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[Citadels Release] Capital Ship changes reaching Singularity!

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Marranar Amatin
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#321 - 2016-03-31 17:18:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Marranar Amatin
@Rong Guy: I am quoting my own post about sub cap dreads:

Marranar Amatin wrote:
Dreads will never be used in a small subcap gang, their whole mechanic is simply not made for that.
As all capitals they are very slow, and siege is very situational. Siege is a huge drawback for small subcaps fight, but great for big fights where you commit to the grid, and probably would want to have siege for the defense bonus alone.
Trying to balance the damage so that they are viable in small subcaps fights, would mean that they need ridicilous dps, making them completely overpowered in big fights where the drawbacks of siege is reduced.

So there is no point in comparing them to carrier or anything else for smaller subcaps fight... they never will be good there, and are not supposed to be good there.

Now in bigger fights, its ok when they are viable against subcaps (which they are with the new guns, the damage is nice), but still should not be top choice to bring them against subcaps. Because they already excel at shooting bigger stuff. If they also become the best choice to shoot subcaps, why bring anything else at all?
If i remember correctly there was a time when dreads were extremely good against caps and subcaps, and it was nerfed for a good reason.
The role as big gun in cap fights already works on tranq, the option to switch to subcaps guns is just a bonus.


Also you are probably underestimating the dps. I've seen a screenshot with quad 800: >4800 dps. probably with imps, and maybe heat... but thats still a lot.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#322 - 2016-03-31 17:39:41 UTC
Marranar Amatin wrote:
@Rong Guy: I am quoting my own post about sub cap dreads:

Marranar Amatin wrote:
Dreads will never be used in a small subcap gang, their whole mechanic is simply not made for that.
As all capitals they are very slow, and siege is very situational. Siege is a huge drawback for small subcaps fight, but great for big fights where you commit to the grid, and probably would want to have siege for the defense bonus alone.
Trying to balance the damage so that they are viable in small subcaps fights, would mean that they need ridicilous dps, making them completely overpowered in big fights where the drawbacks of siege is reduced.

So there is no point in comparing them to carrier or anything else for smaller subcaps fight... they never will be good there, and are not supposed to be good there.

Now in bigger fights, its ok when they are viable against subcaps (which they are with the new guns, the damage is nice), but still should not be top choice to bring them against subcaps. Because they already excel at shooting bigger stuff. If they also become the best choice to shoot subcaps, why bring anything else at all?
If i remember correctly there was a time when dreads were extremely good against caps and subcaps, and it was nerfed for a good reason.
The role as big gun in cap fights already works on tranq, the option to switch to subcaps guns is just a bonus.


Also you are probably underestimating the dps. I've seen a screenshot with quad 800: >4800 dps. probably with imps, and maybe heat... but thats still a lot.


hell my phoenix gets over 5kdps with out heat

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Miss 'Assassination' Cayman
CK-0FF
Intergalactic Space Hobos
#323 - 2016-03-31 21:44:26 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Marranar Amatin wrote:
@Rong Guy: I am quoting my own post about sub cap dreads:

Marranar Amatin wrote:
Dreads will never be used in a small subcap gang, their whole mechanic is simply not made for that.
As all capitals they are very slow, and siege is very situational. Siege is a huge drawback for small subcaps fight, but great for big fights where you commit to the grid, and probably would want to have siege for the defense bonus alone.
Trying to balance the damage so that they are viable in small subcaps fights, would mean that they need ridicilous dps, making them completely overpowered in big fights where the drawbacks of siege is reduced.

So there is no point in comparing them to carrier or anything else for smaller subcaps fight... they never will be good there, and are not supposed to be good there.

Now in bigger fights, its ok when they are viable against subcaps (which they are with the new guns, the damage is nice), but still should not be top choice to bring them against subcaps. Because they already excel at shooting bigger stuff. If they also become the best choice to shoot subcaps, why bring anything else at all?
If i remember correctly there was a time when dreads were extremely good against caps and subcaps, and it was nerfed for a good reason.
The role as big gun in cap fights already works on tranq, the option to switch to subcaps guns is just a bonus.


Also you are probably underestimating the dps. I've seen a screenshot with quad 800: >4800 dps. probably with imps, and maybe heat... but thats still a lot.


hell my phoenix gets over 5kdps with out heat

Sure, but how well does that apply? Torpedoes aren't exactly known for doing full damage.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#324 - 2016-03-31 21:46:35 UTC
Miss 'Assassination' Cayman wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Marranar Amatin wrote:
@Rong Guy: I am quoting my own post about sub cap dreads:

Marranar Amatin wrote:
Dreads will never be used in a small subcap gang, their whole mechanic is simply not made for that.
As all capitals they are very slow, and siege is very situational. Siege is a huge drawback for small subcaps fight, but great for big fights where you commit to the grid, and probably would want to have siege for the defense bonus alone.
Trying to balance the damage so that they are viable in small subcaps fights, would mean that they need ridicilous dps, making them completely overpowered in big fights where the drawbacks of siege is reduced.

So there is no point in comparing them to carrier or anything else for smaller subcaps fight... they never will be good there, and are not supposed to be good there.

Now in bigger fights, its ok when they are viable against subcaps (which they are with the new guns, the damage is nice), but still should not be top choice to bring them against subcaps. Because they already excel at shooting bigger stuff. If they also become the best choice to shoot subcaps, why bring anything else at all?
If i remember correctly there was a time when dreads were extremely good against caps and subcaps, and it was nerfed for a good reason.
The role as big gun in cap fights already works on tranq, the option to switch to subcaps guns is just a bonus.


Also you are probably underestimating the dps. I've seen a screenshot with quad 800: >4800 dps. probably with imps, and maybe heat... but thats still a lot.


hell my phoenix gets over 5kdps with out heat

Sure, but how well does that apply? Torpedoes aren't exactly known for doing full damage.


100% to cruisers if i have a support fleet and i can manage pretty good on my own if i drop tank

(grapple beams help a lot to)

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Soleil Fournier
Fliet Pizza Delivery
Of Essence
#325 - 2016-04-01 01:15:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Soleil Fournier
Are there any known issues with fighters and EW?


I've had a few instances where a single squad of Fighters become unresponsive and just sit there in space ignoring commands while the other squads continued to behave normally.

Haven't found a way to reproduce it, but both times they were either scrammed or within a mobile warp bubble.
Captain Thunderwalker
Room for Improvement
Good Sax
#326 - 2016-04-01 01:15:31 UTC
When will the new changes to wh escalations go online on sisi/? need to start testing this soon!!!
Lugh Crow-Slave
#327 - 2016-04-01 01:16:24 UTC
Captain Thunderwalker wrote:
When will the new changes to wh escalations go online on sisi/? need to start testing this soon!!!


the npc capitals are already there so probably soon

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Z1gy
Vindicator Corporation
#328 - 2016-04-01 02:41:13 UTC
can we have more than 24 skills injector to test the capital changes? for a 100 m sp toon i only got 3.8m sp from the injectors and that just enough to get capital ships 5 and racial capital guns to about 50 % done - can give us more maybe another 8 or 16 more

thanks
Rong Guy
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#329 - 2016-04-01 09:14:22 UTC
Marranar Amatin wrote:
@Rong Guy: I am quoting my own post about sub cap dreads:

Marranar Amatin wrote:
Dreads will never be used in a small subcap gang, their whole mechanic is simply not made for that.
As all capitals they are very slow, and siege is very situational. Siege is a huge drawback for small subcaps fight, but great for big fights where you commit to the grid, and probably would want to have siege for the defense bonus alone.
Trying to balance the damage so that they are viable in small subcaps fights, would mean that they need ridicilous dps, making them completely overpowered in big fights where the drawbacks of siege is reduced.

So there is no point in comparing them to carrier or anything else for smaller subcaps fight... they never will be good there, and are not supposed to be good there.

Now in bigger fights, its ok when they are viable against subcaps (which they are with the new guns, the damage is nice), but still should not be top choice to bring them against subcaps. Because they already excel at shooting bigger stuff. If they also become the best choice to shoot subcaps, why bring anything else at all?
If i remember correctly there was a time when dreads were extremely good against caps and subcaps, and it was nerfed for a good reason.
The role as big gun in cap fights already works on tranq, the option to switch to subcaps guns is just a bonus.


Also you are probably underestimating the dps. I've seen a screenshot with quad 800: >4800 dps. probably with imps, and maybe heat... but thats still a lot.


I just tried the nag and pulled 3.4k with 4 t2 gyros and t2 guns with faction ammo, that dps is more then enough.

Going to see how i got such low dps on the phoenix
Rek Seven
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#330 - 2016-04-01 10:05:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Rek Seven
Seriously, wtf is happening with dreads? They some developer attention, not just "here are some new guns and an extra high and some new mods... enjoy!"

Can we at least get a dedicated thread of the upcoming features section?!

The wishlist is pretty much complete...
Lugh Crow-Slave
#331 - 2016-04-01 13:40:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
Jane Hemah wrote:
also did any one look at the capital reppers? For the same amount of time shield reppers rep close to 40% more hp thn the armor reppers.


this is normal tho



and it is a sad day the unique niche role of the nid has been nerffed out q.q

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Lugh Crow-Slave
#332 - 2016-04-01 15:45:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
Lugh Crow-Slave
#333 - 2016-04-01 21:22:04 UTC
while i have my grips as to the flex armor hardener being better than the flex shield something needs to be done to the UI of both to denote them as flex hardeners during combat so you dont need to mouse over and see what hardener you can change

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Lugh Crow-Slave
#334 - 2016-04-02 17:10:00 UTC
Rek Seven wrote:
Seriously, wtf is happening with dreads? They some developer attention, not just "here are some new guns and an extra high and some new mods... enjoy!"

Can we at least get a dedicated thread of the upcoming features section?!


You mean like how they only fit slightly better than the FAX


And what happened to the phoenix's cap out takes most of it just to run a hardeners

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Miss 'Assassination' Cayman
CK-0FF
Intergalactic Space Hobos
#335 - 2016-04-03 03:52:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Miss 'Assassination' Cayman
It seems like none of the drone skills except Fighters actually have their advertised effects on fighters. Once that's fixed fighters will have roughly 50% more damage and speed, and 25% more durability at max skills.

And since somone would probably say they're not intended to affect fighters, they actually say in the descriptions that they affect fighters.
Orin Fatch
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#336 - 2016-04-03 08:36:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Orin Fatch
Has any one else found an issue specifically with the ‘Iron Pike’ Kinetic Lance it has no effects on NPC ships.
For my example in a blood raider hidden den, a full salvo in which the entire light from the beam engolfed about 15 - 20 nps, none of which were damaged at all.

Is this intended?

Edit, Also notice a possible issue with Rapid Torpedo Launcher II's and in General against NPC's in my experience. even tho the targets are 10 - 30km from me (torp range is 40 for me) not all salvos actually hit the target, They seem to disappear in thin air. These targets are also battleship size, and can be less then 10 km from my ship, and target painted.* Note * NO smart bombs are active ect. so roughly, in my test of 60 Scourge torps from my Rapid torp launcher II's, only about 60% of the missile actually hit their target (no damage notifications either) and all targets were within half of optimal range. its as if from my point of view, they literally disappeared from my screen. (think being destroyed via smartbombs/bombs, or out of range from target, which they definitely was not.)

Edit 2, although the targeted ships are within weapon range per my overview. With an alt i sat on top of the titan at 0, and it showed the target as being 50km from said interceptor, as apposed to the titan saying it was 32km, according to the titans overview it should have easily hit an NPS BS moving at 139/ms, but the inty being 50km away says otherwise.

Is this also possibly intended that the missile being fired from the center of the ship, actually doesn't have the flight distance as expected because of the size of the titan itself?
Lugh Crow-Slave
#337 - 2016-04-03 10:54:25 UTC
Miss 'Assassination' Cayman wrote:
It seems like none of the drone skills except Fighters actually have their advertised effects on fighters. Once that's fixed fighters will have roughly 50% more damage and speed, and 25% more durability at max skills.

And since somone would probably say they're not intended to affect fighters, they actually say in the descriptions that they affect fighters.


well....

that there might just be the issue

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
LittleBlackSheep
ISK Unlimited
#338 - 2016-04-04 13:06:20 UTC
Two things that should be adressed before release:

- when fighter are shooting a target, there is no symbol below that locked target that indicates which one is the current target for the fighters

- when you call back your fighters, they still keep shooting at their former target for quite some time, so you keep your aggression timer (very bad, if you want to immediately stop aggression and bite your nails to survive until you can dock/jump)
CCP Lebowski
C C P
C C P Alliance
#339 - 2016-04-04 14:00:52 UTC
Hey all,

This weekends update has brought enhanced fighter movement controls and a forum post with titan stats! The op has been updated, but ill quote the relevant parts here Big smile

CCP Lebowski wrote:
Giving movement orders to your Fighter squadrons

When you have one or more fighter squadrons selected in the fighter HUD (Note the selection functionality is not yet final), you can now give it/them a move order in one of the following ways:

  • Using the conventional right click menu or radial menu.
  • Using the selected item window
  • Using go to point navigation (default shortcut is M)

You can also now select your ship in the same way by clicking your ships HUD. This allows you to give orders to your ship and one or more fighter squadrons at the same time.

Spaceships!

Stats & Feedback threads:
Titans


As always we encourage you to go and check it out and do your very best to break it!

CCP Lebowski | EVE Quality Assurance | Team Five-0

@CCP_Lebowski

Lugh Crow-Slave
#340 - 2016-04-04 14:25:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
CCP Lebowski wrote:
Hey all,

This weekends update has brought enhanced fighter movement controls and a forum post with titan stats! The op has been updated, but ill quote the relevant parts here Big smile

CCP Lebowski wrote:
Giving movement orders to your Fighter squadrons

When you have one or more fighter squadrons selected in the fighter HUD (Note the selection functionality is not yet final), you can now give it/them a move order in one of the following ways:

  • Using the conventional right click menu or radial menu.
  • Using the selected item window
  • Using go to point navigation (default shortcut is M)

You can also now select your ship in the same way by clicking your ships HUD. This allows you to give orders to your ship and one or more fighter squadrons at the same time.

Spaceships!

Stats & Feedback threads:
Titans


As always we encourage you to go and check it out and do your very best to break it!


problem is you cant issue a command when related to your own ship

such as telling my fighteres to orbit me or keep me at range

also under the fighter showing me the speed and distance from me are two things i can already see very easily it would be much better to put their range from what ever they are targeting or their movement node its

PS: i also wish you would say something on the low sensor strength of fighters i can jam them out with a multi spec griffen with no rigs or SDAs (getting 5.3 and light fighters have only 5) so with a prop mod i can jam out an entire carrier +1 what is the point of the NSA boosting sensor strength if my fighters can just be jammed out. maybe give them 1.5X that of heavies putting them at around 33-34%

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble