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Lugh Crow-Slave
#641 - 2016-04-09 17:30:29 UTC
What next will I gain sp in mining skills every strip miner cycle?

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Lugh Crow-Slave
#642 - 2016-04-09 17:32:14 UTC
Big Lynx wrote:
Ria Nieyli wrote:
How could the CSM let this happen to us?

Cause CSM is useless like a peen on the pope.


They are just to make us feel better nothing more than a PR stunt


Or sucks to because a lot of them work really hard to try and make the game better

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
NinjaTurtle
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#643 - 2016-04-09 17:33:13 UTC  |  Edited by: NinjaTurtle
terrible idea. just terrible. kids, you're all just ******* awful.
there's a huge difference between promoting meaningful gameplay and promoting brief logons that have no actual substance or content for the rest of EVE. This isn't ******* Clash of Clans, you shouldn't be rewarded 8 mil isk (yeah cause you can put a price tag on SP now thx CCP) for logging in and tapping the screen twice.
i don't often say this but someone needs to ask nicely if you'll remove your heads from your respective asses TIA
Syrias Bizniz
some random local shitlords
#644 - 2016-04-09 17:39:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Syrias Bizniz
Tavion Aksmis wrote:
Syrias Bizniz wrote:
Mister Ripley wrote:
I'm still not sure if this is real or a joke...

Right now I can play the way I like whenever I want without missing anything. This makes EVE special for me, because I don't have to follow stupid weekly award bullshit XP boost crap.

If you give me the feeling that I miss something every time I don't do some stupid **** that you think is worth a reward, I don't think this will motivate me to play more but to play less and to let my sub expire.

My time is limited, like everyone else's is. You playerbase is not freaking 12year olds that have nothing better to do. If you want it that way, then say good bye to quality eve and hello to Shitgame No. 42542



You have that already. Every 20 minutes you are not logged in, you miss out dank ISK ticks. Every dank ISK tick you miss out is one further step you have to make for that juicy Skill Injectors.

Man the **** up, you're getting offered FREE BONUS **** that has literally ZERO effort attached and you are ******* complaining, holy tittyfucking christ.

IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT DON'T DO IT, IT'S LIKE PLANETARY INTERACTION.
And IF you like it, it's 8m FREE ISK per day and character, and after 50 days you can ******* sell the SP, or throw them on one of your alts, or donate them to some newbies you're trying to help out.

But no, CCP adds free stuff, everyone rages and loses their goddamn ******* mind.
Get ******.


Free bonuses is the killer of hardcore MMO's. I stopped playing WoW after vanilla because there where no longer need to atune for raids or actually do a dangerous "move OP" to the dungeon, effectively killing world PvP (TBC introduced flying mounts and more portals). It made the game easy and extremely mundane, making me and other players who likes complex games completely loose the interest in the game as it takes away a lot of the skill, planning of logistics and min/max out of the game replacing it with grind.

Honestly I was kinda done with MMO gameing overall as I though brutally hard ones with complex mechanics where all dead and all where just a bunch of "WoW-clones" until I found EVE almost two years ago.



Yes, i quit WoW for pretty much the same reasons.
I also like hardcore, i do like it very much.
And i don't feel like 10k sp is going to turn EVE into Hello Kitty Online, or worse, WoW.
Safe your outrageous behaviour for the **** that will actually kill EVE, this however is none of it.

You could get the same SP per day by plugging in +5 imps over flying an empty clone.
Do you fly with +5 imps in nullsec pvp, because it is mandatory so you don't fall off the slope?
No you don't because it is inconvenient for you.
Thus, if you had to abandon your daily routine just to get "some SP", you won't do it. But this SP here is easy, for some people that want to get the maximum sp gains, they will do it, just like they would plug in +5s. Others, like me, are sitting at a farily big pile of SP on their chars and are even stripping them from SP. On this char, i have no real desire to farm skillpoints all day erry day. So i won't do it actively. If i happen to collect some, fine. Maybe i'll put them to use. But i don't feel the urge to do space chores just so i can keep playing EVE.

Also, keep in mind, your current SP gains are not going away. This is not some **** where you are REQUIRED to grind in order to advance in the game.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#645 - 2016-04-09 17:50:22 UTC
Syrias Bizniz wrote:
Tavion Aksmis wrote:
Syrias Bizniz wrote:
Mister Ripley wrote:
I'm still not sure if this is real or a joke...

Right now I can play the way I like whenever I want without missing anything. This makes EVE special for me, because I don't have to follow stupid weekly award bullshit XP boost crap.

If you give me the feeling that I miss something every time I don't do some stupid **** that you think is worth a reward, I don't think this will motivate me to play more but to play less and to let my sub expire.

My time is limited, like everyone else's is. You playerbase is not freaking 12year olds that have nothing better to do. If you want it that way, then say good bye to quality eve and hello to Shitgame No. 42542



You have that already. Every 20 minutes you are not logged in, you miss out dank ISK ticks. Every dank ISK tick you miss out is one further step you have to make for that juicy Skill Injectors.

Man the **** up, you're getting offered FREE BONUS **** that has literally ZERO effort attached and you are ******* complaining, holy tittyfucking christ.

IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT DON'T DO IT, IT'S LIKE PLANETARY INTERACTION.
And IF you like it, it's 8m FREE ISK per day and character, and after 50 days you can ******* sell the SP, or throw them on one of your alts, or donate them to some newbies you're trying to help out.

But no, CCP adds free stuff, everyone rages and loses their goddamn ******* mind.
Get ******.


Free bonuses is the killer of hardcore MMO's. I stopped playing WoW after vanilla because there where no longer need to atune for raids or actually do a dangerous "move OP" to the dungeon, effectively killing world PvP (TBC introduced flying mounts and more portals). It made the game easy and extremely mundane, making me and other players who likes complex games completely loose the interest in the game as it takes away a lot of the skill, planning of logistics and min/max out of the game replacing it with grind.

Honestly I was kinda done with MMO gameing overall as I though brutally hard ones with complex mechanics where all dead and all where just a bunch of "WoW-clones" until I found EVE almost two years ago.



Yes, i quit WoW for pretty much the same reasons.
I also like hardcore, i do like it very much.
And i don't feel like 10k sp is going to turn EVE into Hello Kitty Online, or worse, WoW.
Safe your outrageous behaviour for the **** that will actually kill EVE, this however is none of it.

You could get the same SP per day by plugging in +5 imps over flying an empty clone.
Do you fly with +5 imps in nullsec pvp, because it is mandatory so you don't fall off the slope?
No you don't because it is inconvenient for you.
Thus, if you had to abandon your daily routine just to get "some SP", you won't do it. But this SP here is easy, for some people that want to get the maximum sp gains, they will do it, just like they would plug in +5s. Others, like me, are sitting at a farily big pile of SP on their chars and are even stripping them from SP. On this char, i have no real desire to farm skillpoints all day erry day. So i won't do it actively. If i happen to collect some, fine. Maybe i'll put them to use. But i don't feel the urge to do space chores just so i can keep playing EVE.

Also, keep in mind, your current SP gains are not going away. This is not some **** where you are REQUIRED to grind in order to advance in the game.


People are upset by what this is leading to and the ideology behind things like dailies not the sp

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Krevnos
Back Door Burglars
#646 - 2016-04-09 18:05:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Krevnos
Syrias Bizniz wrote:
[quote=Tavion Aksmis][quote=Syrias Bizniz]

Safe your outrageous behaviour for the **** that will actually kill EVE, this however is none of it.



This is where you are wrong. To put it into perspective what CCP are attempting to do is to cajole players into performing menial daily tasks, this introduction being the first in a series. This will be expanded to other activities: mining, data/relic sites, scanning, placing market orders.

Take, for instance a station trader who now feels they need to go and kill a rat in order to get 'that little bit extra'. Now consider your own daily gaming time where you feel obligated to perform a series of pathetic tasks in order to keep up with other players doing the same. By definition this is Theme Park MMO material.

Would you rather enjoy your own gaming style or follow a set of daily guidelines laid out for you by CCP?

This is an attack on freedom of choice in EvE and you should be very concerned!



Now join me by extending your middle finger to Eve's developers on this proposal!
Dave Stark
#647 - 2016-04-09 18:09:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Dave Stark
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
People are upset by what this is leading to and the ideology behind things like dailies not the sp


actually, sp as a reward is a bigger issue than adding daily rewards in itself.

the problem is, a reward like SP that can't be obtained by other means creates a situation where you get punished for not logging in, rather than rewarded for logging in.

10m isk instead? nobody would really care if they miss it. they can grind for another 5 mins another day.

of course, you could always, and probably will, argue that's not an issue with skill injectors and i'll partially agree. you can make it up with skill injectors - but now you're just shafting every dedicated player that has been playing for more than like 2 months, due to the diminishing returns on injectors. that means that the punishment for not logging in is harsher for those of us that has supported ccp for the longest.

it's like ccp didn't really put much thought in to how this would affect anything. it's like now they have the precedent {for lack of a better term} to dish out SP here there and everywhere they feel that they must shoehorn it in to everything regardless of how much of a dumb idea it will be.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#648 - 2016-04-09 18:18:01 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
People are upset by what this is leading to and the ideology behind things like dailies not the sp


actually, sp as a reward is a bigger issue than adding daily rewards in itself.

the problem is, a reward like SP that can't be obtained by other means creates a situation where you get punished for not logging in, rather than rewarded for logging in.

10m isk instead? nobody would really care if they miss it. they can grind for another 5 mins another day.

of course, you could always, and probably will, argue that's not an issue with skill injectors and i'll partially agree. you can make it up with skill injectors - but now you're just shafting every dedicated player that has been playing for more than like 2 months, due to the diminishing returns on injectors. that means that the punishment for not logging in is harsher for those of us that has supported ccp for the longest.

it's like ccp didn't really put much thought in to how this would affect anything. it's like now they have the precedent {for lack of a better term} to dish out SP here there and everywhere they feel that they must shoehorn it in to everything regardless of how much of a dumb idea it will be.


Lol yes sp as a tool makes it worse but you can replace sp woth any other powerful otherwise unobtainable item and the issue stays the same

That's what I meant by its not the sp but the entire concept of dailies

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Dave Stark
#649 - 2016-04-09 18:32:22 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
People are upset by what this is leading to and the ideology behind things like dailies not the sp


actually, sp as a reward is a bigger issue than adding daily rewards in itself.

the problem is, a reward like SP that can't be obtained by other means creates a situation where you get punished for not logging in, rather than rewarded for logging in.

10m isk instead? nobody would really care if they miss it. they can grind for another 5 mins another day.

of course, you could always, and probably will, argue that's not an issue with skill injectors and i'll partially agree. you can make it up with skill injectors - but now you're just shafting every dedicated player that has been playing for more than like 2 months, due to the diminishing returns on injectors. that means that the punishment for not logging in is harsher for those of us that has supported ccp for the longest.

it's like ccp didn't really put much thought in to how this would affect anything. it's like now they have the precedent {for lack of a better term} to dish out SP here there and everywhere they feel that they must shoehorn it in to everything regardless of how much of a dumb idea it will be.


Lol yes sp as a tool makes it worse but you can replace sp woth any other powerful otherwise unobtainable item and the issue stays the same

That's what I meant by its not the sp but the entire concept of dailies


agreed, if they were giving out geckos or something that you can't obtain any other way you'd have the same problem.

if done right daily rewards could be good.

here, let me give you an example. call it 10m isk instead of 10k sp.

what happens if i miss a day's SP reward? gone forever, no way to get that back.
what happens if i miss a day's isk reward? nbd, just grind for 5 more mins tomorrow.

what happens if the reward is only 10m? it's still worth doing, 10m for such a trivial task is a great isk:time:effort thing.

you still get rewarded for doing it, but you're not going to feel punished if you don't.



alternatively, just making it a weekly thing for a bigger reward/more effort would also solve the issue of people having to try and shoehorn it in to their lives at inconvenient times because of the dumb 22hr mechanic rather than "reset at dt" style reset mechanic.
Arya Regnar
Darwins Right Hand
#650 - 2016-04-09 18:40:20 UTC
You can go eat a bag of you know what.

Go to hell.

EvE-Mail me if you need anything.
Tokyo Drifter
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#651 - 2016-04-09 18:43:27 UTC
>Skill Injectors
>Jump Fatigue
>Fozzie Sov, working in favors of weekend warriors and sovless entities
>T3 servers with tidi even more unplayable than before the upgrade

And now daily quests for dank skill point xp
Just lawl
Gedrick frogue
Heuristic Industrial And Development
AddictClan
#652 - 2016-04-09 18:51:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Gedrick frogue
Ah HELL NO

Who at CCP was vaping from a volcano and thought this horse poop is a good idea?
Lugh Crow-Slave
#653 - 2016-04-09 18:52:54 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
People are upset by what this is leading to and the ideology behind things like dailies not the sp


actually, sp as a reward is a bigger issue than adding daily rewards in itself.

the problem is, a reward like SP that can't be obtained by other means creates a situation where you get punished for not logging in, rather than rewarded for logging in.

10m isk instead? nobody would really care if they miss it. they can grind for another 5 mins another day.

of course, you could always, and probably will, argue that's not an issue with skill injectors and i'll partially agree. you can make it up with skill injectors - but now you're just shafting every dedicated player that has been playing for more than like 2 months, due to the diminishing returns on injectors. that means that the punishment for not logging in is harsher for those of us that has supported ccp for the longest.

it's like ccp didn't really put much thought in to how this would affect anything. it's like now they have the precedent {for lack of a better term} to dish out SP here there and everywhere they feel that they must shoehorn it in to everything regardless of how much of a dumb idea it will be.


Lol yes sp as a tool makes it worse but you can replace sp woth any other powerful otherwise unobtainable item and the issue stays the same

That's what I meant by its not the sp but the entire concept of dailies


agreed, if they were giving out geckos or something that you can't obtain any other way you'd have the same problem.

if done right daily rewards could be good.

here, let me give you an example. call it 10m isk instead of 10k sp.

what happens if i miss a day's SP reward? gone forever, no way to get that back.
what happens if i miss a day's isk reward? nbd, just grind for 5 more mins tomorrow.

what happens if the reward is only 10m? it's still worth doing, 10m for such a trivial task is a great isk:time:effort thing.

you still get rewarded for doing it, but you're not going to feel punished if you don't.



alternatively, just making it a weekly thing for a bigger reward/more effort would also solve the issue of people having to try and shoehorn it in to their lives at inconvenient times because of the dumb 22hr mechanic rather than "reset at dt" style reset mechanic.


Aye to bad all ccp wants out of this is numbers so even if they did go with isk or something like that it would just be to hear the wage slower for us it wouldn't be long before the returned to sp:/

Only way to prevent it is to keep dailies out of eve.

Besides I really don't like the idea of ccp telling me what I'm supposed to do. What happened to hands of and just seeing what goals the players set for themselves.

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
#654 - 2016-04-09 18:56:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Mara Pahrdi
Instead of creating exciting gameplay that entices people to log in CCP decides to head for sp grind?

This is the worst idea I've seen in the last 5,5 years and the first time in those 5,5 years I seriously consider to look where I've put my authenticator when I left wow.

Edit: CCP Rise for Team Where Nothing Matters Any More...

Remove standings and insurance.
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#655 - 2016-04-09 19:05:06 UTC
This is one of the worst ideas i have seen in my time here.

No.

Do not do this.

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
#656 - 2016-04-09 19:06:53 UTC
Scatim Helicon wrote:
It's not even that this is a game breakingly terrible idea, though the motives are laughably transparent. What's more worrying is the lack of imagination and lack of faith in the core product it betrays. There's a clear trend amongst the current generation of devs of abandoning the original CCP philosophy of forging their own path and taking Eve in its own direction away from the mainstream, instead copying ideas they've seen other developers use in other games and attempting to graft them on to Eve. Hence we see a skins shop for personalising our avatars, Capture The Flag sovereignty mechanics and now a proposal for daily quests.

CCP has gone from being a developer known for innovation, to a developer known for imitation.

/Thread

Remove standings and insurance.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#657 - 2016-04-09 19:18:12 UTC
Mara Pahrdi wrote:
Scatim Helicon wrote:
It's not even that this is a game breakingly terrible idea, though the motives are laughably transparent. What's more worrying is the lack of imagination and lack of faith in the core product it betrays. There's a clear trend amongst the current generation of devs of abandoning the original CCP philosophy of forging their own path and taking Eve in its own direction away from the mainstream, instead copying ideas they've seen other developers use in other games and attempting to graft them on to Eve. Hence we see a skins shop for personalising our avatars, Capture The Flag sovereignty mechanics and now a proposal for daily quests.

CCP has gone from being a developer known for innovation, to a developer known for imitation.

/Thread


To be fair I don't think it's the devs doping it is probably the higher ups

Also fozzie sov was not bad on paper we were just really good at finding exploits it is better than the grind freest it used to be but it also needs a lot more work of not a total overhaul

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Moac Tor
Cyber Core
Immediate Destruction
#658 - 2016-04-09 19:23:50 UTC
WTF, this is BS. So now Eve is turned into a grind. Wasn't the selling point that in eve you don't grind for skills....
Lugh Crow-Slave
#659 - 2016-04-09 19:24:31 UTC
What worries me the most is once this gets put in it will do exactly what ccp wants and it will do it well

Marketing will see it and investors will see it

Once that happens. ...

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Karma Bad
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#660 - 2016-04-09 19:25:14 UTC

At one point in time, Eve was a game where it proclamed that you can progress as fast as everyone one else.

Optimizing is in my book ok, But forcing people to log in, and burn themselves out for sp doesnt feel right.

I like the idea that sp can only come from training time, and from that pool and spread it around to other players.




If eve wishes to push a daily system, it should not include sp, but some other form of LP and should only be account wide not per toon. And im not a fan of per day, per week is more up the way i think things should be if I "have" to have it.

Which I Dont.


Now expand it to include more than kill a npc, on the inital pass, else it will just be a broken system that may never be fixed, if your going to do it, do more than the 1 thing.


As such, if i had to pick a way of doing this, create a a system where you can have X dailys stored up daily's, any of which can be what ccp is pushing for its particular day. It regens once every 12, 24 or every downtime and can stay in the pool for no more than 30 days.

This will in my book make eve less of a I have to log in "like every other game i dont want to play right now" and do

Chores, as realy that what this mechanic is as the first 2 dev feed backs in this post make it being, Just some Chores so you have to log in or miss out.


or option 2 in my book

make this only available for the 30-60 days or 30-60 claims (as in so many times in a toons lifetime) as the way its implemented. Or worse but still better than what it is now. every 3 months (like sisters arc) you can or will get a quest like time where if you save the world from something where you have to protect someone (perferebly building it into some type of lore) where you have to log in for only a "week", Longer than that your working on burning up your players

Players that already push themselves to burning up,

Please dont do every day, for the rest of eve or else i see many people looking at it as something they have to do due to the psycology of missing out on something. With this, it could create zombies that all they do is log in and do what ever they need to and log out, creating a distinct disconnect from eve, even if you get a higher log in count... it May end up creating less content for minimal gain.