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Crime & Punishment

 
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Plea for more than 3 minutes to kill a freighter

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Galaxy Pig
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#81 - 2016-05-07 14:19:12 UTC
John, who let you out of your cage?

Highsec is owned by players now. Systems 0.5-1.0 are New Order Territory. All miners and other residents of Highsec must obey The Code. Mining without a permit is dangerous and harmful to the EVE community. See www.MinerBumping.com
Sarah Flynt
Red Cross Mercenaries
Silent Infinity
#82 - 2016-05-07 18:46:15 UTC
John E Normus wrote:
And yet Red Frog is making more isk than ever according to what they've told us at eve-meets in Amsterdam and Germany.

Are they lying to us Sarah?
They don't publish their full finances, so that's hard to determine as an outsider. They publish the revenue situation but barely anything on the cost side. The only 2 corps that are relevant for this discussion are Red Frog Freight and Blue Frog Freight as they are their highsec wings (low collateral and high collateral contracts). Black Frog Freight is lowsec/nullsec, so it doesn't matter in our context here.

If you look at the revenue numbers, especially when comparing them to the growth rates of previous years, you see that 2015 put a handbreak on their growth compared to the growth rates of previous years. Blue Frog Freight revenue even declined in 2015 for the first time. Red Frog Freight only showed tiny growth compared to previous years.

Now, with more or less stagnating revenue but vastly increased cost according to their press releases about their massively increased fees, to what conclusion do you come?

Sick of High-Sec gankers? Join the public channel Anti-ganking and the dedicated intel channel Gank-Intel !
John E Normus
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#83 - 2016-05-07 21:48:34 UTC
That hauling is a business and business is good.

P

Between Ignorance and Wisdom
Galaxy Pig
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#84 - 2016-05-08 05:52:15 UTC
I would conclude that the Code always wins. Always. Especially arguments with Sarah Flynt.

Highsec is owned by players now. Systems 0.5-1.0 are New Order Territory. All miners and other residents of Highsec must obey The Code. Mining without a permit is dangerous and harmful to the EVE community. See www.MinerBumping.com
eddie valvetino
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#85 - 2016-05-09 12:53:01 UTC  |  Edited by: eddie valvetino
Galaxy Pig wrote:
I realize that CCP aims to nerf highsec freighter ganking, but do they intend to end it all-together?

When the nerf to Awoxing was on the horizon, a desperate plea was made by the players and CCP had the good judgement to implement the toggle-switch, thus saving awoxing from total death.

Now, a nerf to freighter suicide ganking comes in the form of a 3-minute warp timer, and we need to try and reason with CCP to allow us more than just 3 measly minutes.

Just making it 5 minutes would make a world of difference.

I implore you, noble Devs, reconsider the practicality of recently proposed mechanics changes to bumping/warping.

Thank you.


If you had more mates you would have more deeps and this wouldn't be a problem

this sounds a lot like the age old Carebear whine "CCP there is something I don't like change the game to suit me"
Dom Arkaral
Bannheim
Cuttlefish Collective
#86 - 2016-05-10 00:27:54 UTC
John E Normus wrote:
That hauling is a business and business is good.

P

Is that what you do nowadays? been awhile since I saw you gank something bigger than a diner P

Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester.

Broadcast 4 Reps -- YOU ARE NOT ALONE, EVER

Instigator of the First ISD Thunderdome

CCL Loyalist
PhantomMajor
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#87 - 2016-06-15 07:11:01 UTC
Sasha Cohenberg wrote:
Ozzie Udan wrote:
Tyyler DURden wrote:
Perhaps you should have consulted with your peers before you started this thread. The majority of code affiliated opinions expressed in the previously locked thread indicated that this nerf to bumping wasn't much to be concerned about.

Of course there is the possibility that you're trying to be............. what's that word............. oh got it...........
Facetious.


It's only a nerf to ransoming scum pirates , sorry you need to work a bit harder. Tyyler DURden is right Facetious is a word that fits well here.


Getting donations from other haulers is a time honored tradition in highsec


Demanding a ransom requires thought, some planning and effort, where as mashing the function keys after you lock a freighter doesn't. ...hence why ransoming is a dying/dead art form imo
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#88 - 2016-06-15 11:03:03 UTC
Why would you even use Red Frog if Freighters where completely save in Highsec? You just load your Freighter and some (thanks to skill injectors free2play) NPC corp alt ships the stuff AFK-AP to the location. There is no opportunity cost anymore if you can get free freighter alts and zero attention is needed.

The Red Frog business model in Higshec is only alive because there is a healthy amount of ganking. It creates an environment where you may lose your stuff and paying someone to ship your stuff for a fee with a collateral is a great way to mitigate that risk. If that risk goes away, so will Red Frogs customers.

It is really quite simple. The more risk there is the more money there will be for enterprises who specialize in shipping your goods and who know how to mitigate their own risk.

Evil RatKid
Crinnfika
Doomheim
#89 - 2016-06-15 21:53:39 UTC
Ima Wreckyou wrote:
Why would you even use Red Frog if Freighters where completely save in Highsec? You just load your Freighter and some (thanks to skill injectors free2play) NPC corp alt ships the stuff AFK-AP to the location. There is no opportunity cost anymore if you can get free freighter alts and zero attention is needed.

The Red Frog business model in Higshec is only alive because there is a healthy amount of ganking. It creates an environment where you may lose your stuff and paying someone to ship your stuff for a fee with a collateral is a great way to mitigate that risk. If that risk goes away, so will Red Frogs customers.

It is really quite simple. The more risk there is the more money there will be for enterprises who specialize in shipping your goods and who know how to mitigate their own risk.



Freight contracts have never been about risk or safety. Freight contracts exist for the same reason FedEx exists in the real world: Paying someone else to haul my stuff is infinitely more convenient than hauling the stuff myself.

Every person in the game has the power to haul their own goods and no you don't need a freighter either. People pay Red Frog because they don't want to have to spend the time to haul it.
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#90 - 2016-06-16 08:40:15 UTC
Crinnfika wrote:
Ima Wreckyou wrote:
Why would you even use Red Frog if Freighters where completely save in Highsec? You just load your Freighter and some (thanks to skill injectors free2play) NPC corp alt ships the stuff AFK-AP to the location. There is no opportunity cost anymore if you can get free freighter alts and zero attention is needed.

The Red Frog business model in Higshec is only alive because there is a healthy amount of ganking. It creates an environment where you may lose your stuff and paying someone to ship your stuff for a fee with a collateral is a great way to mitigate that risk. If that risk goes away, so will Red Frogs customers.

It is really quite simple. The more risk there is the more money there will be for enterprises who specialize in shipping your goods and who know how to mitigate their own risk.



Freight contracts have never been about risk or safety. Freight contracts exist for the same reason FedEx exists in the real world: Paying someone else to haul my stuff is infinitely more convenient than hauling the stuff myself.

Every person in the game has the power to haul their own goods and no you don't need a freighter either. People pay Red Frog because they don't want to have to spend the time to haul it.


Absolutely this...

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#91 - 2016-06-16 08:47:07 UTC
you could always come fight your war targets if you think you gonna lose content Cool

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#92 - 2016-06-16 09:07:50 UTC
Galaxy Pig wrote:
I realize that CCP aims to nerf highsec freighter ganking, but do they intend to end it all-together?

When the nerf to Awoxing was on the horizon, a desperate plea was made by the players and CCP had the good judgement to implement the toggle-switch, thus saving awoxing from total death.

Now, a nerf to freighter suicide ganking comes in the form of a 3-minute warp timer, and we need to try and reason with CCP to allow us more than just 3 measly minutes.

Just making it 5 minutes would make a world of difference.

I implore you, noble Devs, reconsider the practicality of recently proposed mechanics changes to bumping/warping.

Thank you.


So in affect you cannot afford more than two accounts to do your ransom business so you cry about it. Get some more friends or get another account. I am fine with the timer being re-set, at the end of the day I think that balance is about right, but you want 5 minutes so you can just keep them there no change and no extra cost for you. Pathetic...

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#93 - 2016-06-16 09:27:20 UTC
code are crying a lot these days Lol

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#94 - 2016-06-16 10:00:29 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
code are crying a lot these days Lol


They certainly are, they want to emulate their founder Big smile

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#95 - 2016-06-16 11:42:43 UTC
Crinnfika wrote:
Ima Wreckyou wrote:
Why would you even use Red Frog if Freighters where completely save in Highsec? You just load your Freighter and some (thanks to skill injectors free2play) NPC corp alt ships the stuff AFK-AP to the location. There is no opportunity cost anymore if you can get free freighter alts and zero attention is needed.

The Red Frog business model in Higshec is only alive because there is a healthy amount of ganking. It creates an environment where you may lose your stuff and paying someone to ship your stuff for a fee with a collateral is a great way to mitigate that risk. If that risk goes away, so will Red Frogs customers.

It is really quite simple. The more risk there is the more money there will be for enterprises who specialize in shipping your goods and who know how to mitigate their own risk.

Freight contracts have never been about risk or safety. Freight contracts exist for the same reason FedEx exists in the real world: Paying someone else to haul my stuff is infinitely more convenient than hauling the stuff myself.

Every person in the game has the power to haul their own goods and no you don't need a freighter either. People pay Red Frog because they don't want to have to spend the time to haul it.

I am sure that convenience is a strong driver for people to use Freighter contracts, but it isn't the only one. And in a time where you can have hauling alts on free accounts (sell accumulated SP) this reason isn't as strong as it was. If there was no risk at all and you could just AFK-AP your stuff it would be almost equally convenient to haul stuff yourself as it is to use a Freighter service, no attention is needed anymore, also it would be a lot cheaper. So even this is connected to risk.

I have heard a lot of people mentioning risk as the deciding factor of why they use Freighter services. Freighter contracts can work similar to an insurance and that is how they are often used.

Evil RatKid
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite
Safety.
#96 - 2016-06-16 11:47:04 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
code are crying a lot these days Lol

Wow Lan. Did not think you get so upset about a wardec. You also probably know that I am a -10 char, so I don't care abut wars very much :-)

Evil RatKid
Dom Arkaral
Bannheim
Cuttlefish Collective
#97 - 2016-06-16 11:51:00 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
code are crying a lot these days Lol


They certainly are, they want to emulate their founder Big smile

Show me on the barge where His Holiness James 315 touched you Blink

Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester.

Broadcast 4 Reps -- YOU ARE NOT ALONE, EVER

Instigator of the First ISD Thunderdome

CCL Loyalist
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#98 - 2016-06-16 11:54:22 UTC
Ima Wreckyou wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
code are crying a lot these days Lol

Wow Lan. Did not think you get so upset about a wardec. You also probably know that I am a -10 char, so I don't care abut wars very much :-)


why would i be upset? ill be upset if you dont bring the fight :) nevermind poppet we are all pirates you dont need to worry about being -10 in lowsec Cool

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*
Dom Arkaral
Bannheim
Cuttlefish Collective
#99 - 2016-06-16 12:24:02 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
Ima Wreckyou wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
code are crying a lot these days Lol

Wow Lan. Did not think you get so upset about a wardec. You also probably know that I am a -10 char, so I don't care abut wars very much :-)


why would i be upset? ill be upset if you dont bring the fight :) nevermind poppet we are all pirates you dont need to worry about being -10 in lowsec Cool

every carebear ever wrote:
bla bla bla but CODE. doesn't go to lowsec bla bla bla

I remember when loyal would camp pyne with a handful of others to catch randoms
I still try to imagine their reactions lol

Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester.

Broadcast 4 Reps -- YOU ARE NOT ALONE, EVER

Instigator of the First ISD Thunderdome

CCL Loyalist
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#100 - 2016-06-16 12:31:52 UTC
well loyal's killboard does show flying around lowsec

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*