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Replace sleeper blue loot with bountys

Author
Gustav Mannfred
Summer of Mumuit
Remember Mumuit
#1 - 2016-03-26 12:35:51 UTC
Due to the NPC station Tax change coming in the Citadel expansion, the amount of isk you get from selling blue loot drops drastically. its around 1% now, but later it will be 6-7%. The isk you get from a Core Garrison will drop from 250 mil to about 230 mil.

For example, a sleepless Upholder drops 9.3 mil isk worth of blue loot, with this change, the blue loot gets removed and a 9.3 mil isk bounty is placed on that NPC. With this in mind, it would also be great to place bountys on the sentrys, as they dont give anything.


With this change, the income in Wormholes still remains the same even with the NPC tax nerf

i'm REALY miss the old stuff. 

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=24183

Lyra Gerie
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2016-03-26 13:12:34 UTC
Or a less game breaking way would be to include maybe 1 or 2 extra pieces of blue loot. CCP won't make it easier to make isk off wormholes.
Iain Cariaba
#3 - 2016-03-26 14:58:16 UTC
Turning down the tap on one of the isk faucets is a good thing. Now they just need to apply that to the other major isk faucets.
Arya Regnar
Darwins Right Hand
#4 - 2016-03-26 15:29:31 UTC
OH HELL NO.

More safe ratting where the loot is automatically safe in your wallet?

I say remove all the bounties and make every kind of space like wormhole space instead...

EvE-Mail me if you need anything.

Lyra Gerie
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2016-03-26 15:52:38 UTC
Arya Regnar wrote:
OH HELL NO.

More safe ratting where the loot is automatically safe in your wallet?

I say remove all the bounties and make every kind of space like wormhole space instead...


I concur and suggest hijacking this thread for this idea instead of op's. The only place bounties make serious sense is in high sec, maybe low. These are legit territories that want bad individuals out via bounties. But what reach do they have to put bounties on those in null? Maybe to encourage attacks or something but they're just farmed.

Though now the big question is, what would replace them in a fair manner that also fits the game world and doesn't break anything else?
FT Diomedes
The Graduates
#6 - 2016-03-26 21:23:01 UTC
Arya Regnar wrote:
OH HELL NO.

More safe ratting where the loot is automatically safe in your wallet?

I say remove all the bounties and make every kind of space like wormhole space instead...


This. All bounties should be replaced with some sort of tags or blue loot.

CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.

elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#7 - 2016-03-26 22:58:45 UTC
Gustav Mannfred wrote:
Due to the NPC station Tax change coming in the Citadel expansion, the amount of isk you get from selling blue loot drops drastically. its around 1% now, but later it will be 6-7%. The isk you get from a Core Garrison will drop from 250 mil to about 230 mil.

For example, a sleepless Upholder drops 9.3 mil isk worth of blue loot, with this change, the blue loot gets removed and a 9.3 mil isk bounty is placed on that NPC. With this in mind, it would also be great to place bountys on the sentrys, as they dont give anything.


With this change, the income in Wormholes still remains the same even with the NPC tax nerf


You kinda didn't think this through. Citadel taxes have nothing to do with blue loot since you still have to go to highsec to sell it. There won't be any DED agents to sell them to in w-space.

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

Aura sound-clips: Aura forever

Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#8 - 2016-03-26 23:21:26 UTC
Arya Regnar wrote:
OH HELL NO.

More safe ratting where the loot is automatically safe in your wallet?

I say remove all the bounties and make every kind of space like wormhole space instead...


Yeah this.

If you dont like npc taxes, then sell at a Citadel.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Morrigan LeSante
Perkone
Caldari State
#9 - 2016-03-27 11:00:25 UTC
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Arya Regnar wrote:
OH HELL NO.

More safe ratting where the loot is automatically safe in your wallet?

I say remove all the bounties and make every kind of space like wormhole space instead...


Yeah this.

If you dont like npc taxes, then sell at a Citadel.



You know that this blue loot is sold to NPC buy orders, right........?
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#10 - 2016-03-27 17:53:06 UTC
Wow....look at all the free bankers in this thread. Awesome. George Selgin would be proud.

Quote:
In a free banking system, market forces control the supply of total quantity of banknotes and deposits that can be supported by any given stock of cash reserves, where such reserves consist either of a scarce commodity (such as gold) or of an artificially limited stock of "fiat" money issued by a central bank.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online

Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#11 - 2016-03-27 18:00:34 UTC
Morrigan LeSante wrote:
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Arya Regnar wrote:
OH HELL NO.

More safe ratting where the loot is automatically safe in your wallet?

I say remove all the bounties and make every kind of space like wormhole space instead...


Yeah this.

If you dont like npc taxes, then sell at a Citadel.



You know that this blue loot is sold to NPC buy orders, right........?



Yes, but the point, I think, is that it would make the growth in the money supply come with a bit more effort.

It would sort of be like how money in some countries was linked to gold. So that the money supply could only grow as the supply of gold grew. If the supply of gold could not grow or grow fast enough to keep up with the growth of real goods and services, you'd have deflation. Conversely a sudden discovery of gold would lead to an rapid increase in the money supply--i.e. inflation. The point being it would be out of the hands of the central bank.

In this case the ISK supply would depend on how much blue loot is discovered over time. And since you'd have to move it around you'd have more or less of it depending on events (e.g. a JF carrying a big load getting ganked) or some guy successfully moving a large cache to empire and selling it.

Hence my comment about free banking.

It's rather remarkable how raging free market people are in game, but out of game I wonder how many are raging socialists who would find such ideas perfectly horrible....even though it did work rather well for countries that tried it (e.g. Scotland apparently had quite a stable and innovative banking system).

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online

Morrigan LeSante
Perkone
Caldari State
#12 - 2016-03-27 18:03:27 UTC
Yeah, I just meant that the NPCs aren't about to up and move to a citadel, are they Smile

I suspect the whole WH income nerf was an accident/oversight/not discussed with these proposals.
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#13 - 2016-03-27 18:06:00 UTC
Morrigan LeSante wrote:
Yeah, I just meant that the NPCs aren't about to up and move to a citadel, are they Smile

I suspect the whole WH income nerf was an accident/oversight/not discussed with these proposals.


Ahhh, good point. People would likely still have to sell at an NPC station. You'd still be hit by the tax, not sure about the borker's fee in this instance...I'm guessing no.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online

Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#14 - 2016-03-27 18:11:28 UTC
Oh and just a warning to the inflation hawks here (which we apparently have alot of) if deflation gets to be too big it could be a problem. Deflation of say 10% means I am implicitly earning a 10% rate of return by keeping my ISK in my wallet. You could get a complete collapse in consumer spending as everyone sits around letting the purchasing power of their ISK grow.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online

Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#15 - 2016-03-27 22:00:04 UTC
I was thinking its just more fun to have people hauling their wealth around like it is in WH's

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Lugh Crow-Slave
#16 - 2016-03-27 22:04:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
..... there is no tax when you sell to a buy order sooooo


In other words the npc placing the but order pays the tax not the player selling to the npc
Lyra Gerie
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2016-03-28 04:50:04 UTC
Daichi Yamato wrote:
I was thinking its just more fun to have people hauling their wealth around like it is in WH's


This is the most important idea here. The fact that wealth initially isn't just a value but an asset means it can lead to conflict. For instance there could be bounty tags or some sort of identifier that drops from rats that you have to turn in to get a bounty but only in low or high sec. This means this asset has to be hauled before it's isk. The more things like this the better, plus it helps further differentiate between low and null.
Morrigan LeSante
Perkone
Caldari State
#18 - 2016-03-28 07:02:46 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
..... there is no tax when you sell to a buy order sooooo


In other words the npc placing the but order pays the tax not the player selling to the npc



Are you not mixing up brokers fees? I'm 99% sure the seller pays taxes regardless of if it is an immediate order or not.
Asuka Solo
I N E X T R E M I S
Tactical Narcotics Team
#19 - 2016-03-28 08:08:22 UTC
Why should you be allowed to have a loot mechanic change that will directly improve your ability to live in a wormhole for the more longer term?

Eve is about Capital ships, WiS, Boobs, PI and Isk!

Morrigan LeSante
Perkone
Caldari State
#20 - 2016-03-28 08:48:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Morrigan LeSante
Asuka Solo wrote:
Why should you be allowed to have a loot mechanic change that will directly improve your ability to live in a wormhole for the more longer term?


I think the crux of the question here is why should WH income be nerfed because they are forced to use NPC buy orders which will rather obviously not migrate to citadels?

It is impossible for these guys to use what CCP want, they have no way of avoiding the sticks of the NPC taxes.

How would null react if an inescapable NPC tax was slapped on their bounties? Because that's the equivalent here.

Ed: In fact as rightly corrected by Kenneth Feld, this WILL also affect ratters via overseer effects sooooo yeah....
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