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Gate grids

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Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2016-05-30 23:55:56 UTC
So one of my corpmates just got killed by a fortizar anchored on a gate with a stop bubble.

Please fix the damn grids already.

Art of Explosions
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#2 - 2016-05-31 01:36:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Don't warp to an un-scouted gate.

Use perch bookmarks.


EDIT: It is probably safer to warp at range to the citadel in a cloaky from a celestial not inline with the gate, than warp direct to the gate with the bubble, in order to create bookmarks, as the citadel is a great distance from the gate. You can even repeatedly activate & de-activate a MWD before warping to burn capacitor to limit the warp distance.
ISD Gallifreyan
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#3 - 2016-05-31 02:25:15 UTC
If you have specific examples of Bugs please file a Bug Report.
Ranting on the forums is not the way to get your resolution.
If there is further discussion you would like to have on this topic I will leave it open.

ISD Gallifreyan

Lt. Commander

Community Communication Liaisons (CCL)

Interstellar Services Department
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2016-05-31 03:03:59 UTC
The fact that you can have just one person piloting the fortizar and then pressing one button to kill anything bc sized and below does not seem remotely broken to you?

Art of Explosions
Solonius Rex
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2016-05-31 03:23:20 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
The fact that you can have just one person piloting the fortizar and then pressing one button to kill anything bc sized and below does not seem remotely broken to you?


Yeah, a warship firing a tomahawk can kill an entire village of people a hundred miles away. What a broken system. We should complain to the US navy that they are using a broken system.
Hipqo
Tyde8
#6 - 2016-05-31 03:50:20 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
The fact that you can have just one person piloting the fortizar and then pressing one button to kill anything bc sized and below does not seem remotely broken to you?


He is sitting in a several billion structure, you are flying a couple hundred mill ship.
Seems fair enough to me and nobody is forcing you to use that gate.
You are complaining about something big and powerfull, being well.... big and powerfull....

A life is best lived, to not step into your grave in a well preserved body. Instead, to slide in side ways, all battered and bruised, screamming, "Holy SH**! What a ride!"
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#7 - 2016-05-31 04:07:58 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
The fact that you can have just one person piloting the fortizar and then pressing one button to kill anything bc sized and below does not seem remotely broken to you?

No, not even if I was the unfortunate ship in that scenario.

I do not try to impose my rules or ideals, like what I consider to be fair, upon the EvE universe, nor upon others.

I do try to adapt, and find it much more enjoyable and productive than ranting to make changes in only my favour, especially when there are counters or alternatives currently available.

For what it is worth, I can cite two (minor) game games that I believe I was responsible for (one was later reversed, oh well), and in all cases I try to present a convincing argument, weighing both the pros and cons (when I can think of any cons), present it in the correct channels, and accept criticisms graciously (maybe even use some of those ideas, as I can't be expected to have thought of everything myself). If you are serious about your idea(s) being accepted by CCP, I recommend you consider taking a similar tack.
Valkin Mordirc
#8 - 2016-05-31 04:50:55 UTC
Hipqo wrote:


He is sitting in a several billion structure, you are flying a couple hundred mill ship.
Seems fair enough to me and nobody is forcing you to use that gate.
You are complaining about something big and powerfull, being well.... big and powerfull....



Quote:
Yeah, a warship firing a tomahawk can kill an entire village of people a hundred miles away. What a broken system. We should complain to the US navy that they are using a broken system.



Real Life Application nor Price should be used as a reason for gameplay balance.
#DeleteTheWeak
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#9 - 2016-05-31 04:55:10 UTC
As far as I am concerned this is fine, it is called exerting control of your space...

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
TigerXtrm
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#10 - 2016-05-31 08:30:16 UTC
Valkin Mordirc wrote:
Hipqo wrote:


He is sitting in a several billion structure, you are flying a couple hundred mill ship.
Seems fair enough to me and nobody is forcing you to use that gate.
You are complaining about something big and powerfull, being well.... big and powerfull....



Quote:
Yeah, a warship firing a tomahawk can kill an entire village of people a hundred miles away. What a broken system. We should complain to the US navy that they are using a broken system.



Real Life Application nor Price should be used as a reason for gameplay balance.


This.

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Elenahina
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2016-05-31 10:14:30 UTC
Your corpmate flew directly to an unscouted gate. How would the result have been any different if there had been a dozen ships there waiting instead?

I get that he's salty about being blown up, but put the blame where it belongs - on the person too lazy to make sure their out gate is actually clear.

Eve is like an addiction; you can't quit it until it quits you. Also, iderno
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2016-05-31 10:39:53 UTC
I have never complained about bubbled gates and traps set in them.

At least those require some input from one ore multiple people and you have a chance to break tackle and get away.

There is some counterplay to it, this? 1 button pop, done.

Art of Explosions
Elenahina
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2016-05-31 11:29:25 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
I have never complained about bubbled gates and traps set in them.

At least those require some input from one ore multiple people and you have a chance to break tackle and get away.

There is some counterplay to it, this? 1 button pop, done.


The counter is don't warp to an unscouted gate. Especially where bubbles are allowed. That's like one of the first lessons every nullsec player learns (sometimes painfully amid fire and death).

Eve is like an addiction; you can't quit it until it quits you. Also, iderno
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#14 - 2016-05-31 11:34:34 UTC
Elenahina wrote:

The counter is don't warp to an unscouted gate. Especially where bubbles are allowed. That's like one of the first lessons every nullsec player learns (sometimes painfully amid fire and death).

Except you have to warp to a gate to scout it.
Citadels specifically aren't allowed to anchor near gates in order to stop invulnerable fortresses being used to gate camp. The problem is that now grids are thousands of KM wide, the way CCP has allowed drag bubbles to work allows people to break that restriction by pulling you miles away from the gate directly into the citadels arms. When the grid was only 200-300km without major grid fu, you couldn't be pulled that far away from your intended destination so anchoring limits worked.

Now they don't work.
Elenahina
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2016-05-31 12:46:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Elenahina
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Elenahina wrote:

The counter is don't warp to an unscouted gate. Especially where bubbles are allowed. That's like one of the first lessons every nullsec player learns (sometimes painfully amid fire and death).

Except you have to warp to a gate to scout it.


Actually, you don't. There are several ways to determine what's near a gate without even being on grid with it (barring cloaking, of course). And even if you do have to be on grid, on grid doesn't mean in line with the stop or drag bubble and in range of that massive castle's defenses.

I mean, assuming I can still do math, the maximum range of a citadel's launchers is around 1,000 km A grid is...8,000 km across? Seems like you have plenty of room to maneuver without getting shot.

Eve is like an addiction; you can't quit it until it quits you. Also, iderno
Esrevid Nekkeg
Justified and Ancient
#16 - 2016-05-31 12:52:51 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
... so anchoring limits worked.

Now they don't work.
True. That might be or become a problem.

But scouting a gate, even if bubbled in such a way as to bring you in range of a Citadels defences, is still quite easy.

**insert lengthy expose on scouting techniques, Cov-opps ships, Cloaking devices, Bookmarks, etcetera...**
Well, you know how it works.

Here I used to have a sig of our old Camper in space. Now it is disregarded as being the wrong format. Looking out the window I see one thing: Nothing wrong with the format of our Camper! Silly CCP......
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2016-05-31 15:17:05 UTC
You're all missing out the fact (conveniently) that many gates in null sec are out of scan range of any celestials, so unless you've been at that gate before and made a bookmark, it's impossible to scan unless you have combat probes.

Again, the above is not my problem, mystery gates are a common occurrence and are a staple of null and the risks involved, however there has always been counterplay to these camps, an invincible structure that can oneshot you without even needing to target you has no counterplay.

Art of Explosions
Dungheap
DHCOx
#18 - 2016-05-31 18:37:32 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
You're all missing out the fact (conveniently) that many gates in null sec are out of scan range of any celestials, so unless you've been at that gate before and made a bookmark, it's impossible to scan unless you have combat probes.

Again, the above is not my problem, mystery gates are a common occurrence and are a staple of null and the risks involved, however there has always been counterplay to these camps, an invincible structure that can oneshot you without even needing to target you has no counterplay.


there is no "counterplay" to warping directly to an unscouted gate .. you shouldn't have tried to justify that , ever ..

you should have focused on 'should citadels be allowed on gate grids ?"

those interested can see an example of what the op is talking about by searching for stargate F-NMX6 on zkillboard .

i'm sure there's going to be a ruling soon , as the petitions pile up .. until then , be thankful for the content . Lol
Nalia White
Tencus
#19 - 2016-05-31 19:04:11 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
You're all missing out the fact (conveniently) that many gates in null sec are out of scan range of any celestials, so unless you've been at that gate before and made a bookmark, it's impossible to scan unless you have combat probes.

Again, the above is not my problem, mystery gates are a common occurrence and are a staple of null and the risks involved, however there has always been counterplay to these camps, an invincible structure that can oneshot you without even needing to target you has no counterplay.


you can still warp to a celestial not in line with gate to gate and then warp to the gate from there and won't land in the drag bubble... jesus christ.

Syndicate - K5-JRD

Home to few, graveyard for many

My biggest achievement
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2016-05-31 19:15:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Tsukino Stareine
Dungheap wrote:
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
You're all missing out the fact (conveniently) that many gates in null sec are out of scan range of any celestials, so unless you've been at that gate before and made a bookmark, it's impossible to scan unless you have combat probes.

Again, the above is not my problem, mystery gates are a common occurrence and are a staple of null and the risks involved, however there has always been counterplay to these camps, an invincible structure that can oneshot you without even needing to target you has no counterplay.


there is no "counterplay" to warping directly to an unscouted gate .. you shouldn't have tried to justify that , ever ..

you should have focused on 'should citadels be allowed on gate grids ?"

those interested can see an example of what the op is talking about by searching for stargate F-NMX6 on zkillboard .

i'm sure there's going to be a ruling soon , as the petitions pile up .. until then , be thankful for the content . Lol






Of course there is counterplay, if what's camping it is not strong enough to hold you, then you can get out.

Nalia White wrote:
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
You're all missing out the fact (conveniently) that many gates in null sec are out of scan range of any celestials, so unless you've been at that gate before and made a bookmark, it's impossible to scan unless you have combat probes.

Again, the above is not my problem, mystery gates are a common occurrence and are a staple of null and the risks involved, however there has always been counterplay to these camps, an invincible structure that can oneshot you without even needing to target you has no counterplay.


you can still warp to a celestial not in line with gate to gate and then warp to the gate from there and won't land in the drag bubble... jesus christ.


You do know that gates exist that are not near any celestial? Probably don't understand the concept as all you fly are interceptors

Art of Explosions
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