Science & Industry

Everything is bad for HS miners, even if they doubled the yield and trebled the tank across the board...
There would still be cries of "Why didn't they quadruple the yield, and make the trip back to station for me!!!!!"

Annoying people rather than fixing the problem is terrible game design.

First of all you tend to see only Skiffs and Procurers in systems where gankers are always active, after that you only see players who like to mine in a tanking ship, because they don't want to be an easy kill. Currently CODE. are running around various systems to kill people in the other mining ships so they can say look CCP everyone is in Skiffs and Procurers, isn't this boring, nerf them to create content please. sigh

I started mining again when I had the opportunity to use a ship that did not have the tank of a wet paper bag, but also with enough yield to not completely waste my time, nerfing the Skiff and Procurer will be a shame in terms of game balance. There are enough people using the other ships that are easy to kill and go for yield over tank, I see these people quite often and the killboards show it too.

Like always I will wait and see, if the tank is not enough for me then I just will not bother mining, which I only do when I cannot be bothered to do anything else. For reference CCP I stopped doing any mining at all from the point in time that Catalysts had their DPS buffed up until the time the Skiff and Procurer were given a tank and I will do the same again. So CCP needs to think very carefully about destroying the tank of ships that more discerning players use.

As far as I can see there are plenty of ganks going on, the balance is fine.

I hope that this is to fit in with the new structures and new mining gameplay only, one can only hope..., but expect to be disappointed...

As far as I can see there is currently nothing particularly broken on the roles and balance between the mining barges/exhumers, or on the additional mining yield in nullsec over highsec.

Of course CCP wants to bring mining boosts on-grid. IMO an easy and good solution would be the introduction of a new ORE Command Ship (i.e. like the Damnation and at a similar price point). The ship would provide boosts similar to the Rorqual in nullsec and lesser boosts in highsec (enviromental regulations on spacedust etc etc). With some DPS this ship could also assist in getting rid of belt rats or perhaps counter (or at least deter) the occasional gank destroyer if used in HighSec.

The Orca would keep its current role combining boosts and ore/ship storage and would still hold court as the king of highsec AFK mining, surrounded by the usual following of procurers and skiffs.

The Rorqual would be looking for a new role (what else is new), but from the hints that CCP have given it could very well be "carrier mining". Ensure the increase in yield is comparable to to the current step between AFK ishtar and carrier ratting and people will no doubt be eager to give it a try.
Some balance issues would need to be solved: 1> i.e. reduce the ore bay on the Rorqual so it will need to warp to a POS/Citadel to dump ore, which generates "moments of increased risk" similar to a carrier warping to a new anomaly, 2> require active control of the mining drones (similar to fighters) so multiboxing does not have a disproportionate impact on the mining economy. No need for a dumb invulnerability mechanism either.

Knowing CCP, any changes to barges will be BAD for the mining profession.

They'll probably force the camera to pan around your ship every time you mine an asteroid.

Theres reason why everone uses skiff now.. its reasonable price and tank against ganking... Come on CCP, Mining ships are supposed to be monsters that destroy asteroids. Something not even titans with their super weapons are not able to do... Its should take considerably more firepower then now used by gangers to destroy them...

Personally im keping my fingers cross that they actually dont mess it up this time.. But knowing CCP anything is bossible..

Well, there are some changes I would like.

Hulk: add 15 grid,15 CPU, a midslot and a cap boost (25 will do, more would be nice). Maybe a bigger drone bay.
Skiff: more CPU. +2 warp core stability, like DSTs. Bigger changes (being able to fit a large shield booster forex) would change the character of the ship.
Orca: An upper slot (tractor!), maybe a midslot. More capacitor.
Mack: Maybe some more CPU.

One thing that would be cool for the Rorq and the Orca would be to bring back an optional onboard compression module, though maybe not as a siege action. The orca and if needed the Rorq should get a slot of whatever type is needed for this.

Well I would like some improvement to low sec mining. Offer some unique asteroids that provide a much greater yield than anything you can find in high sec. Barges themselves don't need any improvement. The market will simply adjust.

As crazy as it may sound, I'm hoping for an overhaul of how asteroid belts work. Instead of having static belts in every system, make them all anoms that will respawn with similar mechanics to ice belts (four hours after it was mined out), but in different systems instead of the same system.

I know it isn't a change to the barges, per se, but it would be an interesting change to mining as a whole. It would give haulers a lot more work to do, and would make compression arrays much more useful (not saying they aren't, just that they'd be very useful for transporting ores instead of mining and using in the same few systems).

The Hulk/Covetor is fine at the job it's designed for; it's a great tool in an organised mining operation with advance warning from scouts of incoming hostiles, and an couple of PvE ships (including one appropriately fit Blackbird) on grid to keep the rats off you.

The Hulk provides 30% more Ore than a Skiff, at a cost of greater vulnerability (which is negated by the advantages of being in an organised group) and 3.5 times the Mining Crystal usage.

If you use the Hulk for the purpose for which it was intended, it works perfectly well. If there was one thing I'd like to see it get, it'd be a Role Bonus: "70% reduction in chances of Mining Crystal damage"



The real problem is that the Retriever, which appears to have been intended as the new Miners first barge, is simply unfit for purpose, because new miners main problem isn't running out of Ore Hold, it's surviving the gankers to do so.

The Retriever's weaknesses are only addressed by mining in a fleet, which immediately means that it's major advantage is worthless because an organised mining fleet has haulers, so you're better off in a Covetor.

The Retriever & the Mackinaw lose to the Procurer & Skiff for solo-survivability, and to the Covetor & Hulk for fleet mining ops. They were designed for a niche that doesn't really exist.