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[PROPOSAL] Support Avatar Gameplay As a Means of Increasing Immersion

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Author
Aelavaine
Aelavaine's Corporation
#261 - 2016-04-04 12:53:11 UTC
Jack Carrigan wrote:
...But you know, Malcanis is on to something...
Yeah I start to like him :)

With kickstarter there are several problems:

- How much attention and money people will pay for a campaign which never will be realized? Without CCPs support there is no WiS in Eve.
- What stands WiS for and what makes it desirable? Here are many good rough ideas but when it comes to the details, they differ a lot. So what exactly will be advertised?
- Even Mittani with his public reach couldn't get much attention for his book despite the aid of others like Scott M.. How will WiS' kickstarter campaign reach its patrons?

Done good, such a campaign can put a lot of pressure on CCP. Done bad it's a nail more in the coffin.

Anyhow, I'm not sure what to think about the The Scope news in the captains quartierts. Ain't that something you can call a WiS feature?

You want more than spinning ships? Support Avatar Gameplay!

Jack Carrigan
Order of the Shadow
#262 - 2016-04-07 23:02:40 UTC
Honestly if they gave you the option to watch the actual news reports, that would be kind of cool.

Furthermore, why not take some of the work being done on the new FPS and put it toward WiS? I mean, you already have people working on people models, so why not utilize it to their advantage.

I am the One who exists in Shadow. I am the Devil your parents warned you about.

||CEO: Order of the Shadow||Executor: The Revenant Order||Creator: Bowhead||

Flamespar
WarRavens
#263 - 2016-04-08 11:14:37 UTC
Jack Carrigan wrote:
Honestly if they gave you the option to watch the actual news reports, that would be kind of cool.

Furthermore, why not take some of the work being done on the new FPS and put it toward WiS? I mean, you already have people working on people models, so why not utilize it to their advantage.


Unless the new FPS turns out to be a league of legends clone.
Aelavaine
Aelavaine's Corporation
#264 - 2016-04-09 18:01:06 UTC
To all who still think that WiS will never come because CCP said so:

Team Size Matters wrote:
...we make sure there is one single mechanism that brings new skillpoints in to the system – training.
Source: Skill Trading in New Eden

Team Size Matters wrote:
...10,000 skill point reward that a character will receive the first time they kill an NPC ship every 22 hours.
Source: Daily Opportunities coming soon

That shows how much a statement from CCP is worth.

You want more than spinning ships? Support Avatar Gameplay!

Scatim Helicon
State War Academy
Caldari State
#265 - 2016-04-10 11:12:56 UTC
WiS is dead, as are the reasons that CCP had for pursuing it in the first place.

Have a little respect and allow the corpse to rest in peace.

Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.

Aelavaine
Aelavaine's Corporation
#266 - 2016-04-10 12:23:04 UTC
In its original form yes. Avatar gameplay as general concept not.

You want more than spinning ships? Support Avatar Gameplay!

Sepheir Sepheron
State War Academy
Caldari State
#267 - 2016-04-15 09:38:59 UTC
Honestly as useless as it sounds to most of us veterans, new players love this kind of stuff. I have a lot of friends who really like how EVE looks and works but aren't playing for the sole purpose that they can't leave their ship and interact with other players, face to face, as their character.

Add a lobby in every station for capsuleers, maybe have it restricted in mass populated stations like Jita 4-4 to private quarters with limited capacity.

No one is going to quit EVE if CCP expands on this, the only result is more players.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#268 - 2016-04-15 22:30:02 UTC
Aelavaine wrote:
To all who still think that WiS will never come because CCP said so:

Team Size Matters wrote:
...we make sure there is one single mechanism that brings new skillpoints in to the system – training.
Source: Skill Trading in New Eden

Team Size Matters wrote:
...10,000 skill point reward that a character will receive the first time they kill an NPC ship every 22 hours.
Source: Daily Opportunities coming soon

That shows how much a statement from CCP is worth.



It is infinitely easier to not do something than it is to do it.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Jack Carrigan
Order of the Shadow
#269 - 2016-04-19 12:12:04 UTC
Sepheir Sepheron wrote:
Honestly as useless as it sounds to most of us veterans, new players love this kind of stuff. I have a lot of friends who really like how EVE looks and works but aren't playing for the sole purpose that they can't leave their ship and interact with other players, face to face, as their character.

Add a lobby in every station for capsuleers, maybe have it restricted in mass populated stations like Jita 4-4 to private quarters with limited capacity.

No one is going to quit EVE if CCP expands on this, the only result is more players.


More players = more targets = more pew

Everyone wins

I am the One who exists in Shadow. I am the Devil your parents warned you about.

||CEO: Order of the Shadow||Executor: The Revenant Order||Creator: Bowhead||

Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#270 - 2016-04-20 11:51:08 UTC
Jack Carrigan wrote:
Sepheir Sepheron wrote:
Honestly as useless as it sounds to most of us veterans, new players love this kind of stuff. I have a lot of friends who really like how EVE looks and works but aren't playing for the sole purpose that they can't leave their ship and interact with other players, face to face, as their character.

Add a lobby in every station for capsuleers, maybe have it restricted in mass populated stations like Jita 4-4 to private quarters with limited capacity.

No one is going to quit EVE if CCP expands on this, the only result is more players.


More players = more targets = more pew

Everyone wins


Only if there was literally nothing better that CCP could spend the very considerable amount of money on that would work better. Given that "real" wis would mean restarting the project from scratch AGAIN, you're basically asking CCP to create an entire game and then give it to the existing customers for free.

I'd suggest reframing the proposal into something a little more attractive to a business with shareholders to account to.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Jack Carrigan
Order of the Shadow
#271 - 2016-04-20 22:09:08 UTC
Do you have any suggestions?

I am the One who exists in Shadow. I am the Devil your parents warned you about.

||CEO: Order of the Shadow||Executor: The Revenant Order||Creator: Bowhead||

Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#272 - 2016-04-24 00:10:17 UTC
Already made it in this very thread.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Aelavaine
Aelavaine's Corporation
#273 - 2016-04-24 20:01:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Aelavaine
Malcanis wrote:
I'd suggest reframing the proposal into something a little more attractive to a business with shareholders to account to.
Okay, let me try:
Shareholders like increasing login numbers and f2p shooters. I count the upcoming dailies, Dust514, Project Legion and Project Nova as validation for this point.

The solution is Project WiS. - A f2p shooter within the Eve-client.
- Current Eve-Avatars can be used in Project WiS and vice versa
- SoE Combat Suits can be used in Project WiS
- Combat Suits from Project WiS can be used in Eve
- The Project WiS Lobby is also accessible for Eve avatars
- Interaction between Eve and Project WiS Players in Project WiS or Eve. Competitions between capsuleers and ex dusters for example.
- Since Project WiS is part of Eve, their login numbers add to the Eve numbers
- Undocking and diving in into the world of New Eden is just one mouse click away (getting more people to try Eve)
- With more time you'll find more points, but this should be enough to get the idea behind it

This simply is a variation of earlier suggestions of splitting and thus lower development costs between two games. Something that shareholders also should like.

I for myself don't really like Project WiS, but if a pact with the devil shareholders is needed to get WiS done, then so shall it be.

You want more than spinning ships? Support Avatar Gameplay!

Jack Carrigan
Order of the Shadow
#274 - 2016-04-25 19:07:04 UTC
Aelavaine wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
I'd suggest reframing the proposal into something a little more attractive to a business with shareholders to account to.
Okay, let me try:
Shareholders like increasing login numbers and f2p shooters. I count the upcoming dailies, Dust514, Project Legion and Project Nova as validation for this point.

The solution is Project WiS. - A f2p shooter within the Eve-client.
- Current Eve-Avatars can be used in Project WiS and vice versa
- SoE Combat Suits can be used in Project WiS
- Combat Suits from Project WiS can be used in Eve
- The Project WiS Lobby is also accessible for Eve avatars
- Interaction between Eve and Project WiS Players in Project WiS or Eve. Competitions between capsuleers and ex dusters for example.
- Since Project WiS is part of Eve, their login numbers add to the Eve numbers
- Undocking and diving in into the world of New Eden is just one mouse click away (getting more people to try Eve)
- With more time you'll find more points, but this should be enough to get the idea behind it

This simply is a variation of earlier suggestions of splitting and thus lower development costs between two games. Something that shareholders also should like.

I for myself don't really like Project WiS, but if a pact with the devil shareholders is needed to get WiS done, then so shall it be.


Now this is what I was going for. Not just a suggestion but a basic model of how to put it all together instead of racking my brain for a while. I do like the touch of basically having the login to Project: WiS being the point of entry into either EVE or Nova. Basically choose your door type of thing.

I am the One who exists in Shadow. I am the Devil your parents warned you about.

||CEO: Order of the Shadow||Executor: The Revenant Order||Creator: Bowhead||

helana Tsero
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#275 - 2016-04-26 05:16:26 UTC  |  Edited by: helana Tsero
Jack Carrigan wrote:
Aelavaine wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
I'd suggest reframing the proposal into something a little more attractive to a business with shareholders to account to.
Okay, let me try:
Shareholders like increasing login numbers and f2p shooters. I count the upcoming dailies, Dust514, Project Legion and Project Nova as validation for this point.

The solution is Project WiS. - A f2p shooter within the Eve-client.
- Current Eve-Avatars can be used in Project WiS and vice versa
- SoE Combat Suits can be used in Project WiS
- Combat Suits from Project WiS can be used in Eve
- The Project WiS Lobby is also accessible for Eve avatars
- Interaction between Eve and Project WiS Players in Project WiS or Eve. Competitions between capsuleers and ex dusters for example.
- Since Project WiS is part of Eve, their login numbers add to the Eve numbers
- Undocking and diving in into the world of New Eden is just one mouse click away (getting more people to try Eve)
- With more time you'll find more points, but this should be enough to get the idea behind it

This simply is a variation of earlier suggestions of splitting and thus lower development costs between two games. Something that shareholders also should like.

I for myself don't really like Project WiS, but if a pact with the devil shareholders is needed to get WiS done, then so shall it be.


Now this is what I was going for. Not just a suggestion but a basic model of how to put it all together instead of racking my brain for a while. I do like the touch of basically having the login to Project: WiS being the point of entry into either EVE or Nova. Basically choose your door type of thing.


Seriously.... your proposing a FPS within the eve client... may as well abandon any other feature in EvE for next 3-4 years if you want something like that... cause it will take all the dev time. (stop thinking eve is using the unreal engine/other fps engine... its not)

I want walking in stations as much as you guys do.. but you have to keep it simple and acheivable. Not some grand plan for another game within EvE.

I posted this a few pages back. Fairly basic and compliments the existing game. Would still take investment and resources by CCP but alot less than developing a compelte avatar experience within the game client.


Ideas that could be implemented with a moderate amount of work.

- Add scope videos to captains quarters. (already done. thanks CCP !)

- Use the resources of the eve 007 show and eve trailer production to put together a weekly summery on EvE. Make it voiced and animated by a npc newsreader. Show it on CQ screens. Would help new and old players get interested in parts of the game they have not tried. eg could feature : sov news, low sec piracy stories, how to join a player corp segment, economic news and industry stats, new ship designs, ADs for player corps, news on titan/XL citadel kills, large player battles etc etc.

- Add a room or wall for display of player trophy's / achievements
Could be 1000 pvp kills get you a trophy or completing 1000 level 4 missions etc etc.
Allow miniature corpse heads or destroyed ship models with inscriptions... Your best ever kill or most against all the odds victory.. Allow players to memorialize their player experience.

- Add CQ to citadels.

"...ppl need to get out of caves and they will see something new.... thats where eve is placed... not in cave."  | zoonr-Korsairs |

Meanwhile Citadel release issues: "tried to bug report this and the bug report is bugged as well" | Rafeau |

Aelavaine
Aelavaine's Corporation
#276 - 2016-04-26 07:51:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Aelavaine
helana Tsero wrote:
Seriously.... your proposing a FPS within the eve client... may as well abandon any other feature in EvE for next 3-4 years if you want something like that... cause it will take all the dev time. (stop thinking eve is using the unreal engine/other fps engine... its not)
No, you got it wrong. Malci wanted something shareholders would like. Based on the past and current developments around Eve, I described something that maybe fits more their needs.

Contrary to your comment it wouldn't take all the dev time of Eve for the next years. It would take the dev time of those who worked already for Project Nova or Dust or Legion. WiS would be a kind of byproduct. Admittedly a larger one but still a byproduct, depending of how much features it contains.

If in the end the shooter is part of the Eve client or not, I don't care. Nobody is forced to use it. - And yes, a full functional WiS means to start from scratch again.

You want more than spinning ships? Support Avatar Gameplay!

helana Tsero
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#277 - 2016-04-26 11:55:39 UTC
Aelavaine wrote:
helana Tsero wrote:
Seriously.... your proposing a FPS within the eve client... may as well abandon any other feature in EvE for next 3-4 years if you want something like that... cause it will take all the dev time. (stop thinking eve is using the unreal engine/other fps engine... its not)
No, you got it wrong. Malci wanted something shareholders would like. Based on the past and current developments around Eve, I described something that maybe fits more their needs.

Contrary to your comment it wouldn't take all the dev time of Eve for the next years. It would take the dev time of those who worked already for Project Nova or Dust or Legion. WiS would be a kind of byproduct. Admittedly a larger one but still a byproduct, depending of how much features it contains.

If in the end the shooter is part of the Eve client or not, I don't care. Nobody is forced to use it. - And yes, a full functional WiS means to start from scratch again.


Don't want to get into a discussion about this cause its a side issue.. but the one key point is that building a fps or full avatar experience into the eve client is a much more difficult and time consuming endeavor than using a existing fps engine and starting a brand new game. Project Nova uses unreal engine, this engine is made for fps and content for fps style games can be created much quicker using its architecture and development kit. You cant hope to create a project nova style game in the eve client with eves engine in a similar time frame.

"...ppl need to get out of caves and they will see something new.... thats where eve is placed... not in cave."  | zoonr-Korsairs |

Meanwhile Citadel release issues: "tried to bug report this and the bug report is bugged as well" | Rafeau |

Jack Carrigan
Order of the Shadow
#278 - 2016-05-10 18:51:26 UTC
All valid concerns.

I am the One who exists in Shadow. I am the Devil your parents warned you about.

||CEO: Order of the Shadow||Executor: The Revenant Order||Creator: Bowhead||

Zathra Narazi
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#279 - 2016-05-26 10:16:41 UTC
Jack Carrigan wrote:
Avatar Gameplay

Nooooo!
Aelavaine
Aelavaine's Corporation
#280 - 2016-05-26 18:40:53 UTC
Zathra Narazi wrote:
I really appreciate the effort you put into your post. Can you give us a few minutes more of your precious time and provide us with more details why? Preferably with more than one word if it's not too much.

You want more than spinning ships? Support Avatar Gameplay!