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Dev Blog: Bidding Farewell to the In-game Browser

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Tipa Riot
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#41 - 2016-06-20 17:30:07 UTC
Important is, to be able to open fittings on websites ingame ... or will this be removed? Also to be able to configure exactly which browser / params are used to open the ext. browser on link-click ingame.

I'm my own NPC alt.
Annette Nolen
Perkone
Caldari State
#42 - 2016-06-20 17:31:53 UTC
Quote:
While the IGB has some extra functions beyond the list above, after looking at metrics of what EVE specific functions were being used these were the most used by a substantial margin. As such, they are the functions we pushed to have replicated in CREST.


RFF would really love IGB's ability to open emails with pre-filled templates/recipients ported to CREST too.

Or, I mean, the ability to flat out send mail via a fully developed CREST endpoint for evemail would be even more awesome :)

Likewise the existing IGB showContract being ported as-is to CREST covers us for now, but probably no surprise that we are collectively praying for a fully developed set of CREST endpoints for contract management to show up someday too!
Dex Cordell
EVE University
Ivy League
#43 - 2016-06-20 17:32:15 UTC
CCP FoxFour wrote:
Alexhandr Shkarov wrote:
CCP FoxFour wrote:
o7 Good bye IGB.


One of my favourite tools from the IGB was that I could link fittings directly from our doctrine page.
Would there be a way that we can do something similar with CREST by giving them the option to download all fittings within the corporate/alliance doctrines.

Right now I can simply put them into an HTML page within the auth, but after this it'll be really frustrating to import fits as new member (or after an update).


There is a CREST resource for creating fits. Fleet-Up uses this amazingly well. I log i to fleet-up, view the doctrines for my corp, pick the one I want to fly, click the sync to game link, switch to client, view fit in my saved fits, and buy it. So while a little longer it still works really well for that.



saved fits...the 200 piece cap of personal fittings is starting to get insufficient, and it forces me to use external tools for no apparent valid reason, EFT ftw. havent gotten to suggest the cap removed in the forums yet, thanks for reminding me.
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#44 - 2016-06-20 17:32:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Rivr Luzade
CCP FoxFour wrote:
Rivr Luzade wrote:
Of course they do. I want to see the map ingame, while I check other things and actually keep being able to check other things and do not have to alt-tab out of the game to check an external app. Like what kind of reasoning are you even using... Shocked


Is there a reason you're unwilling to use an Overlay?

The overlays that I just stated are inadequate? Is there a reason why CCP cannot manage to maintain an IGB while other game developers can?

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
Caldranna
Let's annoy'em
#45 - 2016-06-20 17:33:28 UTC
CCP FoxFour wrote:
Rivr Luzade wrote:
CCP FoxFour wrote:
Dex Cordell wrote:
Dominous Nolen wrote:
RIP IGB.. Honestly this has been expected for a long time, sad to see it happening though because it is useful in alot of ways (especially in wormhole space for mapping)



sheesh forgot about that one, goodbye mapper, dotlan...that's gonna generate an uproar.
@CCP: where did you get the usage metrics? there's loads of people who absolutely rely on a variety of ingame browser WH mappers to light their way in a world without maps and autopilot routes. I'll hate being blind past the next wormhole.


We inserted some metrics a while ago every time one of the JavaScript callbacks was used but also just for every page load, how long the browser is open, etc.

WH mappers don't need the IGB. They can pull your location from CREST.

Of course they do. I want to see the map ingame, while I check other things and actually keep being able to check other things and do not have to alt-tab out of the game to check an external app. Like what kind of reasoning are you even using... Shocked


Is there a reason you're unwilling to use an Overlay?


CCP, you wrote that "To be clear CCP does not officially endorse or support overlays and therefor does not guarantee that they work or don't cause unexpected problems with the EVE Online client." How are we supposed to use something that you do not really support?
Is it really that hard to keep the In Game Browser with its basic functionality that has been used for many years?
CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
#46 - 2016-06-20 17:41:32 UTC
Rivr Luzade wrote:
CCP FoxFour wrote:
Rivr Luzade wrote:
Of course they do. I want to see the map ingame, while I check other things and actually keep being able to check other things and do not have to alt-tab out of the game to check an external app. Like what kind of reasoning are you even using... Shocked


Is there a reason you're unwilling to use an Overlay?

The overlays that I just stated are inadequate? Is there a reason why CCP cannot manage to maintain an IGB while other game developers can?


An overlay is inadequate but the IGB was not? How in the world does that make sense? Pretty much every overlay out there with a browser is years ahead of the IGB.

@CCP_FoxFour // Technical Designer // Team Tech Co

Third-party developer? Check out the official developers site for dev blogs, resources, and more.
CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
#47 - 2016-06-20 17:42:22 UTC
Caldranna wrote:
CCP FoxFour wrote:
Rivr Luzade wrote:
CCP FoxFour wrote:
Dex Cordell wrote:
Dominous Nolen wrote:
RIP IGB.. Honestly this has been expected for a long time, sad to see it happening though because it is useful in alot of ways (especially in wormhole space for mapping)



sheesh forgot about that one, goodbye mapper, dotlan...that's gonna generate an uproar.
@CCP: where did you get the usage metrics? there's loads of people who absolutely rely on a variety of ingame browser WH mappers to light their way in a world without maps and autopilot routes. I'll hate being blind past the next wormhole.


We inserted some metrics a while ago every time one of the JavaScript callbacks was used but also just for every page load, how long the browser is open, etc.

WH mappers don't need the IGB. They can pull your location from CREST.

Of course they do. I want to see the map ingame, while I check other things and actually keep being able to check other things and do not have to alt-tab out of the game to check an external app. Like what kind of reasoning are you even using... Shocked


Is there a reason you're unwilling to use an Overlay?


CCP, you wrote that "To be clear CCP does not officially endorse or support overlays and therefor does not guarantee that they work or don't cause unexpected problems with the EVE Online client." How are we supposed to use something that you do not really support?
Is it really that hard to keep the In Game Browser with its basic functionality that has been used for many years?


Leaving it as it is would be a risk and we want to ensure our users are as safe as possible.

@CCP_FoxFour // Technical Designer // Team Tech Co

Third-party developer? Check out the official developers site for dev blogs, resources, and more.
Airi Cho
Dark-Rising
Wrecking Machine.
#48 - 2016-06-20 17:42:47 UTC
Caldranna wrote:

CCP, you wrote that "To be clear CCP does not officially endorse or support overlays and therefor does not guarantee that they work or don't cause unexpected problems with the EVE Online client." How are we supposed to use something that you do not really support?
Is it really that hard to keep the In Game Browser with its basic functionality that has been used for many years?


Just look at how often your normal browser vendors are updating the browser for security reasons. And they often change the browser in a way that to fix the integration into other applications, is not a small amount of work.

IGB: "AppleWebKit/532.0 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/3.0.195.27 Safari/532.0 EVE-IGB"
Chrome: "AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/51.0.2704.103 Safari/537.36"

so from the looks this is a really really old version of the engine.

for me ... instead of wasting resources on maintaining yet another browser on my system, i would rather see CREST improved, because that functionality is more useful for the community at large.
CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
#49 - 2016-06-20 17:43:57 UTC
Tipa Riot wrote:
Important is, to be able to open fittings on websites ingame ... or will this be removed? Also to be able to configure exactly which browser / params are used to open the ext. browser on link-click ingame.


You wont be able to do open a fitting for viewing no, but you can save it to a characters saved fits.

@CCP_FoxFour // Technical Designer // Team Tech Co

Third-party developer? Check out the official developers site for dev blogs, resources, and more.
Tyrindel Vaedrelin
Kiosk Cartel
Fraternity.
#50 - 2016-06-20 17:44:48 UTC
so basically your taking away functions to force support for a new project . overlays i have seen cause a lot of issues with different games can be resource hogs and oh you don't support any of them. there a many mmos out there that don't charge a monthly fee but can maintain a browser. so i am calling this for what it is ccp wants to cut corners where it can while forcing use of a system they know wont be well received. This hurts worm people a lot and forces reliance on 3rd party apps which if use api's are just spy tools. so thanks for nothing oh wait thanks for removing a feature that works just fine for what its used with
l0rd carlos
the king asked me to guard the mountain
#51 - 2016-06-20 17:44:55 UTC
I found an old exploit for Chrome 3, but it did not work for the ingame browser. Did you patch some critical bugs in the last few years?

It was something about a lot of >>>>> symbols would make it crash.

Youtube Channel about Micro and Small scale PvP with commentary: Fleet Commentary by l0rd carlos
l0rd carlos
the king asked me to guard the mountain
#52 - 2016-06-20 17:45:51 UTC
Tyrindel Vaedrelin wrote:
so basically your taking away functions to force support for a new project . overlays i have seen cause a lot of issues with different games can be resource hogs and oh you don't support any of them. there a many mmos out there that don't charge a monthly fee but can maintain a browser. so i am calling this for what it is ccp wants to cut corners where it can while forcing use of a system they know wont be well received. This hurts worm people a lot and forces reliance on 3rd party apps which if use api's are just spy tools. so thanks for nothing oh wait thanks for removing a feature that works just fine for what its used with


Can't you just use a regular browser and force it to be on top?

Youtube Channel about Micro and Small scale PvP with commentary: Fleet Commentary by l0rd carlos
Dex Cordell
EVE University
Ivy League
#53 - 2016-06-20 17:46:21 UTC
CCP FoxFour wrote:
Tipa Riot wrote:
Important is, to be able to open fittings on websites ingame ... or will this be removed? Also to be able to configure exactly which browser / params are used to open the ext. browser on link-click ingame.


You wont be able to do open a fitting for viewing no, but you can save it to a characters saved fits.


200 fits cap...remove it
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#54 - 2016-06-20 17:47:03 UTC
CCP FoxFour wrote:
Rivr Luzade wrote:
CCP FoxFour wrote:
Rivr Luzade wrote:
Of course they do. I want to see the map ingame, while I check other things and actually keep being able to check other things and do not have to alt-tab out of the game to check an external app. Like what kind of reasoning are you even using... Shocked


Is there a reason you're unwilling to use an Overlay?

The overlays that I just stated are inadequate? Is there a reason why CCP cannot manage to maintain an IGB while other game developers can?


An overlay is inadequate but the IGB was not? How in the world does that make sense? Pretty much every overlay out there with a browser is years ahead of the IGB.

Not far enough ahead apparently to have bookmarks, for instance.

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
CCP Darwin
C C P
C C P Alliance
#55 - 2016-06-20 17:48:04 UTC
Rivr Luzade wrote:
The overlays that I just stated are inadequate? Is there a reason why CCP cannot manage to maintain an IGB while other game developers can?

I'm struggling to think of examples for this, other than the Steam in-game browser, and their development situation isn't really analogous to ours.

CCP Darwin  •  Senior Software Engineer, Art & Graphics, EVE Online  •  @mark_wilkins
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#56 - 2016-06-20 17:49:18 UTC
Can someone tell me how to add EVE properly to Steam so that I can test that overlay? Using "Add a Non-Steam Game" with the exe file from "...\EVE\tq\eve.exe" apparently does not do the trick. I cannot load the overlay with the set up hotkey.

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
Airi Cho
Dark-Rising
Wrecking Machine.
#57 - 2016-06-20 17:49:34 UTC
Tyrindel Vaedrelin wrote:
so basically your taking away functions to force support for a new project . overlays i have seen cause a lot of issues with different games can be resource hogs and oh you don't support any of them. there a many mmos out there that don't charge a monthly fee but can maintain a browser. so i am calling this for what it is ccp wants to cut corners where it can while forcing use of a system they know wont be well received. This hurts worm people a lot and forces reliance on 3rd party apps which if use api's are just spy tools. so thanks for nothing oh wait thanks for removing a feature that works just fine for what its used with


1. you can limit what people can access on crest as well as on the old API. not happy with their access requirements. use a different app or write your own.

2. you are already feeding a lot of information to those apps. not sure if you ever looked at the special headers sent by the ingame browser.

3. did you ever wonder why you are doing all the mapping work and the site owner gets all the informations for free? they have a close to perfect view of big parts of WH space.
Tyrindel Vaedrelin
Kiosk Cartel
Fraternity.
#58 - 2016-06-20 17:49:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Tyrindel Vaedrelin
not safely while moving threw wormhole connections it will block sight from in game. a out of game map will get people killed needlessly


thats why every wh corps have moved away from apps like siggy to open source self hosted like pathfinder
Airi Cho
Dark-Rising
Wrecking Machine.
#59 - 2016-06-20 17:52:23 UTC
Tyrindel Vaedrelin wrote:
not safely while moving threw wormhole connections it will block sight from in game. a out of game map will get people killed needlessly


thats why every wh corps have moved away from apps like siggy to open source self hosted like pathfinder


Depending how big you make your windows. if your browse isnt full screen then you can see as much as you could see before with the IGB in foreground.
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#60 - 2016-06-20 17:53:09 UTC