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My revised take on Wardecs.

Author
Kaelhula Waki
Galaxy Comittee of Ship Destruction
#121 - 2016-05-16 09:26:28 UTC
I didn't chose the name, a buddy did, he found it funny. And yes my 5.0 security status probably means it.

I don't mind losing a ship to PvP, i can deal with it, having played to more hardcore games. But even PvP is boring when people who want to fight you tree-hugs stations and still disrupt your favorite gameplay. The Risk/reward/fun isn't there anymore.
Morgan Agrivar
Doomheim
#122 - 2016-05-16 10:23:19 UTC
I thoroughly enjoyed solo highsec wardeccing. Then CCP killed it.

Now, I drudge through highsec with naught a purpose but milking out isk however possible.

Woe is me...nah, I still find fun things to do.

Like murdering MTUs! *\o/*
Rawmeat Mary
Empire Assault Corp
Dead Terrorists
#123 - 2016-05-16 12:00:58 UTC
Kaelhula Waki wrote:
I don't mind losing a ship to PvP, i can deal with it, having played to more hardcore games. But even PvP is boring when people who want to fight you tree-hugs stations and still disrupt your favorite gameplay.

How can they disrupt your favorite gameplay if they don't leave the undock ring?

'If they take the ship, they'll rape us to death, eat our flesh, and sew our skins onto their clothing. And if we're very, very lucky, they'll do it in that order.'

Yeah, we're like that.

Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#124 - 2016-05-16 12:08:14 UTC
Rawmeat Mary wrote:
Kaelhula Waki wrote:
I don't mind losing a ship to PvP, i can deal with it, having played to more hardcore games. But even PvP is boring when people who want to fight you tree-hugs stations and still disrupt your favorite gameplay.

How can they disrupt your favorite gameplay if they don't leave the undock ring?

"A big meany faced bully is standing on the street corner near my shops ... guess ill just starve to death then"
Kaelhula Waki
Galaxy Comittee of Ship Destruction
#125 - 2016-05-16 12:15:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Kaelhula Waki
Have your read my post ? Dunno.

But he was just sitting there waiting for me/us to undock a plexboat, or undock a hauling boat or i don't know. Not that i care. I fitted a pvp ship, attacked him and he just docked, then undocked...So boring...

So yes i couldn't do what i liked to do. I couln't even attack him/them so i realized this was a dumb and boring, unrewarding game experience.
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#126 - 2016-05-16 14:31:11 UTC
Unless your desired gameplay consists entirely of sitting on a station undock in an industrial ship I'm personally not seeing how your gameplay was impeded by that.
Rawmeat Mary
Empire Assault Corp
Dead Terrorists
#127 - 2016-05-16 14:43:19 UTC
Station games is cancer.

Don't.

'If they take the ship, they'll rape us to death, eat our flesh, and sew our skins onto their clothing. And if we're very, very lucky, they'll do it in that order.'

Yeah, we're like that.

Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#128 - 2016-05-16 15:11:43 UTC
Or do it properly and have bait for them to engage so you actually get to kill them. You'd think highsec PVP was rocket science going from how much trouble some people seem to have with it.
Kaelhula Waki
Galaxy Comittee of Ship Destruction
#129 - 2016-05-16 15:17:59 UTC
Quote:
Unless your desired gameplay consists entirely of sitting on a station undock in an industrial ship I'm personally not seeing how your gameplay was impeded by that.


Sure, i will undock a 2b marauder when i'm wardec to do L4, an Orca to haul to Jita things i produced or bring back components when my friends can't help me because they're noobs and when i travel a bit in a fast frig i see a T3 following me and 2 others hostiles in local and 3 others 2 systems from there.

And when I choose to fight they flee. In the end it's just borrriinnggg.

If you don't see why, I still see and for me that's what matters.

I can still do some low sec exploration at least.

Quote:
Station games is cancer.

Don't.


I don't know what you mean, i just discovered recently that you could dock even warp disrupt.
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#130 - 2016-05-16 15:25:26 UTC
But you said all the guy did ia sit on a station. If that's actually all he does then he has no ability to kill your marauder or orca unless it's on that same station undock.
Kaelhula Waki
Galaxy Comittee of Ship Destruction
#131 - 2016-05-16 15:58:37 UTC
You have misunderstood me, probably because of my poor english. If so i appologize. I will try to make it clear.

He was undocked, outside of the npc station with a cruiser. I picked my frig and warp disrupt him, he docked, replenished his shield, then undocked.

What i was supposed to do alone ? Pvp isn't fair and should not be but I can't agree with you when you say my gameplay isn't impacted.

The T3 I mentionned was something i saw just a couple of min before when I roamed in a frig just to check their presence.

I know the answer: disband corp, make a new one after some time but i will not do it if that **** can happen a third time. We lost 0 ships but it's just boring as hell.

When I explained to my buddies that there was nothing we could do on our own this was rather depressing.

When I go in low sec and go through camps, it's thrilling and I like that.

But from what i have experienced (i admit it may not always be the case) it is just people buying kill rights and cherry picking noobs gathering themselves to have fun together and/or soft targets that have no rewards vs risk offered and need a coorp just to work. (Pos for invent/prod for me)

Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#132 - 2016-05-16 17:04:50 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
Morgan Agrivar wrote:
Well, I don't know...maybe...fight back?


Instead of a single line buzz word type sentence go ahead and explain how you would fight back against say Vendetta.

Tell me how many pilots and what ships you will fly, how will you catch them, what you will use against their fleet doctrine etc., I am all ears, go for it tiger put me in my place with your tactical brilliance. And don't tell me you have friends because that is lame and so stupid.

If you look at Vendetta's kill board you will find that a certain hisec courier contarct scam ganker ripped them a new one, then engage you brain and think just how many people in hisec are at that position..., then perhaps you sort of get it, but one liners are easy aren't t they, doing is another matter...



There were more bling boats in that engagement than an incursion Shocked

Seriously, highsec PVP has some serious bling boatery going on. The scammer group used a fleet of Sleipnirs. WTF?

It adds to my conclusion that the super uber leet above all and so superior that even out of game they are a master race highsec PVPer is in highsec for the exact same reason the horrible loser tard risk-averse carebears who are not even worth the air they breath are in highsec.

I'm glad at least to see AG begin to exploit no aggro/no consequence loopholes. Gankers will be joining the chorus they so hate, but they won't notice.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!

tiberiusric
Comply Or Die
Pandemic Horde
#133 - 2016-05-16 17:17:56 UTC
TheDamned wrote:
So,
after a long winded rant about how destructive wardecs are in EVE and many of you telling me how wrong I was, I set out to launch a solo corp to wardec a number of corps for kills and learn the other side of the equation.

Result?

A. Since the buddy list changes, finding war targets is virtually impossible. Even with 5 or more large corps decced, I would rarely see a target anywhere with the exception of an occasional miner.

B. I still think there should be a limit on the number of wardecs, however, I understand that due to the buddy list change, if you ever want to score a kill, you have to go big or dont bother. Its just a waste of 50 to 200m ISK for the dec.

C. I'm too nice for solo wardeccing. I couldn't help but feel guilty about what I was doing. Maybe I'm just too carebear. I wouldn't have felt so bad had I been targeting pirate corps, but those guys travel in packs everywhere, gatecamps etc and I wouldn't stand a chance solo.

D. Overall, Wardecs are fine. Having been on the other side of them now I understand they just mean, "be careful, but don't turtle up and stop playing for a week". There are plenty of precautions you can take in defense of a wardec and its likely you will lose a ship or two but the value of those ships depend on how eager you are to lose money. If you want to continue mining, great, do so in a 26m miner instead of a 230m barge. Slows you down but its better than mining for an hour to lose the ore and a 230m ship while fueling a continued wardec.

I have learned a lot by my experience in solo wardeccing and though I dont feel its for me, I realize its not the personal, fear inducing attack on ones corp I used to.

To everyone who gave me advice before and told me a lot of this already, I apologize for my ignorance. I have to learn things for myself and am in fact always learning.

Fly safe.



sorry but im struggling to understand how the buddy list made any difference. it doesnt tell you where they are. i mean ok might help if u knew they always lived in a system. we managed quite well with war decs before the ability of knowing if someone was online

war decs are so not fine

All my views are my own - never be afraid to post with your main, unless you're going to post some dumb shit

Geronimo McVain
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#134 - 2016-05-16 18:41:23 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
But you said all the guy did ia sit on a station. If that's actually all he does then he has no ability to kill your marauder or orca unless it's on that same station undock.

He's playing it smart. Either you undock something he can kill: then he will. If he can't kill it he will dock. He's save all the time. And you are toasted.

It's like a POS with a 24/7 timer. The enemy can choose when he wants to fight. If you have a fleet to defend he doesn't fight. He can wait cause after some time the fleet will go away. Or you will sit there like idiots 24/7 while he is doing whatever he wants because he can choose everything. Wardeccs need an active component that the attacker has to defend so that the decced get a chance to fight back.
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#135 - 2016-05-16 19:16:17 UTC
Geronimo McVain wrote:
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
But you said all the guy did ia sit on a station. If that's actually all he does then he has no ability to kill your marauder or orca unless it's on that same station undock.

He's playing it smart. Either you undock something he can kill: then he will. If he can't kill it he will dock. He's save all the time. And you are toasted.

It's like a POS with a 24/7 timer. The enemy can choose when he wants to fight. If you have a fleet to defend he doesn't fight. He can wait cause after some time the fleet will go away. Or you will sit there like idiots 24/7 while he is doing whatever he wants because he can choose everything. Wardeccs need an active component that the attacker has to defend so that the decced get a chance to fight back.

bait works, iv seen it , been it , bitten it , bait them , isolate one and murder him.

then bait them again ,
eventually they will stop taking the bait ,
keep baiting them and they will assume everything you fly is bait.
Valkin Mordirc
#136 - 2016-05-16 19:33:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Valkin Mordirc
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Geronimo McVain wrote:
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
But you said all the guy did ia sit on a station. If that's actually all he does then he has no ability to kill your marauder or orca unless it's on that same station undock.

He's playing it smart. Either you undock something he can kill: then he will. If he can't kill it he will dock. He's save all the time. And you are toasted.

It's like a POS with a 24/7 timer. The enemy can choose when he wants to fight. If you have a fleet to defend he doesn't fight. He can wait cause after some time the fleet will go away. Or you will sit there like idiots 24/7 while he is doing whatever he wants because he can choose everything. Wardeccs need an active component that the attacker has to defend so that the decced get a chance to fight back.

bait works, iv seen it , been it , bitten it , bait them , isolate one and murder him.

then bait them again ,
eventually they will stop taking the bait ,
keep baiting them and they will assume everything you fly is bait.




Nothing is as emotionally scaring as seeing a lone ship undock, you in your Loki decided to shoot it, and the outcome being 20 Battleships coming out of the Amarr undock like liquid.


Edit: Will work multiple times. lol
#DeleteTheWeak
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#137 - 2016-05-16 19:58:01 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Geronimo McVain wrote:
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
But you said all the guy did ia sit on a station. If that's actually all he does then he has no ability to kill your marauder or orca unless it's on that same station undock.

He's playing it smart. Either you undock something he can kill: then he will. If he can't kill it he will dock. He's save all the time. And you are toasted.

It's like a POS with a 24/7 timer. The enemy can choose when he wants to fight. If you have a fleet to defend he doesn't fight. He can wait cause after some time the fleet will go away. Or you will sit there like idiots 24/7 while he is doing whatever he wants because he can choose everything. Wardeccs need an active component that the attacker has to defend so that the decced get a chance to fight back.

bait works, iv seen it , been it , bitten it , bait them , isolate one and murder him.

then bait them again ,
eventually they will stop taking the bait ,
keep baiting them and they will assume everything you fly is bait.




Shroedinger is that you? How's your cat? Cool

Bring back DEEEEP Space!

Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#138 - 2016-05-16 20:01:47 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Geronimo McVain wrote:
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
But you said all the guy did ia sit on a station. If that's actually all he does then he has no ability to kill your marauder or orca unless it's on that same station undock.

He's playing it smart. Either you undock something he can kill: then he will. If he can't kill it he will dock. He's save all the time. And you are toasted.

It's like a POS with a 24/7 timer. The enemy can choose when he wants to fight. If you have a fleet to defend he doesn't fight. He can wait cause after some time the fleet will go away. Or you will sit there like idiots 24/7 while he is doing whatever he wants because he can choose everything. Wardeccs need an active component that the attacker has to defend so that the decced get a chance to fight back.

bait works, iv seen it , been it , bitten it , bait them , isolate one and murder him.

then bait them again ,
eventually they will stop taking the bait ,
keep baiting them and they will assume everything you fly is bait.




Shroedinger is that you? How's your cat? Cool

Schrödinger's Cyno mightn't work in highsec but the psychology behind it definitely does Big smile
Kaelhula Waki
Galaxy Comittee of Ship Destruction
#139 - 2016-05-16 20:11:30 UTC
Bait can only work when you have good backup I assume. I don't have that.

We're in a noob corp with people with jobs and not much time to play, hence the high sec.

My buddy fly in freighter or procurer and only know how to fly his plex boat, which he's not very good with btw and won't risk it for a bait ship. Again risk vs reward.

I didn't find something meaningful i could do then. So i decoed and wondered if i would rather unsuscribe or launch a new corp until she gets wardec again cutting again the fun in a boring, slow death with ghosts.

Pandora Carrollon
Provi Rapid Response
#140 - 2016-05-16 20:16:58 UTC
Relatively new player here, maybe graduated to junior assistant pilot trainee or something like that.

I find it rather odd that a post going so positive got railed down a road so negative. You guys are still arguing War Decs to ad nauseum.

If people really want fly a particular way, for the most part, you can. Changes may make it more expensive or more difficult to do, but we all have to adapt. Really, if it's not profitable any more, then you have to ask yourself WHY you like playing that way. It's possible some nerf to one thing completely killed your play style in collateral damage, but the reality is, it was likely considered in some fashion and done ANYWAY. If that's so, your play style might have be intentionally nerf'd for some reason. So consider adjusting the play style to either go more with the winds of change or fight them if you want. However, to keep the sailing metaphor, tacking against the wind is many times more effort for far little gain in distance. So do so knowing it will take vast amounts of effort for little progress.

I suggest a different approach. Try thinking about it in gain/loss terms. If you take out 100 War Decs at 50mil each, that's 5 billion in ISK. That buys a lot of seriously powerful small ships capable of suicide ganking. Now if you're after those Loot Piñata's, you will need to do your homework, War Dec the right corps and know the players habits, etc. Time for real Private Eye work.

If you are looking to make easy money off of HiSec, you are in the wrong section of space. It's low risk-low return and that's what CCP seems to want. They have consistently nerf'd anything with low risk-med/high return in HiSec... and I've only found ONE exception: Trading.

If you start making good ISK off of War Dec's they will nerf it. If it gets you nothing but frustration, then I think CCP is patting themselves on the back about doing a good job.

Look at the entire picture of the game and their moves make sense. They aren't out to get your play style, they are out to enforce their image of HiSec, LoSec and NullSec.