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Snowballing LP gains ruin FW for the losing side.
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Pator Noster
Doomheim
#1 - 2016-03-17 19:33:39 UTC
I've just got a whooping reward of 7.125 LPs from deplexing Large Plex in Todifrauan, 63%-contested system (in the time of writing).
Minmatar faction is currently in distressing defense, being marginalized at 15,7% zone control, T1.
Back when it was sitting at almost T4, I used to gain around 30.000 LPs from Large Plexes in ~50%-contested systems.
This clearly indicates that the better the faction does, the higher rewards its followers can gain.
This in turn provokes people from losing faction to switch sides, because winning side provides better rewards.
From deplexing, invading enemy plexes as well as from missioning.
This is called a snowball effect and should NEVER exist in any tug of war activity.

I'd suggest making LP gains the smaller, the more influence the winning faction acquires and increase them for the losing faction to encourage pilots to defend it.

Until CCP fixes this, I'm not gonna participate in any kind of factional warfare.
Oreb Wing
Last Rites.
#2 - 2016-03-17 19:50:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Oreb Wing
Don't be a ninny. When it hits the fan you have to turn offensive and be aggressive with systems that are undefended and upgraded. Why the Minnie spirit always breaking under pressure?

You waste your time defensive plexing. Camp the mission lanes. Bring down their tier and make LP while you're at it.
Pator Noster
Doomheim
#3 - 2016-03-17 20:11:58 UTC
Why waste time and effort while I can just switch to Amarr militia and earn more LP?

...see? Exactly that's why I think the system's broken.
Oreb Wing
Last Rites.
#4 - 2016-03-17 20:14:25 UTC
I think you allowed the monster to roll itself to this point.
Pator Noster
Doomheim
#5 - 2016-03-17 20:20:17 UTC
I'm only one person and there is over a thousand folks on each side of the conflict. Only a fraction of them sticks to one team. Whole rest prefers to calculate income and loss. Ans that's the reason behind my way of thinking. I'd rather quit than switch sides.
Paranoid Loyd
#6 - 2016-03-17 20:24:41 UTC
It's human nature, deal with it. It does no good to whine about it.

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#7 - 2016-03-17 20:27:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Crosi Wesdo
Pator Noster wrote:
Why waste time and effort while I can just switch to Amarr militia and earn more LP?

...see? Exactly that's why I think the system's broken.


Why dont you? Thats what amarr always do when their back is against the wall. That worked out well for them over the last several years where they have been in the gutter for the most of it.

You are facing a more active, and more determined foe for the time being.

Dont fret, you will earn less LP, but your LP will be worth more. While you may lose out overall, if the only reason you do anything in militia is to make isk then im afraid minmatar militia is going to be a slightly rougher place for you in the meantime.

Please also understand, that even at tier 1, once the ISK/LP has settled, the ISK/hr will still be pretty decent in comparison to other entry level income.

Pator Noster wrote:
I'm only one person and there is over a thousand folks on each side of the conflict. Only a fraction of them sticks to one team. Whole rest prefers to calculate income and loss. Ans that's the reason behind my way of thinking. I'd rather quit than switch sides.


Then ride it out. Do what you can. Dont complain about isk. Try to recognize how to make their efforts fall short or minimize their progress in any way you can. You cannot make the difference alone. But if you are loyal to your faction i doubt you are alone.
Pator Noster
Doomheim
#8 - 2016-03-17 20:41:29 UTC
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
Then ride it out. Do what you can. Dont complain about isk. Try to recognize how to make their efforts fall short or minimize their progress in any way you can. You cannot make the difference alone. But if you are loyal to your faction i doubt you are alone.


It's hard to be loyal when you're being ignored in the militia channel, asking for fleets, reporting enemy activity and being alone in the most contested system while 9 WTs are capturing it... while everyone else just posts their KMs in the channel...
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#9 - 2016-03-17 21:01:17 UTC
That would be hard.

Build, dont blame.

Hardest part of eve is clicking the 'form fleet' button.

I personally hate doing it, but i do it before posting about bad mechanics on the forum.
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#10 - 2016-03-17 23:23:58 UTC  |  Edited by: X Gallentius
Pator Noster wrote:
It's hard to be loyal when you're being ignored in the militia channel, asking for fleets, reporting enemy activity and being alone in the most contested system while 9 WTs are capturing it... while everyone else just posts their KMs in the channel...
Didn't you get anything out of Captain America: Winter Soldier?

Steve Rogers: ...If you launch those helicarriers today, HYDRA will be able to kill anyone that stands in their way. Unless we stop them. I know I'm asking a lot. But the price of freedom is high. It always has been. And it's a price I'm willing to pay. And if I'm the only one, then so be it. But I'm willing to bet I'm not.

Cap "gets it." He puts his faction first, and he's willing to go it alone. That's why others follow him. Not the other way around.
Yang Aurilen
State War Academy
Caldari State
#11 - 2016-03-18 00:23:47 UTC
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
That would be hard.

Build, dont blame.

Hardest part of eve is clicking the 'form fleet' button.

I personally hate doing it, but i do it before posting about bad mechanics on the forum.


You must be in soul crushing agony every time you fleet up with your links boat huh?Sad

Post with your NPC alt main and not your main main alt!
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#12 - 2016-03-18 01:17:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Crosi Wesdo
Yang Aurilen wrote:
Crosi Wesdo wrote:
That would be hard.

Build, dont blame.

Hardest part of eve is clicking the 'form fleet' button.

I personally hate doing it, but i do it before posting about bad mechanics on the forum.


You must be in soul crushing agony every time you fleet up with your links boat huh?Sad


Yeah, because once im in fleet with my alt im pretty much immortal

Im sorry if a fleet of 20 dudes was still vulnerable to a very narrow edge case. Therefor game broken?
ARES-DESIDERATUS
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2016-03-18 01:56:31 UTC
Did you just imply that links aren't broken because they only allow you to sometimes take on 20-dude fleets?

Don't like my post.
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#14 - 2016-03-18 02:56:21 UTC
Did i kill any of those dudes with 5 t2 RR ships of their own and probable links too?
Rovain Sess
Wu Fanged
#15 - 2016-03-18 03:09:20 UTC
Funny, where was this concern when the Amarr where down 2 four systems. You complain when the tide has turned - deal with it. Complaints when loosing are slow whines and not deserving of consideration. The mechanic is what it is - so earn back the WZ or take ur loosing cycle for what it is - a cycle that will pass in time.
Arla Sarain
#16 - 2016-03-18 12:02:40 UTC
Pator Noster wrote:
I've just got a whooping reward of 7.125 LPs from deplexing Large Plex in Todifrauan, 63%-contested system (in the time of writing).
Minmatar faction is currently in distressing defense, being marginalized at 15,7% zone control, T1.
Back when it was sitting at almost T4, I used to gain around 30.000 LPs from Large Plexes in ~50%-contested systems.
This clearly indicates that the better the faction does, the higher rewards its followers can gain.
This in turn provokes people from losing faction to switch sides, because winning side provides better rewards.
From deplexing, invading enemy plexes as well as from missioning.
This is called a snowball effect and should NEVER exist in any tug of war activity.

I'd suggest making LP gains the smaller, the more influence the winning faction acquires and increase them for the losing faction to encourage pilots to defend it.

Until CCP fixes this, I'm not gonna participate in any kind of factional warfare.

At high Tiers you run out of defensive plexes to run, particularly when you occupy a large part of WZ and most of your systems are close to stable.
The high LP modifier becomes trivial for running plexs and you get forced to run missions.
The people that were "provoked to switch sides" switch sides again - there is little opposition for them to start offensive plexing against the winning side and the LP is worth more due to the strained market supply.

Also, once the items on the market stabilize your LP is rarely worth as much as the modifier states. State Pro LP in T2 was only worth about 30%-50% (at most 50%) than in T1, because despite the double LP gain the ISK/LP value dropped to about 1000-1500
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
#17 - 2016-03-18 15:47:52 UTC
So, you want the losing side to get paid more than the winning side? ......
Pretty sure that's NOT a good gaming strategy.
Nameira Vanis-Tor
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#18 - 2016-03-18 16:04:27 UTC
My poor Min Mil friends Sad

Free strategic advice:

1) Attack the Amarr Mils tier. Farmers rarely invest their LP into I-Hubs. If you keep sabotaging the upgraded systems then you will increase tension within Amarr Mil as their core militia will feel frustrated for having to 'carry' the farmers.

2) Keep attacking Amarr Mils tier! Eventually the LP value for Amarr Mil will crash and the farmers will start to fall silent.

3) Prioritise the defense of systems with occupants. It is harder for the enemy militia to contest systems that have neutrals living in them. These neutrals will hunt the enemy militia for easy content. From your perspective treat this as a D-Plexing force multiplier. It is much easier to D-Plex a pirate occupied system than to o-plex it. Likewise when the pendulum swings again you don't want to attack these systems either, so better not to lose them.

4) Become rich - all that LP you got from your high tier escapades? Well it's going to increase in value.

Other tips are available on request.
Silverbackyererse
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#19 - 2016-03-18 23:16:30 UTC
Pator Noster wrote:

Until CCP fixes this, I'm not gonna participate in any kind of factional warfare.



Can I has your warp core stabilisers? Lol
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#20 - 2016-03-19 19:32:44 UTC
Silverbackyererse wrote:
Pator Noster wrote:

Until CCP fixes this, I'm not gonna participate in any kind of factional warfare.
Can I has your warp core stabilisers? Lol

Don't you have enough Caldari Navy Warp Core Stabilizers from turning in all your State Protectorate LP?
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