Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Be polite. I opened this thread mainly for CCP.
The current model in my view is based on getting max $ from plex and subs from an ever decreasing number of players, and this does not help with new players, or with long term profits.
Well I said what I wanted. EVE does not require grinding it's true, but it requires either waiting - or (with skill injectors) paying for another character to grow. And beyond that, the new character requires another subscription. And alts are almost mandatory in the end game - at least a cyno alt. I am sure the EVE manual does not mention this: you need at least 2 subscriptions for the end game, else you are a "casual". End game being capital ships.

The basics of your idea have come up time and time again and my response now is the same as it has always been.

No, the current system works extremely well to balance the things in the game it was implemented to balance.

If the system bothers you so much that you need to post a terrible idea like this then my only question is why are you still paying to play a game you obviously do not like?

The idea bothers us because there is no logic in it. And you don't know what you're talking about.

- CCP make more money from players who plex than those who pay for their sub.
- there are so many alts in EVE that if you made them free, the lost revenue would eclipse any gain from new players. This idea is far from the lifesaving idea you think it is.

You're paying for a single training queue and login as part of an account. You get to chose what slot to use them and there is no restriction on the ability to switch which is active. Just because there are 3 slots doesn't inherently support the idea that you're paying for 3 training queues so the argument doesn't explicitly follow as stated.

It's like saying the reverse functionality on a motor vehicle is limited because it can't be used at the same time as drive.

Jump clone timers are the way they are to make you have consequences for your decision. You jump into your PvP clone, then proceed to blue ball the **** out of the enemy fleet? Well, go do some other form of PvP for the next day. Just jumped into your PvE clone when the ping goes out? Up to you whether to interceptor over to staging in your PvE clone or to sit this one out.

According to CCP's numbers, fully 2/3 of the playerbase only has one account, and a very large majority of the remaining 1/3 only has 2 accounts. People like me, with 4 accounts, are in the vast minority. Your supposition that you cannot play EvE with a single account is not supported by fact. The facts support just the opposite.

Suggest you try keeping up to date with the goings on in your coalition. Unless a lot has changed since I left a few months ago, the important stuff is usually announced well over 20 hours in advance over on the goon forums. Your lack of awareness as to the proper time to be jump cloning around is not the fault of CCP.

Technically you are correct. The idea is to make people work together by creating deficits in capabilities locked behind time gates. People like to bypass this obstacle however and create alts.

What's worse for the game?

There seems to be a theme that has been repeated in not only my posts but others: CCP is in this whole MMO business to make money.

Extra training requires plex, which costs more than your sub does. Skill transfers cost you plex, and gives diminishing returns.

I could add your idea to the bad idea thread, but add to it all the other bad ideas that go with it, such as mandatory training for all 3 characters per account, at 1/3rd the learning rate so you mush use injectors to get the "full" SP your traning currently enjoys, or use 2 plex to train all at full XP.

Increased skill multipliers based on plex per month. More plex, less multiplier.

I can go on all day, The gist is, take away money from CCP in one way, expect them to make the game more P2W in others. This is an idea worthy of torches, pitchforks and monument shooting in jita if implemented.

I disagree.

Unlocking the alt on a single account is no where near as detrimental to the system as multiple alt accounts.

A single player making a mining Op that null entities rarely organize, a single player farming WH systems, neutral alt scouts, neutral alt logi, and neutral alt fleet boosts.


I understand that the system has always performed this way, but the cause doesn't make the effect righteous.

However, as mentioned, paying $20 to train 2 toons on the same account is redundant when you can pay $15 to have another account entirely that serves more benefit.

Regardless of how the PLEX is attained, it's still worth $20...

Being able to train a second character, on a single account, at the same time, shouldn't cost more than $5.


However, as far as the person you are quoting, I don't think CCP ever had the intent of players maintaining using a single character, or even a single account.
CCP knew what they were doing when they set this game up the way they did.
In a game where you can successfully manage multiple toons at once, wouldn't it make sense Financially to only allow full utility of a single toon on an account at a time?
It seems as the system was built specifically so that players WOULD attain multiple accounts.
Not to compare, but in pretty much ever other MMO you can have multiple toons on a single account.
Sure, you can't grind XP on all the toons at once, but XP is the equivalent to ISK and not SP.

SP is relatively meaningless in Eve and everything revolves around your wallet.
Now, unlike other MMOs, Eve gives the player the ability to attain SP in a passive nature.
Locking us out of being able to perform this action with multiple toons on a single account unless a monetary exchange is made that is more costly than starting another account limits CCP's chance at financial gain.

There are players, like myself, that cannot afford multiple accounts.
My main toon is also dedicated to pvp with little isk gain, so the ability to retain a second account through PLEX, without first establishing that account with the means for isk attainment, is impossible.
This means that I operate on a single toon and a single account.

How is this bad for CCP bottom line?
Well, many times I have found myself bored of chasing Isk in Eve and have put the game away. With a toon from '08, I only have approx 65-70 mil SP when I should have significantly more.
If I would have had a second toon, on the same account, to fund a pure pvp toon, I likely wouldn't have un-subbed as I would have been more entertained/engaged with activities within Eve.

Basically, without multiple toons and multiple methods of play, players become bored of the game and either quit or take a long break WITHOUT PAYING.

If it were unlocked so that players could train on multiple toons at once, without having to pay, it would be better for the game not only on a monetary level for CCP, but in the case of this being a PVP focused sandbox in which we need more people who want to PVP. Having a second toon dedicated to PVP would have great effect.

Now, those that use multiple accounts would not be effected by such a change, as the use of multiple accounts provides much more opportunity to an individual, many of those opportunities being listed above.

I don't own stock in CCP

I'm not concerned about CCP finances.

But I don't like people being unreasonable and want free stuff for no good reason and dress it up as a proposal and try to justify their own undeserved selfish interest as something that is good for the community/player base/other subscribers/good for the game/good for CCP/whatever.

Objectively though, we are not in position to say 'they would do better with more players paying less', because we do not have financial data to base such statement on. But just think of any other industry - would Ferrari 'do better selling more cars cheaper'? Would McDonald 'do better selling more burgers for cheaper'?

Maybe yes, maybe no. These things involve very complicated and thorough data analysis and calculations and marketing strategies. In the above example, Ferrari have to consider and be wary of devaluing their own product by selling their cars cheaper. For McDonald, who sells millions of burgers per day around the world, decrease in the sale price vs. predicted increase in the sales volume calculation would require some serious market analysis on major scale.

Unless you believe you'd just phone Ferrari/McDonald HQ and tell them 'sell more cars/burgers for cheaper! You will make more money!' and expect them to take you seriously even for one second, don't expect CCP to do the same.

I've seen this too many times before. Just because the developers of games frequent forums and look for community feedback and such, it doesn't make a 'casual gamer' suddenly a must-listen-to business consultant for the company. Please respect the game developers like you would respect any other business operators. If you own and drive Ferrari and give feedback on your driving experience, I'm sure they may take a note. But don't expect you to make better business call in automotive industry than the manufacturers themselves.

-1.

As it will destroy role playing spirit of this game even further. It was already blown almost to non-existent with skill injectors (you do not build your char - you buy it, with name you like, skills you choose, clean history etc...) and there is no need to add split personalities to this.