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Expansion dedicated to UI

Author
Miss Whippy
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2012-01-11 14:29:39 UTC
I don't know what the general concensus is on the UI, but my personal opinion is that the UI is

1. A Click fest.
2. Hard to easily use on a high resolution screen.
3. Highly unintuative in places.
4. Buggy as hell.
5. A window fest.
6. Slow to navigate.
7. Almost completely uncustomisable.

There are millions of individual examples, too many to name. So anyway, I was wondering who would be prepared to sacrifice an ENTIRE expansion (assuming that would be necessary), to making the UI the exact opposite of the above list. I'm talking a total revamp.

The goal would be:

1. To reduce clickage as much as possible.
2. Make it much easier to navigate through.
3. Make it considerably quicker to navigate through.
4. Make it bug free.
5. Design it in such a way that future expansions can easily be added to the existing UI rather then cobbled on.
6. Allow a sensible degree of customisation.

There are millions of ways this could be done, and CCP you'd do very well to work closely with your player-base on this one. Hire an Expert in UIs - I hear they do exist.

I for one would like to see custom buttons for regular actions. Such as 'Dock Boundless Creation Hek Planet IV,' 'target nearest ship/asteroid', etc.

Oh, and still waiting on that slider for Scanner range. This would add a whole new level of usefulness to the scanner. As I said though, there's millions of ways the UI could be improved. That says to me that it needs to be done from scratch.

Cue polarised views.

[URL="https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=82348"]UI Iteration isn't enough, we need to start from scratch[/URL]

Akrasjel Lanate
Immemorial Coalescence Administration
Immemorial Coalescence
#2 - 2012-01-11 14:52:20 UTC
No

CEO of Lanate Industries

Citizen of Solitude

Callic Veratar
#3 - 2012-01-11 14:57:00 UTC
Expansion dedicated to [single feature] should never happen ever again, lest we get another Incarna.

Did not read OP.
Miss Whippy
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#4 - 2012-01-11 15:06:00 UTC
Callic Veratar wrote:
Expansion dedicated to [single feature] should never happen ever again, lest we get another Incarna.

Did not read OP.


The UI covers hundreds of features. Are you stupid?

[URL="https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=82348"]UI Iteration isn't enough, we need to start from scratch[/URL]

Cyniac
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2012-01-11 15:11:09 UTC
Dear Miss Whippy.

I am glad that you have discovered the joys of the UI - it is working as intended, that is to say a kind of mental flagellation designed to slowly frustrate you in ways that you never thought possible. Naturally it gets tweaked now and then, just because it can be but ultimately it is a way of culling the weak from the strong. Only those with a strong enough mindset (and resistant to carpal tunnel syndrome) will survive the continual whittling of their will to be in EVE through the UI. This makes for a rougher tougher world, and we kinda like it that way, it's a great selling point.

If things are not yet clear now Miss Whippy, please go out there and invent and manufacture 2000 assault frigates in preparation for the upcoming changes and go out to the great wildlands to scan all planets and survey all moons to determine which would be the optimal location for operations of universal domination.

Hurry back now.


Cyniac.
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2012-01-11 15:13:07 UTC
why call it expansion , why not just an "patch" Big smile
Ursula LeGuinn
Perkone
Caldari State
#7 - 2012-01-11 15:17:25 UTC
I certainly wouldn't be unhappy to see an entire expansion dedicated to UI improvements.

No single expansion in recent memory has been so mind-blowing that I couldn't wait an extra iteration for it.

"The EVE forums are intended to provide a warm, friendly atmosphere for the EVE community." — EVElopedia

Miss Whippy
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#8 - 2012-01-11 15:18:47 UTC
Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:
why call it expansion , why not just an "patch" Big smile


Because the work involved would be immense, and because you can't patch onto something when you're starting from scratch.

[URL="https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=82348"]UI Iteration isn't enough, we need to start from scratch[/URL]

Krios Ahzek
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2012-01-11 15:20:30 UTC
Akrasjel Lanate wrote:
No

Callic Veratar wrote:
Expansion dedicated to [single feature] should never happen ever again, lest we get another Incarna.

Did not read OP.


Idiots trying to be edgy

 Though All Men Do Despise Us

Valei Khurelem
#10 - 2012-01-11 15:27:18 UTC
Akrasjel Lanate wrote:
No


Go **** yourself

Anyone who'd disagree with the idea of at least making it so that the UI works better never mind being simple or more customisable is a moron.

"don't get us wrong, we don't want to screw new players, on the contrary. The core problem here is that tech 1 frigates and cruisers should be appealing enough to be viable platforms in both PvE and PvP."   - CCP Ytterbium

Xuko Nuki
Heralds of Darkness
White Sky.
#11 - 2012-01-11 15:29:05 UTC
Yes, more expansions about minutia please Roll.
Koby Botick
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#12 - 2012-01-11 15:30:07 UTC
I'm all for a complete overhaul of the UI (and by overhaul I mean throw it away and start fresh, not try to patch up that mess that it is). However to make that the sole and only topic of an expansion is way too much.

Besides it makes no sense. A 3D model designer does not really have much to contribute to the UI, neither do economic experts or server/netcode programmers.

I said it in https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=290191#post290191 and I will say it again: I am convinced that the UI alone is one of the most important factors why EVE Online is not newbie friendly and will never get somewhere near mass appeal. Those of us who play or used to play have arranged themselves with the UI, but still it remains one of the worst parts of this game. It lags, is inconsistent, moves stuff you are about to click away from under your mouse cursor (overview targetting an entry that just gets broadcasted, etc.) either hides important information or spams your screen full with too much information (hello enemy only/ overview displayed brackets only?) - I could go on for ages.

It seriously baffles my mind why in all these years they could not hire a small team that has expertise in interface design. It is a very well known fact in software engineering that pure software engineers/programmers are goddamn awful at this and design UIs for people with academic degrees and not for end users. (The EVE Ui fails even at that though)

Anyway - get rid of this UI: aye. An entire expansion only for that? Nay.
Mirime Nolwe
Mantra of Pain
#13 - 2012-01-11 15:32:42 UTC
Good intention, stupid idea. Improving UI should never be a single feature in any expansion.
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2012-01-11 15:33:26 UTC
Miss Whippy wrote:
Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:
why call it expansion , why not just an "patch" Big smile


Because the work involved would be immense, and because you can't patch onto something when you're starting from scratch.


fair enough .
Roscada
We love Egg
#15 - 2012-01-11 15:47:21 UTC
I'd rather just see the UI opened up to user-side modding, but that requires a lot of policing on CCP's part to ensure that it isn't used to automate the game so I doubt it'll happen. Dare to dream.
Miss Whippy
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#16 - 2012-01-11 15:50:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Miss Whippy
Mirime Nolwe wrote:
Good intention, stupid idea. Improving UI should never be a single feature in any expansion.


Why, because you want another E-Peen Expansion? OK, it won't be for an entire expansion, we'll make a supperwtfipwnyou ship, just to keep you happy.

[URL="https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=82348"]UI Iteration isn't enough, we need to start from scratch[/URL]

Velicitia
XS Tech
#17 - 2012-01-11 15:54:50 UTC
new UI on SISI is nice tho...

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia

Jafit McJafitson
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#18 - 2012-01-11 16:07:12 UTC
I'll be happy with any UI improvements, I don't care if it comes in an expansion or whatever, just do it.
Oberine Noriepa
#19 - 2012-01-11 17:40:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Oberine Noriepa
I don't think an expansion should be dedicated to a single feature. You don't need 200+ people working on improving the UI when CCP already has competent personnel who are suited for this task. (Team Pink Zombie Kittens and Team Papercuts are some of the folks who have demonstrated their competence in this area.)

As far as UI features that I would like to see improved go, however, I think the overview could definitely use some work. It would be great if it was designed in a way that gave EVE less of a "Spreadsheets in Space" vibe. I'm not entirely sure how such a thing could be done, however.

Garrvik
#20 - 2012-01-11 17:59:42 UTC
In the recent survey, I responded about how I would love that any resources assigned to improving the looks of EVE spend more time on customizability/skinning instead of force subjective enhancements (e.g. the new font which some love and others despise, or the scaling that doesn't work well).

My personally theory about customizing UIs is that it should only allow someone to change the way information is displayed, but not create new information. Meaning, no macros or addons that allow for special actions or warnings which don't exist in the default UI. As an example, in WoW, you could easily become a slave to your addons and once they broke, you were no longer able to play the game. It also gives unfair advantages to some and in a game like EVE, you just can't have that.

Miss Whippy wrote:

The goal would be:

1. To reduce clickage as much as possible.
2. Make it much easier to navigate through.
3. Make it considerably quicker to navigate through.
4. Make it bug free.
5. Design it in such a way that future expansions can easily be added to the existing UI rather then cobbled on.
6. Allow a sensible degree of customisation.

...

I for one would like to see custom buttons for regular actions. Such as 'Dock Boundless Creation Hek Planet IV,' 'target nearest ship/asteroid', etc.


So, to comment on the quoted bits...
1) I also want reduced clickage/more hotkey, but I'd like this in the core UI, not done through user customizations
2) Amen to that
3) I see this as the same as 2)
4) It'll never happen. Being a professional software engineer, I assure you it's way too costly to make something bug free. We live in a world where people don't make good things, they just make things good enough.
5) Scalability is HUGE. I can't agree with this more.
6) As I mentioned before, I agree, so long as it doesn't allow for adding new information or actions.