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Wrong Insurance payout?
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Lukas Wiinholt
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2016-05-29 11:38:42 UTC
Hey!

So i finally bought a PLEX to be able to purchase more expensive ships. I went and bought a Stratios.
The estimated value of the Stratios is 214 million on the market. I went and bought one for 245(I didnt care about it, i felt rich enough to buy at a little overprice)

Now, before taking this beauty on a test run, i wanted to insure it. I didnt want my 214 million to go to waste because i might get ganked by some random ppl. So going into the insurance page, it looked like this:


Picture of Insurance

Does that really make sense? Buys a ship estimated at 214 million but can only insure for 11 million? Did i get ripped off?
Matt Benneth
Strictly Moral Support
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
#2 - 2016-05-29 11:47:44 UTC
Insurance is calculated not from the market price of the ship but from price of materials from which is built. In case of a Stratios its build price is the same as for all faction cruisers = build price of T1 cruiser.
Lukas Wiinholt
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2016-05-29 11:49:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Lukas Wiinholt
Matt Benneth wrote:
Insurance is calculated not from the market price of the ship but from price of materials from which is built. In case of a Stratios its build price is the same as for all faction cruisers = build price of T1 cruiser.


But that is stupid? It should calculate in the price of the rareity?
The insurance should cover what the Stratios is worth. And to build it again i need alot more than just the materials..
Master OrionStarhunter
#4 - 2016-05-29 11:49:45 UTC
I completely agree with this. It used to be that no matter the cost of the ship, platinum insurance covered the base cost of your ship (minus modules). This is not the case now, and should be corrected. What's the point of buying 11 mil ISK insurance on a ship that goes for 240+ mil on the regional market....

Am I the only one besides Lukas who doesn't see the logic in this???
Master OrionStarhunter
#5 - 2016-05-29 11:54:45 UTC
Matt Benneth wrote:
Insurance is calculated not from the market price of the ship but from price of materials from which is built. In case of a Stratios its build price is the same as for all faction cruisers = build price of T1 cruiser.


No that's not correct, it is the cost of a T1 + The BPC which is far more expensive than the SOE SHip itself... CCP needs to fix this.
Back when this was Tyrannis, to Odyssey, your ships were insured in Plat. Insurance up to the total value of the ship, per market value. You don't buy a car and the insurance only covers the materials for your vehicle.. they cover the whole car....

Again, this makes no logical sense... cover the cost of the more expensive ships for crying out loud.
Brokk Witgenstein
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2016-05-29 15:25:43 UTC
Actually they don't even cover the car. They just collect the money.

As for EvE, it's an incentive to fly T1.
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#7 - 2016-05-29 17:45:03 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
Master OrionStarhunter wrote:
I completely agree with this. It used to be that no matter the cost of the ship, platinum insurance covered the base cost of your ship (minus modules). This is not the case now, and should be corrected.

Sorry... but this has been the case since I started playing back in 2009.

For Faction (Navy and Pirate), Tech 2, and Tech 3 ships... insurance has always been poor for them because it only factors in the value of the minerals used to make a ship.
All other considerations (moon goo, rarity, LP cost) are not, and have never been, factored in.

Master OrionStarhunter wrote:
Back when this was Tyrannis, to Odyssey, your ships were insured in Plat. Insurance up to the total value of the ship,

This was a bug. It was fixed.

Master OrionStarhunter wrote:
What's the point of buying 11 mil ISK insurance on a ship that goes for 240+ mil on the regional market....

Am I the only one besides Lukas who doesn't see the logic in this???

It is a balancing thing.

When you buy expensive ships and equipment that are "better" than the regular Tech 1 variants, you are effectively "not poor" and "not a newbie"... the people the insurance system is supposed to assist.
The thinking is, if you can buy an expensive ship, you SHOULD be able to afford the loss of that ship.

Another thing to consider; if you could take out insurance on an expensive ship and get more or less the full hull value back when it dies... why would you ever fly anything less expensive ever again?
"Flying expensive" is a penalty in of itself.

How did you Veterans start?
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#8 - 2016-05-29 20:19:44 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
Another thing to consider; if you could take out insurance on an expensive ship and get more or less the full hull value back when it dies... why would you ever fly anything less expensive ever again?


This is the crux of the issue as far as I'm concerned. If everything were fully insurable then prices would be nothing but an initial barrier to entry; once you purchased a ship you would effectively have that ship forever. Loss would no longer be meaningful in any way.
Sheeth Athonille
TerraTroopers
Get Off My Lawn
#9 - 2016-05-30 09:24:13 UTC
Add on top of that the issue of insurance being an isk faucet and the reasons why expensive ships aren't fully insured starts to make a lot of sense.
Anthar Thebess
#10 - 2016-05-30 10:04:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Anthar Thebess
This is correct, faction ships, T2 and T3 ships don't cover full payout.
Insurance is already injecting a lot of ISK into the system, don't make it worst.

Fly in ships you can afford to replace.

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Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#11 - 2016-05-30 10:15:28 UTC
Sheeth Athonille wrote:
Add on top of that the issue of insurance being an isk faucet and the reasons why expensive ships aren't fully insured starts to make a lot of sense.


I'd normally have thrown this in as well, but I suspect that at least for the moment there's an awful lot of ISK leaving the economy between new skills, new blueprints, and increased broker's fees. The overall point is still valid of course, it just doesn't have the same import right now.

There's an interesting argument to be had here about insurance payouts of capital ships as well. Right now they're awfully high....
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#12 - 2016-05-30 11:05:29 UTC
Zhilia Mann wrote:
Sheeth Athonille wrote:
Add on top of that the issue of insurance being an isk faucet and the reasons why expensive ships aren't fully insured starts to make a lot of sense.


I'd normally have thrown this in as well, but I suspect that at least for the moment there's an awful lot of ISK leaving the economy between new skills, new blueprints, and increased broker's fees. The overall point is still valid of course, it just doesn't have the same import right now.

There's an interesting argument to be had here about insurance payouts of capital ships as well. Right now they're awfully high....


You forgot clone jumping, failed attempts at clone jumping, don't clone jump ever again.

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elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#13 - 2016-05-30 11:07:53 UTC
Lukas Wiinholt wrote:
..But that is stupid? It should calculate in the price of the rareity?
The insurance should cover what the Stratios is worth. And to build it again i need alot more than just the materials..


I am sorry to tell you this but the Stratios is a rare as veldspar. According the Sisters of EVE LP store, they have an infinite stock.

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

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Anke Eyrou
Hades Sisters
#14 - 2016-05-30 21:32:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Anke Eyrou
You think 11mil is a bad payout. Try losing an uninsured Gnosis. I got 2.40 isk as compensaion (LOL).

I expect to get this post deleted or locked. So much for freedom of expression.

Nalia White
Tencus
#15 - 2016-05-30 21:58:09 UTC
Anke Eyrou wrote:
You think 11mil is a bad payout. Try losing an uninsured Gnosis. I got 2.40 isk as compensaion (LOL).


haha, really? but they do cost minerals like a normal bc to build right?

Syndicate - K5-JRD

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My biggest achievement
C-137
C3 Corporation
#16 - 2016-05-30 22:02:01 UTC
Insurance cost is based on the mineral build cost of the ship, not the current market value. T2 and Faction ship mineral cost is only a small portion of the ship cost, mainly since you have to spend ~40,000,000 isk for the blueprint for 1 Astero.

The reason this came to be is because you used to be able to build a T1 battle ship, insure it, and then self-destruct it, and make more money than if you sold the Minerals or the Ship.

T2 and Faction ships are part of the Pimp`yo`ride program, and are meant to be an isk drain.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#17 - 2016-05-30 22:51:58 UTC
Master OrionStarhunter wrote:
I completely agree with this. It used to be that no matter the cost of the ship, platinum insurance covered the base cost of your ship (minus modules).


This was never the case.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
#18 - 2016-05-31 00:32:50 UTC
I think there are a couple of folks in this thread that don't actually pay insurance in RL. If the way Eve insurance works bothers you in the slightest - I strongly recommend you never grow up in RL. You're so going to hate it.
Anke Eyrou
Hades Sisters
#19 - 2016-05-31 07:13:20 UTC
Nalia White wrote:
Anke Eyrou wrote:
You think 11mil is a bad payout. Try losing an uninsured Gnosis. I got 2.40 isk as compensaion (LOL).


haha, really? but they do cost minerals like a normal bc to build right?


Yes they do cost mats to build but if you don't believe me try losing one.

I expect to get this post deleted or locked. So much for freedom of expression.

elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#20 - 2016-05-31 11:48:44 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Master OrionStarhunter wrote:
I completely agree with this. It used to be that no matter the cost of the ship, platinum insurance covered the base cost of your ship (minus modules).


This was never the case.


Yes it was. There was a time before you joined, you know. Everything had a base price since the 10 citizens of New Eden couldn't manage to mine all the minerals in the few Ospreys around.

The Ospreys base price was 2.2m in any of the Caldari empire stations. A Raven used to cost 108m isk. The platinum level insurance was 39m. The insurance payout in case of an involuntary disassembly was 108m.

Then came 9258248592758256729569561794 Chinese teenagers and mined all veldspar and devalued all isk. Producers of now researched bpo owners could sell them at 89.5m isk.

For unknown reasons everyone flew battleships all the time..


Fast forward and miners was upset. CCP made miners more isk and 2.5 fold increase the build cost for all ships. Thank you miners.

Then CCP thought it was a good idea to give 9353076280452 bazillions to everyone in highsec (but me) and assumes everyone has so much that they all fly motherships and titans all day.

Then came new player and cried he couldn't fly titan before the end of the tutorial, CCP gave them a lobotomy so they can have all zee skillpoints at once and don't have to bother with boring stuff like training skills first.

2017, nobody remembers EVE anymore but rumor has it, that it used to be a game about spaceships until something went wrong.

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

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