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C2 solo Myrmidon fit. Feedback requested.
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Ligraph
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2016-03-24 01:54:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Ligraph
Goal is a relatively cheap fit that can solo C2 Anomalies.

Questions:
Would it work?
Is there something much better?
Anything obvious I missed?
What is the general consensus "best' c2 fit?
What can I do to make it better?


How much sig/speed tank does the AB add (I know I can't get an exact number, will do testing on SiSi when I get the skills)?
Enough to get rid of one of the shield mods?
Or should I get rid of the AB?

What are the best drones to use? I kind of dislike sentries, but taking H, M, and S is a pain.

Is there a similar fit that is easier to skill into (like a lot)?


What would I need for c3s? Battleship? I know t3 cruisers work, but that's expensive and skill intensive.

[Myrmidon, Myrmidon WHer]

Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Medium Armor Repairer II
Medium Armor Repairer II
Drone Damage Amplifier I
Drone Damage Amplifier I

Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
100MN Y-S8 Compact Afterburner
X5 Enduring Stasis Webifier

Shadow Serpentis Dual 150mm Railgun, Thorium Charge M
Shadow Serpentis Dual 150mm Railgun, Thorium Charge M
Shadow Serpentis Dual 150mm Railgun, Thorium Charge M
Medium Knave Scoped Energy Nosferatu
Medium Knave Scoped Energy Nosferatu

Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I


Federation Navy Ogre x4
Republic Fleet Bouncer x4


Thorium Charge M x30000
ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#2 - 2016-03-24 02:58:11 UTC
Just some quick notes:

Omni tank does not mean only fit resist mods with resists for all damage types it means evening out your resists across the board. So for example if you have a 50% EM resist and 0% explosive resist you probably want to put an explosive resist mod in. EFT can help you figure out if you want to go with your next lowest damage type or a adaptive from there.

If you plan on using sentries and speed tanking you'll likely want to fit some remote reppers for repping the sentries and letting them tank some of the damage.

As far as the oversized AB with dual local reppers goes you are probably going to want to do one or the other. You are either tanking most of the damage and thus need / want dual reppers or you plan on avoiding most of the damage and thus don't need both.

The rails probably won't hit too well if you are moving really fast.

In order for the Nos to work you will need to keep one of the close up NPCs alive to suck cap from and make sure you stay within range.

I usually like to have at least one tracking mod whenever I am using turrets and that includes drone tracking mods for when drones are my primary damage.

Want to talk? Join Cara's channel in game: House Forelli
Ligraph
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2016-03-24 04:05:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Ligraph
ergherhdfgh wrote:
Just some quick notes:


Omni tank does not mean only fit resist mods with resists for all damage types it means evening out your resists across the board. So for example if you have a 50% EM resist and 0% explosive resist you probably want to put an explosive resist mod in. EFT can help you figure out if you want to go with your next lowest damage type or a adaptive from there.


I tried that in Pyfa. I have a better tank with 2 adaptives.

ergherhdfgh wrote:

If you plan on using sentries and speed tanking you'll likely want to fit some remote reppers for repping the sentries and letting them tank some of the damage.


Probably. At this point I have no idea what type of drone I should be using.

ergherhdfgh wrote:

As far as the oversized AB with dual local reppers goes you are probably going to want to do one or the other. You are either tanking most of the damage and thus need / want dual reppers or you plan on avoiding most of the damage and thus don't need both.


How much damage will I avoid? That was the plan, I just don't know how much damage the speed tank mitigates. Probably going to have to do testing on SiSi.

ergherhdfgh wrote:

The rails probably won't hit too well if you are moving really fast.

In order for the Nos to work you will need to keep one of the close up NPCs alive to suck cap from and make sure you stay within range.

I usually like to have at least one tracking mod whenever I am using turrets and that includes drone tracking mods for when drones are my primary damage.


That's a good point about the tracking, I totally forgot about it. If I can use either dual reps (x)or speed tanking, that will leave room for the trackers.

That was my plan with the Nos.


Biggest thing now is I need to know which drone type to use, as well as whether I should go dual reps or single rep and AB. That will determine everything else.
ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2016-03-24 23:59:20 UTC
Ligraph wrote:


How much damage will I avoid? That was the plan, I just don't know how much damage the speed tank mitigates. Probably going to have to do testing on SiSi.

That is probably the best way to learn. Especially if you are playing around with different fits and tactics and not trying to get the site done.

I would recommend using that time to exaggerate things to get a feel for various aspects. Meaning don't look for the perfect fit so much as use fits that exaggerate various aspects to see how that effects things. More than teach you how to run C2s in a myrm it will teach you how to better fit an fly in various situations.

Want to talk? Join Cara's channel in game: House Forelli
Paranoid Loyd
#5 - 2016-03-25 00:09:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Paranoid Loyd
You can test it in a C1, if you can do those no problem then a C2 should be doable. On paper it looks like it should work as long as you are mitigating some damage by keeping your transversal high. This may also help.

If you plan on getting close enough to use the NOS, you might consider switching to blasters.

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Ligraph
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2016-03-25 01:17:16 UTC
ergherhdfgh wrote:
Ligraph wrote:


How much damage will I avoid? That was the plan, I just don't know how much damage the speed tank mitigates. Probably going to have to do testing on SiSi.

That is probably the best way to learn. Especially if you are playing around with different fits and tactics and not trying to get the site done.

I would recommend using that time to exaggerate things to get a feel for various aspects. Meaning don't look for the perfect fit so much as use fits that exaggerate various aspects to see how that effects things. More than teach you how to run C2s in a myrm it will teach you how to better fit an fly in various situations.


Is there an easy way to get skills on SiSi? I used the free injectors to skill into carriers so I could test stuff...
Ligraph
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2016-03-25 01:18:44 UTC
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
You can test it in a C1, if you can do those no problem then a C2 should be doable. On paper it looks like it should work as long as you are mitigating some damage by keeping your transversal high. This may also help.

If you plan on getting close enough to use the NOS, you might consider switching to blasters.


I would but it overloads my power core and does less dps (although it probably has better tracking).
Wombat65Au Egdald
R I S E
#8 - 2016-03-25 02:25:46 UTC
Ligraph wrote:

ergherhdfgh wrote:

If you plan on using sentries and speed tanking you'll likely want to fit some remote reppers for repping the sentries and letting them tank some of the damage.


Probably. At this point I have no idea what type of drone I should be using..


The various drones don't just do different types of damage, they also have other differences in their details.
This E-Uni page covers those differences far better than I could in a forum post.
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Drones

A couple of tables in that page are incomplete.
Cara Forelli
State War Academy
Caldari State
#9 - 2016-03-27 15:04:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Cara Forelli
The blingy guns aren't necessary. If you can't use t2, just stick with meta. Keep in mind your goal is to run enough sites to pay off your ship before someone catches and kills you in it.

Aside from that, the tank looks fine. I would bring flights of light/medium drones though as C2s are mainly small ships (frigs/cruisers). Heavies/sentries will have trouble tracking, and will also be shot at by the smaller sleepers which is very annoying. Damage type doesn't matter much since sleepers have omni-tanks, so just stick with high damage drones unless you're having tracking issues.

As for C3s, I've found T3s to be the easiest because they don't need to tank as much with their smaller sigs, but they can be done in some battleships. Rattlesnakes are popular because they can fit a large neut-resistant tank. Keep in mind, for any class hole, the relic/data sites will be much tougher than the anomalies (the data/relic sites in a C3 for example will neut out a battleship pretty quickly while applying full dps, upward of 1000).

Want to talk? Join my channel in game: House Forelli

Titan's Lament
Ligraph
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2016-03-27 18:12:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Ligraph
Cara Forelli wrote:
The blingy guns aren't necessary. If you can't use t2, just stick with meta. Keep in mind your goal is to run enough sites to pay off your ship before someone catches and kills you in it.

Aside from that, the tank looks fine. I would bring flights of light/medium drones though as C2s are mainly small ships (frigs/cruisers). Heavies/sentries will have trouble tracking, and will also be shot at by the smaller sleepers which is very annoying. Damage type doesn't matter much since sleepers have omni-tanks, so just stick with high damage drones unless you're having tracking issues.

As for C3s, I've found T3s to be the easiest because they don't need to tank as much with their smaller sigs, but they can be done in some battleships. Rattlesnakes are popular because they can fit a large neut-resistant tank. Keep in mind, for any class hole, the relic/data sites will be much tougher than the anomalies (the data/relic sites in a C3 for example will neut out a battleship pretty quickly while applying full dps, upward of 1000).


Ok. I've been running c1 sites in a Cyclone and noticing my drones are dying a lot, thinking about using a Maelstrom for c2s and c3s if I can.

EDIT: Cyclone nor Claymore :(

I would use a t3 but I'm 100+ days away from it.

Would it be worth it to fit a RReper for the drones?

And should I use RLM or HAMs for the c1 sites (and c2 and c3s)? My HAMs seem to have a lot of damage mitigated. Actually thinking about bringing both and switching on the fly.

EDIT: Also, should I be using a web or painter?
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#11 - 2016-03-27 19:51:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Ralph King-Griffin
Nice to see you with a reasonable thread in an appropriate sub .

I'm no wormholer but I'm familiar with that fit, or something closely resembling it.
One of my alts flys an eos with a broadly similar fit,
dual rep with a 100mn fit, it works alright enough for most level 4 missions (though I don't know how the sleepers would treat it).

As mentioned , omni tanking here would consist of plugging the gaping explosive hole gallente ships tend to have and evening out your resists as well as you can.

You like blingy shiny ships , I get that I truly do,
I love em too but I wouldn't hang faction guns on a t1 hull with that much compramise going on, the thought gives me the willies.

Looking at that fit I think your fitting skills probably need some looking at, not saying it won't work (well it wount if you leave the resist hole) but Theres far to much compromise there for my liking.

I do like the way you are thinking though, the hulls Biger brother (the eos) can pull this off and be simultaneously really scary for other players and boss for pve (which isn't something a whole lot of ships can say)
with the added bonus of having crazy good resists so hanging shiny mods on it actuall makes sense.

Anyway, nice to see you have tempered your aspirations with something resembling reason.


Edit: both would work, you getter range from the painter and drones love it but given the choice I would go with the web,
better for pvp IMO.

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2016-03-27 20:17:59 UTC
I have not lived in wormholes in years and there have been many changes to both sleeper AI and ships since then.

However with my dated experience I can say that drones can be a problem with sleepers. You almost certainly need a way to repair drones in wormholes as docking and repairing them in station is not an option.

Another thing to think about is managing aggro with drones. Try and keep it off of your drones. remote repping and Ewar are two tools to help with that. Things like repping your drones not only reparis your drones but it makes the sleepers "angrier" at you. Same thing with things like target painters, it helps you track better and do more damage but also pisses off the sleepers more which is good if you are trying to keep aggro off of your drones.

When I lived in wormholes I had tried a Maelstrom at one point. It was very hard to track small fast moving sleeper ships with the large guns. However that was before the MJD existed so maybe you can make it work. Just jump out far enough that they are headed strait towards you and use a TP to blow up their sig radius.

One thing that I have noticed with AI is that it is much easier to manage drone aggro when you have multiple player ships involved. I often will run two clients to run anoms in my domi. Not because it makes me more isk because it does not. My bounty ticks are nearly half on both characters of what they are on one when I run them with just one account. I run two characters because the aggro bounces back and forth between my two player ships and mostly stays off of my drones.

Most things in Eve are better with friends and wormholes are no exception. Ideally you want to get a group together and find multiple sites and just run them all.

Want to talk? Join Cara's channel in game: House Forelli
Ligraph
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2016-03-27 21:42:33 UTC
ergherhdfgh wrote:
I have not lived in wormholes in years and there have been many changes to both sleeper AI and ships since then.

However with my dated experience I can say that drones can be a problem with sleepers. You almost certainly need a way to repair drones in wormholes as docking and repairing them in station is not an option.

Another thing to think about is managing aggro with drones. Try and keep it off of your drones. remote repping and Ewar are two tools to help with that. Things like repping your drones not only reparis your drones but it makes the sleepers "angrier" at you. Same thing with things like target painters, it helps you track better and do more damage but also pisses off the sleepers more which is good if you are trying to keep aggro off of your drones.

When I lived in wormholes I had tried a Maelstrom at one point. It was very hard to track small fast moving sleeper ships with the large guns. However that was before the MJD existed so maybe you can make it work. Just jump out far enough that they are headed strait towards you and use a TP to blow up their sig radius.

One thing that I have noticed with AI is that it is much easier to manage drone aggro when you have multiple player ships involved. I often will run two clients to run anoms in my domi. Not because it makes me more isk because it does not. My bounty ticks are nearly half on both characters of what they are on one when I run them with just one account. I run two characters because the aggro bounces back and forth between my two player ships and mostly stays off of my drones.

Most things in Eve are better with friends and wormholes are no exception. Ideally you want to get a group together and find multiple sites and just run them all.


Having trouble fitting a shield tank, mjd, and painter. Going to start a new thread for the Maelstrom.
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#14 - 2016-03-27 21:57:58 UTC
No need for a new thread, we can have that discussion here.

As I said in my other post , your fitting skills are tripping you up here, stuff in the engineering and gunnery tabs on your skill sheet will help you out here.

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
Ligraph
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2016-03-27 22:40:50 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
No need for a new thread, we can have that discussion here.

As I said in my other post , your fitting skills are tripping you up here, stuff in the engineering and gunnery tabs on your skill sheet will help you out here.


I've been training that. But the fit was made with full fitting skills in PYFA.
Ligraph
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2016-03-27 22:42:11 UTC
And for the Maelstrom:

Questions:
I want to fit a MJD and Painter for frig killing. That gives me tank slot problems though.

Should I use Artillery? Especially if I can fit a MJD.

RReper for drones? Gives me major cap problems though.

Sentry drones?

Fit:
[Maelstrom, Maelstrom Wher]

Capacitor Flux Coil II
Capacitor Flux Coil II
Capacitor Flux Coil II
Gyrostabilizer II
Gyrostabilizer II

Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Shield Boost Amplifier II
Shield Boost Amplifier II
Domination X-Large Shield Booster
X5 Enduring Stasis Webifier

Dual 650mm 'Scout' Repeating Cannon I, Titanium Sabot L
Dual 650mm 'Scout' Repeating Cannon I, Titanium Sabot L
Dual 650mm 'Scout' Repeating Cannon I, Titanium Sabot L
Dual 650mm 'Scout' Repeating Cannon I, Titanium Sabot L
Dual 650mm 'Scout' Repeating Cannon I, Titanium Sabot L
Dual 650mm 'Scout' Repeating Cannon I, Titanium Sabot L
Dual 650mm 'Scout' Repeating Cannon I, Titanium Sabot L
Dual 650mm 'Scout' Repeating Cannon I, Titanium Sabot L

Large Capacitor Control Circuit II
Large Capacitor Control Circuit II
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I


Praetor II x3
Acolyte II x2
Acolyte II x3


Infiltrator II x5


Which I also put in a new thread.
Iria Ahrens
Space Perverts and Forum Pirates
#17 - 2016-03-28 01:31:36 UTC
My main problem here is the concept of using a BS in a WH. Your ships will be getting a lot of surprise PVP in wh. I just don't think a pve fit BS in a WH is a good idea. This is based on my WH experience, but like ergh, I've not lived in a WH for a while, but I still think the concept of cheaper=better applies.

Isn't this thread based on C2? A BS for C2 seems a bit out of place. T3 dessy seems better.

My choice of pronouns is based on your avatar. Even if I know what is behind the avatar.
Ligraph
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2016-03-28 01:43:58 UTC
Iria Ahrens wrote:
My main problem here is the concept of using a BS in a WH. Your ships will be getting a lot of surprise PVP in wh. I just don't think a pve fit BS in a WH is a good idea. This is based on my WH experience, but like ergh, I've not lived in a WH for a while, but I still think the concept of cheaper=better applies.

Isn't this thread based on C2? A BS for C2 seems a bit out of place. T3 dessy seems better.


The thread was/is, the BS was for C3s. I'm using it cause its much easier to skill into than a T3, and just about the same cost.