about gankers, wardecs, capitals, sov, structures indefinitely I think.

ᴇᴠᴇʀʏ ᴘᴀʀᴛ ᴏғ ᴀ ɢᴀᴍᴇ ʜᴇʟᴘs ᴛᴏ ᴛᴇʟʟ ᴀ sᴛᴏʀʏ 📕

ᴡʜᴇʀᴇ ɪs ᴀɴɢʀʏ ᴄᴏɴᴄᴏʀᴅ ɢᴜʏ ᴡʜᴇɴ ʏᴏᴜ ɴᴇᴇᴅ ʜɪᴍ

ᴏsᴘʀᴇʏ 🚀

≡⋁≡ ♥
Geronimo McVain
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#382 - 2016-07-28 08:29:35 UTC
I'm with Lucy. New Players are missing information badly.
Just some examples:
Can you trade from the cargo bay
Where do you have an overview what exactly is each module doing
Where are you taught how to tank a ship correctly
Where are you taught the MWD trick
Where are warned about changed mechanics like installing clones or upgrading clones that you still find in the web?
A huge disadvantage of relying on the web is that there is a crapton of outdated info out there.
Ncc 1709
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Pandemic Horde
#383 - 2016-07-28 09:07:48 UTC
used to be able to buy 90 gtc for 290m isk...
Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
EDENCOM DEFENSIVE INITIATIVE
#384 - 2016-07-28 10:07:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Nana Skalski
And there are also people, balancing game is one thing, but you cant really balance people, and they come unbalanced. Especially those new ones, newbies. The ones who are taught that game delivers them information about everything, will be surprised there is more than that, and you just scraped the surface, some will be overtaken by threat of overdedication to a game. Clear and thoroughly presented information, when its too much, will not be used in its entirety, some things are practiced and some not, some are forgotten, again this can cause problems with player not wanting to play because he do not grasp something and is offput for example by micromanagement of modules in PvP. Some people learn by their mistakes, refusing to read a wall of texts, trying to explore game using their own intuition, intuition that was shaped by other games.

Gathering all of this, even the things I didnt really mentioned but were mentioned earlier in this thread and on forums (its a lot) its no wonder that game appeals to less people than someone would want.

ᴇᴠᴇʀʏ ᴘᴀʀᴛ ᴏғ ᴀ ɢᴀᴍᴇ ʜᴇʟᴘs ᴛᴏ ᴛᴇʟʟ ᴀ sᴛᴏʀʏ 📕

ᴡʜᴇʀᴇ ɪs ᴀɴɢʀʏ ᴄᴏɴᴄᴏʀᴅ ɢᴜʏ ᴡʜᴇɴ ʏᴏᴜ ɴᴇᴇᴅ ʜɪᴍ

ᴏsᴘʀᴇʏ 🚀

≡⋁≡ ♥
Lucy Lollipops
State War Academy
Caldari State
#385 - 2016-07-28 10:22:24 UTC
Nana Skalski wrote:
And there are also people, balancing game is one thing, but you cant really balance people, and they come unbalanced. Especially those new ones, newbies. The ones who are taught that game delivers them information about everything, will be surprised there is more than that, and you just scraped the surface, some will be overtaken by thread of overdedication to a game. Clear and thoroughly presented information, when its too much, will not be used in its entirety, some things are practiced and some not, some are forgotten, again this can cause problems with player not wanting to play because he do not grasp something and is offput for example by micromanagement of modules in PvP. Some people learn by their mistakes, refusing to read a wall of texts, trying to explore game using their own intuition, intuition that was shaped by other games.

Gathering all of this, even the things I didnt really mentioned but were mentioned earlier in this thread and on forums (its a lot) its no wonder that game appeals to so little people.


Yes, sometimes it's a mix of difficulty, personal limits and game mechanics that makes everything frustrating.

I experienced this some days ago, when I was back trying some FW after a one month stop for irl things.

I setup my ship with new t2 modules, very happy to try them in PvP.

Look for FW systems, undock, change a couple of systems trying my manual pilot a bit, then I see ships approach and web me...what happens? Some seconds later I am in my pod ( I use very fragile kiting ships...)

I simply forgot that FW standing made me chased by opposite factions NPC in some systems, the "warning" is little and I didn't notice it at all, because I was focused on practice some manual piloting again...

So new ships destroyed, back to buy new one with tail between legs, killed by npc.

Mix of personal distruction, bad memory of one of the many game mechanics and so little warning interface.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#386 - 2016-07-28 10:32:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Lucy Lollipops wrote:
I had a Corpmate that was intelligent and asked before reediming a plex he bought. He didn't know how important it is to redeem it in a big hub and in particular in jita ( he didn't actually know what jita is ).

He was lucky, others explained him to travel to jita and then redeem and sell the plex without undocking and so on, but I suppose it's not unfrequent to have a enthusiastic new player that buys a plex, redeems it and then he find he's in the wrong place to sell it ( not to say it can happen he tries to transport it to a better place unaware he can be scanned down and stealed from it ).
Which is as it should be, CCP made a deliberate design choice that means outside of the absolute basics your main source of information is other players. While I agree that a lack of easily accessible information is a problem when you're new, I don't think that the information should be spoonfed. I do think that CCP could do a better job of encouraging people to find out stuff for themselves using the resources already available; if people can't be bothered to do so after being encouraged then that's their own look out and they deserve to explode repeatedly until they either learn or quit.

Quote:
I would not deem that kind of player a stupid one, or an unattentive one, in particular during the first weeks of gameplay.
It's when people fail to learn that they get called stupid, even the most seasoned and bloodthirsty of gankers will happily tell a newbie that undocking with PLEX in the hold is a bloody silly idea.

Quote:
Some mechanics I found in many other mmos ( what's calling soulbounding for using a general expression ) are not applied here.

It's a choice not to apply that mechanics, but because Eve is more an exception than a common game about it, I think it should be clear ( with big game warnings ) that here everything is different.
The lack of "soulbinding" is one of the many differences to other games that have made Eve unique over the years; as for the warning, something similar was tried in the past during one of the Burn Jita events, it was thoroughly ignored and people blindly flew their overstuffed multi-billion isk loot pinatas into a death trap, then they moaned on the forums about it Roll

We're used to dealing with incredible amounts of stupidity from people that fail to understand the concept of an open PvP game with full loot, which is why the forums can be so harsh on folks.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#387 - 2016-07-28 10:37:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Geronimo McVain wrote:
Can you trade from the cargo bay
Where do you have an overview what exactly is each module doing
Where are you taught how to tank a ship correctly
Where are you taught the MWD trick
These are things you learn from other players, the lack of an instruction manual was a deliberate choice on the part of CCP.

Quote:
Where are warned about changed mechanics like installing clones or upgrading clones that you still find in the web?
You read the patch notes or go to a reliable source like Eve Uni who document changes like that rapidly, just as everybody else does.

Quote:
A huge disadvantage of relying on the web is that there is a crapton of outdated info out there.
Which is why we tend to point people at the Eve Uni wiki, it's the most up to date resource out there; rumour has it that CCP themselves use it for reference, because it gets an awful lot of hits from Reykjavik.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
EDENCOM DEFENSIVE INITIATIVE
#388 - 2016-07-28 12:03:47 UTC
I will go to help channel and teach those people how they should act in this game to avoid all bad things that can happen to them, but I will not call them stupid. I think I will actually help them this way. More than posting here anything.

ᴇᴠᴇʀʏ ᴘᴀʀᴛ ᴏғ ᴀ ɢᴀᴍᴇ ʜᴇʟᴘs ᴛᴏ ᴛᴇʟʟ ᴀ sᴛᴏʀʏ 📕

ᴡʜᴇʀᴇ ɪs ᴀɴɢʀʏ ᴄᴏɴᴄᴏʀᴅ ɢᴜʏ ᴡʜᴇɴ ʏᴏᴜ ɴᴇᴇᴅ ʜɪᴍ

ᴏsᴘʀᴇʏ 🚀

≡⋁≡ ♥
Judaa K'Marr
Shadow Legions.
Insidious.
#389 - 2016-07-28 12:30:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Judaa K'Marr
Geronimo McVain wrote:
I'm with Lucy. New Players are missing information badly.
Just some examples:
Can you trade from the cargo bay
Where do you have an overview what exactly is each module doing
Where are you taught how to tank a ship correctly
Where are you taught the MWD trick
Where are warned about changed mechanics like installing clones or upgrading clones that you still find in the web?
A huge disadvantage of relying on the web is that there is a crapton of outdated info out there.


But this has always been true. Eve has always been complex and confusing. The question is not why people in general don't play eve. It's why people who did play eve in spite of all that suddenly stopped, and why new people who would stick in eve in spite of complexity, or in some cases because of it, don't anymore, at least to the same scale as a few years ago.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#390 - 2016-07-28 12:35:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Nana Skalski wrote:
I will go to help channel and teach those people how they should act in this game to avoid all bad things that can happen to them, but I will not call them stupid. I think I will actually help them this way. More than posting here anything.
People are stupid if they don't learn from experience, it's much like real life in that respect.

If you want to help, come join us in NCQA too, it's quite an active place and somewhat self moderating with any form of troll or misinformation being forbidden and quickly reported to the ISD team; the atmosphere is a stark contrast to the other areas of the forum.

BTW more posts like the last couple please, you can come across as quite militant which doesn't go over well and gets peoples backs up.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Lucy Lollipops
State War Academy
Caldari State
#391 - 2016-07-28 13:13:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucy Lollipops
Judaa K'Marr wrote:
Geronimo McVain wrote:
I'm with Lucy. New Players are missing information badly.
Just some examples:
Can you trade from the cargo bay
Where do you have an overview what exactly is each module doing
Where are you taught how to tank a ship correctly
Where are you taught the MWD trick
Where are warned about changed mechanics like installing clones or upgrading clones that you still find in the web?
A huge disadvantage of relying on the web is that there is a crapton of outdated info out there.


But this has always been true. Even has always been complex and confusing. The question is not why people in general don't play eve. It's why people who did play eve in spite of all that suddenly stopped, and why new people who would stick in eve in spite of complexity, or in some cases because of it, don't anymore, at least to the same scale as a few years ago.


I can tell you my personal experience to explain why I think many players suddenly stopped playing eve online.

When I was playing WoW and other themepark mmorpgs they had daily quests and some kind of linear advancement.

Me, and the other persons playing with me ( I can tell you because we were talking about it often ) felt "compelled" to play if not everyday, every two or three days at least even during summer time or when busy for real life because we were constantly "feeded" with new things to do, new goals to reach, points to accumulate for dailies to obtain gear as a reward and so on.

This had a double face, it can lead to exhaustion if you don't like the game or if you decide to obtain all or most of the "prizes" developers put in front of you, or it can lead to a very funny consistent play experience if you like the game much and if you don't exhaggerate ( or if developers don't make too many prizes necessary to have fun with your "corpmates" as a group).

Here in Eve it's totally different.

The only moment I had this feeling was during the brief time they made that very primitive dailies, but except for that i didn't have this feeling at all.

You can stop playing for a month and, if you keep the subscription, when you are back the game situation is very similar to what you found before ( except I suppose if you partecipate to wars and so on, but personally I haven't so much time to dedicate to be into very active corps ).

And, keeping your subscription, you can also have your skills improving with time passing, even if you don't login and if you don't play and skills are quite important here so it keeps you out of game with no remorse.

If you add the thing that a mature player with a job can usually afford to buy and sell a plex, so he doesn't even feel compelled to gain some money ingame, you can imagine why I have a clear feeling there are many many persons that stop playing ( maybe returning later on) suddenly.

Maybe they will be back later on. Obviously when a person puts attention to other things there is always the risk the person will begin something new losing interest for what was doing.

Pros and cons.
Gadget Helmsdottir
Gadget's Workshop
#392 - 2016-07-28 14:07:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Gadget Helmsdottir
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Nana Skalski wrote:
I will go to help channel and teach those people how they should act in this game to avoid all bad things that can happen to them, but I will not call them stupid. I think I will actually help them this way. More than posting here anything.
People are stupid if they don't learn from experience, it's much like real life in that respect.

If you want to help, come join us in NCQA too, it's quite an active place and somewhat self moderating with any form of troll or misinformation being forbidden and quickly reported to the ISD team; the atmosphere is a stark contrast to the other areas of the forum.

BTW more posts like the last couple please, you can come across as quite militant which doesn't go over well and gets peoples backs up.


What the hell does health care accreditation have to do with EvE?

Is this a stealth 'bring back clone grades' post? Blink

Oh...wait.

Quality Assurance! That makes much more sense.
.
.
.
Seriously though, how would a new player even know to find these sites you mention (one of which I've never heard of, and I've been around a bit)...let alone know them to be reliable?

Jonah, this part is NOT directed at you specifically - this is a general spiel.

-
-

Look, I'm right here in the center. I fully believe that any piece of information should be found easily (with the proper amount of effort) in game. On the other hand, I'm fully aware that certain concepts can only come through experience - either your own or through others' experiences.

I happen to like that EvE has a bit of a steep learning curve, but I do wish more members of the EvE community would step out of their "sociopathic" personas and help out a newbro rather than lecturing to them that the new player must be stupid, because they didn't know this or that esoteric arcane thing -- whatever the thing happens to be. Too many of you are acting like space hipsters.

Seriously, vets, help out... you can always step back into "Space-Meanie" character afterwards. Make a "helping alt" if you don't want your dastardly rep tarnished with rainbows...

The bottom line is that EvE is what WE - the current playerbase - make of it. Yes, CCP has mechanical control of their game. That's a given, but the community is what defines playing in EvE. There's a fine balance of acceptance and niche play that needs to be carefully nuanced.

EvE will wither and die without new blood, but these new players need to be properly 'blooded' in order to survive in EvE.
I have NO expectations that brand new players have the immediate tools necessary (and in some-cases, the mindset) to fit in the niche that is EvE. So what; train them. Many will go away, and a few will stay. I'd rather see that few increase in number.

Risk averseness is generally developed in human adults (there's a reason US insurance rates drop at age 25); however, in EvE it needs to be tempered. Good EvE players uses a different type of risk evaluation that for the most part will be alien to their daily lives. This is something that needs to be explained to new players, or better yet, the new players need to experience this type of risk evaluation. They don't need to be alone to do this - show them.

Most new players aren't coming from WoW... that's a thing of the past that many vets seem to be stuck on. They're coming from WoT type games and MOBAs. These players may already have the risk evaluation skills needed to prosper in EvE. What they lack is people skills. EvE is a game of cooperation - soloing EvE will only get you so far.

This is a different type of risk -trust - and it also needs to be taught and tempered. Too much trust will just make you a mark, but not enough trust will make you the old cat-lady of EvE -- except with alts instead of felines. This trust balance also needs to be fostered in new players. It'll be harder to teach, but it can be done.


Coaching isn't hand holding. Guiding isn't hand holding. Be the new player's source of experience. They'll pick it up much faster this way. Informed players are players that stay.

Apparently I'm writing a book (sorry guys), so I'll close out with this... quit bitchin' and do something. You don't have to be the uber leader. Just a few words of encouragement instead of disdain for the noob, a calm and logical explanation rather than shouts of HTFU, or bringing a novice into the fold can make all the diference in whether a new player stays or goes.

Once they've made the commitment to embrace EvE - warts and all - then teach them the meaning of HTFU.

--Activist Gadget

Work smarter, not harder. --Scrooge McDuck, an eminent old-Earth economist

Given an hour to save New Eden, how would respected scientist, Albertus Eisenstein compose his thoughts? "Fifty-five minutes to define the problem; save the galaxy in five."
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#393 - 2016-07-28 15:07:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Gadget Helmsdottir wrote:
Seriously though, how would a new player even know to find these sites you mention (one of which I've never heard of, and I've been around a bit)...let alone know them to be reliable?
Agreed, this is a problem, one that I feel should in part addressed by CCP, the tutorials is the ideal place to do it, unfortunately the opportunity to do so has been ignored; it doesn't help that opportunities often cause confusion and that the career tutorials are mostly walls of text.

Quote:
Jonah, this part is NOT directed at you specifically - this is a general spiel.

Look, I'm right here in the center. I fully believe that any piece of information should be found easily (with the proper amount of effort) in game. On the other hand, I'm fully aware that certain concepts can only come through experience - either your own or others' experiences.

I happen to like that EvE has a bit of a steep learning curve, but I do wish more members of EvE the community would step out of their "sociopathic" personas and help out a newbro rather than lecturing to them that the new player must be stupid, because they didn't know this or that esoteric arcane thing -- whatever the thing happens to be. Too many of you are acting like space hipsters.

Seriously, vets, help out... you can always step back into "*******" character afterwards. Make a "helping alt" if you don't want your dastardly rep tarnished with rainbows...

The bottom line is that EvE is what WE - the current playerbase - make of it. Yes, CCP has mechanical control of their game. That's a given, but the community is what defines playing in EvE. There's a fine balance of acceptance and niche play that needs to be carefully nuanced.
Fair comment, and there's a lot to be said for it, most of the people that cause other players to explode will happily help out somebody with questions, what they won't do is help out somebody who wishes ill on them in real life; sadly the fact of the matter is that the latter happens so often that we have tear collectors, and not in the funny way.

Quote:
EvE will wither and die without new blood, but these new players need to be properly 'blooded' to survive in EvE.
I have NO expectations that brand new players have the immediate tools necessary (and in some-cases, the mindset) to fit in the niche that is EvE. So what; train them. Many will go away, and a few will stay. I'd rather see that few increase in number.

Risk averseness is generallydeveloped in human adults (there's a reason US insurance rates drop at age 25); however, in EvE it needs to be tempered. Good EvE player's uses a different type of risk evaluation that for the most part will be alien to their daily lives. This is something that needs to be explained to new players, or better yet, the new players need to experience this type of risk evaluation. They don't need to be alone to do this - show them.

Most new players aren't coming from WoW... that's a thing of the past that many vets seem to be stuck on. They're coming from WoT type games and MOBAs. These players may already have the risk evaluation skills needed to prosper in EvE. What they lack is people skills. EvE is a game of cooperation - soloing EvE will only get you so far.

This is a different type of risk -trust - and it also needs to be taught and tempered. Too much trust will just make you a mark, but not enough trust will make you the old cat-lady of EvE -- except with alts instead of felines. This trust balance also needs to be fostered in new players. It'll be harder to teach, but it can be done.
No argument here.


Quote:
Coaching isn't hand holding. Guiding isn't hand holding. Be the new player's source of experience. They'll pick it up much faster this way. Informed players are players that stay.

Apparently I'm writing a book (sorry guys), so I'll close out with this... quit bitchin' and do something. You don't have to be the uber leader. Just a few words of encouragement instead of disdain for the noob, a calm and logical explanation rather than shouts of HTFU, or bringing a novice into the fold can make all the diference in whether a new player stays or goes.

Once they've made the commitment to embrace EvE - warts and all - then teach them the meaning of HTFU.

--Activist Gadget
It's a good post, I have but one like to give. Big smile

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Geronimo McVain
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#394 - 2016-07-28 16:07:44 UTC
Judaa K'Marr wrote:


But this has always been true. Eve has always been complex and confusing. The question is not why people in general don't play eve. It's why people who did play eve in spite of all that suddenly stopped, and why new people who would stick in eve in spite of complexity, or in some cases because of it, don't anymore, at least to the same scale as a few years ago.

The experience that players have is different. Today complex game do their best to break down the complexity. And the complexity in Eve is growing. Where is the difference between a citadel and a starbase? Sure, when you lifted through the change it is logical but for someone who is completely new to the game? I really don't care if the info is in Uni Wiki or evelopedia but there need to be a quick INGAME access. Video tutorials are nice to have but nowhere as complete as written material where you can check something quickly.
If Eve would turn to consoles it would help enormously because there you are forced to break down the complexity, not lower it, to manageable levels.
Brokk Witgenstein
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#395 - 2016-07-28 16:24:26 UTC
So THIS is what vets mean when their game gets dumbed down. Now I get it Teckos, now I get it.

Consoles.
For crying out loud.
Do you think I have a 27 inch screen because I like consoles??

This ****** is just UmPfHhhh come on guys, the info is there. At least try to put in minimal effort? It's not like "the vets" are utterly unwilling to tell the nooblings everything they know, along with experience you couldn't possibly write down?

I'd rather CCP invest time in maintaining / developing / patching the game than in writing lengthy written works which, much like an EULA, nobody would read anyway. IF there were a manual, you'd be all like "oooohhhh but that's on page 183- tl;dr I didn't make it past page 5 until the book ran out of pretty pictures"

~sorry rant~

I love my screen. I love EvE. I'm not that old in-game, I KNOW the newbro experience. It sends exactly the right message: experiment, learn, study, adapt, improve -- then perhaps you end up on top of the food chain. THIS is the message newbros need to get. Who cares about the difference between a starbase, an outpost, an NPC station and a citadel? One day you run into something awkward, you research / google / forumpost / reddit it et voila! Another player got smarter. Tell his corp buddies about it - another 30 players got smarter. Guy makes a youtube video about it; problem solved.

This IS a player driven universe. EvE University is a player initiative and I think it's beautiful. It's amazing all this grew from a simple sandbox with basic tools. The freaking manual would be 570 pages long and it still wouldn't cover all aspects, because most of it is designed by players. Newbro doesn't know who PL is? Go ahead, tackle that Mastodon-- you'll soon find out LOL! ~wooops~
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#396 - 2016-07-28 16:56:29 UTC
Judaa K'Marr wrote:
Geronimo McVain wrote:
I'm with Lucy. New Players are missing information badly.
Just some examples:
Can you trade from the cargo bay
Where do you have an overview what exactly is each module doing
Where are you taught how to tank a ship correctly
Where are you taught the MWD trick
Where are warned about changed mechanics like installing clones or upgrading clones that you still find in the web?
A huge disadvantage of relying on the web is that there is a crapton of outdated info out there.


But this has always been true. Eve has always been complex and confusing. The question is not why people in general don't play eve. It's why people who did play eve in spite of all that suddenly stopped, and why new people who would stick in eve in spite of complexity, or in some cases because of it, don't anymore, at least to the same scale as a few years ago.


This post right here explains the problem those asking for a kinder/gentler Eve have. All those points have been with us since day one. None of the people asking for a kinder/gentler Eve can explain this.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#397 - 2016-07-28 17:07:01 UTC
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:
So THIS is what vets mean

*chanting*
one of us
one of us
one of us

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
Dirty Forum Alt
Forum Alts Anonymous
#398 - 2016-07-28 17:09:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Dirty Forum Alt
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:
So THIS is what vets mean

*chanting*
one of us
one of us
one of us

Brokk has officially reached bittervet level 1

4 more levels to go Pirate

The dead swans lay in the stagnant pool. They lay. They rotted. They turned Around occasionally. Bits of flesh dropped off them from Time to time. And sank into the pool's mire. They also smelt a great deal.

Paula Nancy Millstone Jennings (Sussex)
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#399 - 2016-07-28 17:13:42 UTC
Geronimo McVain wrote:
Judaa K'Marr wrote:


But this has always been true. Eve has always been complex and confusing. The question is not why people in general don't play eve. It's why people who did play eve in spite of all that suddenly stopped, and why new people who would stick in eve in spite of complexity, or in some cases because of it, don't anymore, at least to the same scale as a few years ago.

The experience that players have is different. Today complex game do their best to break down the complexity. And the complexity in Eve is growing. Where is the difference between a citadel and a starbase? Sure, when you lifted through the change it is logical but for someone who is completely new to the game? I really don't care if the info is in Uni Wiki or evelopedia but there need to be a quick INGAME access. Video tutorials are nice to have but nowhere as complete as written material where you can check something quickly.
If Eve would turn to consoles it would help enormously because there you are forced to break down the complexity, not lower it, to manageable levels.


Eve University is a great place to learn about the game. They have a pretty comprehensive wiki, and are an entity in game that will teach you how things work. They will accept any and all applications regardless of SP.

There are also lots of youtube videos on how things work.

There are the forums as well. For a game that has a harsh reputation quite a few players can be quite helpful in explaining how certain things work.

There is a help channel in game.

I have not gone through the new player experience since it has been revamped, but my understanding is CCP revamped that too.

Joining a corporation in game can also help you learn about aspects of the game.

And lastly we have these amazing things called search engines that use powerful algorithms to find the stuff you are looking for.

But no, the information is not spoon fed to you...then again the last time you were spoon fed you also couldn't form a cogent sentence.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#400 - 2016-07-28 17:31:26 UTC
Dirty Forum Alt wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:
So THIS is what vets mean

*chanting*
one of us
one of us
one of us

Brokk has officially reached bittervet level 1



Welcome Brokk.. There use to be cookies, you can guess what happened to those.





☼

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.