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CONCORD XL Weapons - adjustment needed
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Anthar Thebess
#1 - 2016-05-15 16:34:15 UTC
When you compare CONCORD and T2 weapons you will quickly notice that CONCORD modules offer benefits for people that don't have XL guns skilled to LVL 5, because specialization makes T2 guns better.
Problem is that CONCORD weapon use T2 guns as production materials, making CONCORD quite worthless.

There are 2 simple fixes for this :
- make T2 specialization affect CONCORD weapons ( lack of skills will have 0 effect on the dps)
- make faction weapons fitting requirements, and cap usage much smaller than they are currently


Faction XL weapons should be always better than T2 versions, not because they are faction ones, but because they are now upgraded T2 module.

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Marcus Tedric
Zebra Corp
Goonswarm Federation
#2 - 2016-05-15 18:36:23 UTC
Anthar Thebess wrote:
When you compare CONCORD and T2 weapons you will quickly notice that CONCORD modules offer benefits for people that don't have XL guns skilled to LVL 5, because specialization makes T2 guns better.
Problem is that CONCORD weapon use T2 guns as production materials, making CONCORD quite worthless.

There are 2 simple fixes for this :
- make T2 specialization affect CONCORD weapons ( lack of skills will have 0 effect on the dps)
- make faction weapons fitting requirements, and cap usage much smaller than they are currently


Faction XL weapons should be always better than T2 versions, not because they are faction ones, but because they are now upgraded T2 module.


I'm sorry, I'm not understanding your argument at all.....

CONCORD take a T2 weapon and 'tweak' it so that now it can be used by less skilled pilots. Sounds good to me. Forget ideas of 'upgrade'.

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elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#3 - 2016-05-15 22:14:59 UTC
And of all faction guns you can put t2 ammo into them and pew. The only polarized guns that allow you to tank, sounds good to me.

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Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2016-05-16 06:18:01 UTC
elitatwo wrote:
And of all faction guns you can put t2 ammo into them and pew.

Erm?..

elitatwo wrote:
The only polarized guns that allow you to tank...

Ugh, what?

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Anthar Thebess
#5 - 2016-05-16 07:13:56 UTC
Yes Concord guns are tweaked T2 guns, they allow you to use T2 ammo without having capital guns to LVL5 - but moment you have LVL 5 capital guns, and inject T2 specialization they are worst than T2 guns.

It is not about making them OP, just balancing them in a way that will keep them slightly better than T2 guns all the times.

No industry guy will be harmed in the process Roll as CONCORD weapons require T2 gun as a production material.

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Mr Mac
Dark Goliath
#6 - 2016-05-16 08:38:26 UTC
Seems fine by me. You need V skill to load t2 ammo anyway
Anthar Thebess
#7 - 2016-05-16 09:40:56 UTC
Mr Mac wrote:
Seems fine by me. You need V skill to load t2 ammo anyway

Didn't test it but point of this guns is that you don't need lvl 5 skill to use T2 ammo.
Problem is that the moment you skill it to lvl 5 - there is no point of using them over T2 guns.

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Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#8 - 2016-05-16 10:25:40 UTC
Anthar Thebess wrote:
Didn't test it but point of this guns is that you don't need lvl 5 skill to use T2 ammo.
Problem is that the moment you skill it to lvl 5 - there is no point of using them over T2 guns.

Well, subcap T2 ammo requires T2 skills, if that's the same for capital guns, then it becomes a bit weird...

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Anthar Thebess
#9 - 2016-05-16 10:29:45 UTC
This change is made to XL faction guns - check patch notes.
For me faction XL guns should do as much DPS as T2 versions - especially when they need T2 gun for manufacture.

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Mr Mac
Dark Goliath
#10 - 2016-05-16 11:45:16 UTC
Anthar Thebess wrote:
Mr Mac wrote:
Seems fine by me. You need V skill to load t2 ammo anyway

Didn't test it but point of this guns is that you don't need lvl 5 skill to use T2 ammo.
Problem is that the moment you skill it to lvl 5 - there is no point of using them over T2 guns.


If capital weapon specializaion affects on concord xl weapons? Im sure it does Smile
Amanda Chan
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2016-05-16 12:48:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Amanda Chan
Anthar Thebess wrote:

Didn't test it but point of this guns is that you don't need lvl 5 skill to use T2 ammo.
Problem is that the moment you skill it to lvl 5 - there is no point of using them over T2 guns.


Which applies to every T2 gun vs their faction variant ever? Atleast with Missiles, Faction launchers are better then T2 launchers if you're chucking normal/faction ammo instead of T2 ammo....
Mr Mac
Dark Goliath
#12 - 2016-05-16 14:37:40 UTC
Anthar Thebess wrote:
Mr Mac wrote:
Seems fine by me. You need V skill to load t2 ammo anyway

Didn't test it but point of this guns is that you don't need lvl 5 skill to use T2 ammo.
Problem is that the moment you skill it to lvl 5 - there is no point of using them over T2 guns.



Tested in game you'll need V skill to use T2 ammo
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The Legion of Spoon
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#13 - 2016-06-24 09:17:15 UTC
But still.... since when can we use T2 ammo in any launcher/guns.... why can we do it now in capital weapons???Shocked

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Anthar Thebess
#14 - 2016-06-24 09:21:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Anthar Thebess
Yes T2 XL weapons can use T2 ammo.

Faction guns provide :
- better tracking
- less cap
at cost of slight lower DPS.

Funny thing is that you can buy CONCORD XL weapons cheaper than T2

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Cade Windstalker
#15 - 2016-06-24 15:23:32 UTC
Or, third option, adjust the recipe to use T1 guns and increase other materials to make up the value difference...
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#16 - 2016-06-25 01:54:02 UTC
Cade Windstalker wrote:
Or, third option, adjust the recipe to use T1 guns and increase other materials to make up the value difference...


That would be the better option. The thing is faction guns used to use t1 guns and with the magic of and LP store, you'll get the faction ones.

Polarized guns are faction t2 which is a new concept but the second you fit one, your tank goes nil with a sliver of buffer.

The new-ish CONCORD XL ones are new in the way that they use the much more expensive to make t2 guns to get the faction ones which is also new.
I still find it odd why they made those the way the are now :-/

Except for some very edge cases, polarized guns are not very common by design. Faction guns are also rare since the cost in the LP store do not make them very desirable to use and do not warrant the cost since the t2 ammo make t2 guns better in most cases.

I can see now why Anthar is asking for this.

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Saleya Blackheart
I've no Idea
#17 - 2016-06-29 11:04:23 UTC
Anthar Thebess wrote:
T2 guns provide :
- better tracking


Wrong.
Anthar Thebess
#18 - 2016-06-29 11:11:19 UTC
Saleya Blackheart wrote:
Anthar Thebess wrote:
T2 guns provide :
- better tracking


Wrong.

Yes sorry corrected.
T2 -> Faction guns

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