Player Features and Ideas Discussion

I've noticed lately that skiffs and procurers and somewhat the underdogs when it comes to ore mining. Actually, they are beaten to a pulp by mining frigates and their t2 variants.
They are used mostly in ice mining. Actually, they are somewhat the kings at this task in empire space.

But, back to the topic,
The skiff and the procurer have similar yields to mackinaw and retriever but, it sacrifices cargo space for tankiness.

The issue:
Compared to hulks and mackinaws(and their t1 variants), the skiff and procurer are almost unusable for ore mining due to the high yield per miner (3000m3 with t2 crystals). Most of the cycles are wasted, thus, any hope of efficiency in this ship is lost.

Current bonuses:
Mining Barge bonuses (per skill level):
5% bonus to ship shield hitpoints
2% reduction in Strip Miner and Ice Harvester duration

Exhumers bonuses (per skill level):
4% bonus to all shield resistances
2% reduction in Strip Miner and Ice Harvester duration

Role Bonus:
150% bonus to Strip Miner yield
60% reduction in Ice Harvester duration and activation cost
50% bonus to drone damage and hitpoints

The solution:
Replace the current yield bonus with cycle time reduction, similar to ice harvesters and slightly nerf them(maybe add some range bonus, as compensation)

Proposed bonuses:
Mining Barge bonuses (per skill level):
5% bonus to ship shield hitpoints
2% reduction in Ice Harvester duration
1% reduction in Strip Miner duration
1-5% bonus to Strip Miner and Ice Harvester range

Exhumers bonuses (per skill level):
4% bonus to all shield resistances
2% reduction in Ice Harvester duration
1% reduction in Strip Miner duration
1-5% bonus to Strip Miner and Ice Harvester range

Role Bonus:
60% reduction in Strip Miner and Ice Harvester duration(and activation cost maybe?)
50% bonus to drone damage and hitpoints

It would further differentiate the skiff and procurers as niche mining ships, fix their ore mining problem(please dont say "use survey scanner").

Or simpy add a new line of strip miners, with lower yield and lower cycle times.

Use survey scanner.....

Seriously though, the Proc and Skiff are fine as they are. They serve their purpose quite well.
They have the same mining rate as a Ret/Mack respectively, but sacrifice hold for tank.

This mission has been accomplished.
I'm failing to see why any change is needed at this time.

I hear that there might be a general overhaul of mining for all classes, but I'm going to hold judgement on that rumour until I hear details.

Until then, the tanky barge/exhumer is working as intended.

-1

--Gadget

Your belief that the Expedition Frigates mine more than the Procurer are incorrect.

The only way the Expedition Frigates come close is by using non-viable builds:

• Skiff: 21.9 m3 / sec (basic T2 build with T2 crystals).
• Procurer: 16.8 m3 / sec (basic T2 build with T2 crystals).
• Prospect: 16.1 m3 / sec (not a viable build: requires MDC Miner II's and 4x MLU II's, which requires 2x CPU rigs and nothing in your mids but a compact AB)

A build that's more likely on the Prospect puts it between 12.6 and 14.8 m3 / sec. You still need one CPU rig, though, so if you get rid of that, you're down to ~11.6 m3 / sec.

You can hate on the Procurer (wrongly) as much as you want, but don't spread false information.

You can get full cycles 100% of the time if you put a little forethought into it. The easiest way to do this is to use a survey scanner and not mining the first rock you see in a public highec belt.

CCP shouldn't be expected to change the game just to cater to people who don't have the desire to put a little forethought into things. If you just want to warp to a belt and mine without doing anything else, you don't deserve higher yields. Miners who put effort into finding a good source for ore and know how to monitor their rocks, however, do (and you won't find them complaining about the Procurer's mining).

The proc/skiff has more yield, more speed, more tank, more dps, larger drone bays AND more efficient mining lasers.

The only thing the rettie/mack has is a bigger ore bay.

yes, the answer is to use a survey scanner. You literally only need one person in your fleet to have one fit to completely avoid this "problem".

You don't want to risk losing half a cycle every now and then? Don't use a procurer and risk not having a tanked ship. What's more expensive, losing half a cycle every once in a while or losing your ship entirely because you were an easy target?

I would like you to consult a local CODE. agent on why skiff is not a bad idea and why mining yield is not the only thing that matters.

Just go use a hulk and mine in .5 system.

See how that goes.
Better yet, mine in Uedama, it has freighters going through that can pick your courier packages.

A big no!

A simple solution for your problem would be take a retriver and risk to be ganked or leave the highsec. So you see there is already a solution for your probleme in the game.

-1

Barge changes are already in the works for the fall update. Does no one read about the upcoming updates?

I think that the skiff is mostly OK currently. If I were allowed to adjust it I would probably stop at adding extra cap and giving the Skiff the DSTs' +2 warp core stability. Extra CPU would be nice but isn't really required.

Consider the fit below. I really woulld like to be able to replace the cap recharger with a survey scanner without compromising cap stability. I recognize though that a Skiff's modus operandi is based around selecting roids of one type and serially pressing F1.

[Skiff, hard tank]
Mining Laser Upgrade II
Mining Laser Upgrade II
Mining Laser Upgrade II

Medium Shield Booster II
Thermal Dissipation Amplifier II
EM Ward Field II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Cap Recharger II

Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I

Medium Anti-Kinetic Screen Reinforcer I
Medium Processor Overclocking Unit I

Vespa II x5
Hammerhead II x5