Player Features and Ideas Discussion

How dishonest.

It's basically never just one ship, for starters. Secondly, if you can find me a T2 catalyst fit that only costs 2 million isk, then I'd be surprised.

Another thing is that we do have risk, you numbskulls just aren't real players so you don't try and inflict them. Blow up the wreck. Then everything they did is wasted and all they have to show for it is criminal timers.

And even without that, we have to deal with the loot fairy, which is more risk than any PvE activity by itself. Carebears don't have to flip a coin to see if they get any mission rewards. Gankers have that to begin with.

It's absolutely discounted, especially since CCP has nerfed gun mining so much.

The primary rewards for missions are isk and LP, while mining is absolutely consistent.

And your point about exploration does not help your case, since random loot for exploration sites in highsec is one of the things that makes them a wholly unviable income source.

Then why not just go and gank them first?

No need to even gank them all. Just enough to make the total damage less than the total HP of the freighter.

Logic dictates they are going for the bumped ship.

There are so many ways to protect your cargo from gankers to almost make it one sided. Piracy in highsec has been nerfed so hard over the years that it has almost become extinct. Jet can thief's are gone, profitable mining barge ganking is gone, endless nerfs to ganking have resulted in a much less vibrant and exciting highsec. If anything ganking needs to be buffed not nerfed yet more.

Okkkkk.... Logic... Well, Which bumped ship? THey have on in Uedama, One in Madirmilire, and one in Niarja. And maybe the other one you had no idea about because you are spread thin. with the existing potential targets. This is another reason why Gankers get the upper hand as with any attacking force, you get to decide when and which target to attack, everyone else has to scramble to respond.

If they have the resources to bump that many people... more power to them... but don't think they should be able to hold their targets there indefinitely, or with out some additional penalty for the -7 to -10 person once they do gank.

0.11% of movements by RFF fail and their freighter pilots are making 7500 jumps in highsec per day.

Where are you getting the idea that multiple freighters are being held by bumping at the same time? I'm sure it's happened, but I've never seen anything in gank Intel where multiple freighters are being bumped at the same time, so that doesn't seem like a common occurrence.

Have you actually validated that your views are correct and not just an assumption that makes ganking seem worse than it is.

RFF have 60-80 different freighter pilots active every day and 100-150 different pilots active each week. It's not like they only have a couple of guys who are really good. They have large numbers of freighter pilots making frequent jumps in highsec and yet only 1 in 1000 contracts get failed (1 in every 12000 jumps on average).

You are just flat out wrong, a gank fit catalyst these days costs about 8 million ISK, and you need many of them to make a gank work. So either you are ignorant or are being deliberately obtuse to push and agenda....and to be quite honest we all know it is the latter.

Bumping is totally fine as you can avoid it quite simple with even as something as lowly as a noob ship...a single scout can prevent bumping. Webs and other ideas are great, but just a single scout looking through local to spot the bumper is good enough.

Funny how people who always want to "fix bumping" are never in favor of things that might take some work or time such as starting channels in game, maintaining a list of known bumpers. Nope, it always boils down to "CCP please fix as I'm too lazy."

Let my alt haul it all.

There are a lot of safe haulers around, whether highsec, lowsec or nullsec. RFF are just the biggest, have a great reputation and luckily publish lots of annual figures on their activity, which is very safe and consistent with a lot of non-RFF haulers too.

I don't see your first idea doing much as Macheriels have no problem fitting a MJD of their own and could easily follow a freighter. It might raise the skill bar on bumpers a little, but if you had anything of value you would just be suicide-scrammed by a noobship when you start your spool-up leaving nothing to chance.

As for your second idea, I think it is actually a terrible one. If you mean cargo scanning (which I think is what Rita Jita was proposing), preventing pirates from prioritizing their targets removes any incentive to haul responsibly. Flying a freighter with 500M ISK of ore should be safer than one containing 15B ISK of PI materials. If the pirates can't efficiently assess the targets, they would be forced to randomly exploding any target that comes by meaning as a hauler, how much cargo you load has no effect on your chances of successfully making the trip.

As for scanning fits, that would seem to remove a large amount of other intended game play. I mean Passive Targeters were a module specifically added by CCP presumably so the prudent can stealthily scan the fits of their opponents and gain a tactical advantage. I am not sure why freighters are so special that they deserve to be excluded from this part of the game, and I am even less sure the ability to surreptitiously scan a potential opponent's fit should be tossed out to make freighters safer.

If your goal is to increase the costs of ganking, just raise freighter's EHP. If your goal is to create uncertainty for gankers, then vary the CONCORD response times. Simple, and done.

But more generally (and this is not directed to you Scipio), any "fix" to bumping that CCP comes up with is going to still going leave freighters vulnerable. CCP only a few years ago rebalanced freighters and though it not appropriate to give them a MJD or a MWD or enough agility to avoid bumping even though they trivially could. They are not going to wake up tomorrow and rejig everything or release a new module that makes freighters suddenly immune to interdiction in highsec. Any change will specifically allow freighters to be stopped and killed in highsec and the few remaining gankers will keep on dunking them left and right as long as the lazy, careless and clueless keep flying them unsupported and AFK. And the next week, another thread will pop up on this forum claiming that the new mechanic is "not balanced" because someone somewhere was able to lose a capital-class industrial to an organized group of dozens of criminals in highsec.

Such is inevitable in a PvP sandbox game when so many players do not even seem to realize they are playing in a competitive game with other players, some of who are actively looking for ways to take their stuff. They also don't seem to understand this is a video game where of course criminals are going to be allowed to continue to do criminals acts in perpetuity, because the conflict of those crimes is the game. Having "consequences" where if you commit a crime you cannot ever enter highsec again or something equally inane would quickly stop the very game play that CCP is trying to foster with Crimewatch and the other mechanics of highsec. Eve is not a real-life simulation - it is a PvP sandbox game. Just like the fact that criminals cannot ever really kill you or take most of your stuff (which is 100% safe in station), you cannot ever really kill or permanently stop the criminals and this is by design.

This is a game, one part of which is "cops and robbers" in space. Deal with that, or choose another game where such game play is not a feature, but please don't whine to the game developer to remove chunks of the game that that you don't like, especially for reasons as silly as it "lacks realism".

Yes, yes its a competitive and consequence laiden game in which:

- Someone can indefinitely (or until downtime) prevent a freighter from warping using just a bumping ship (doesn't even have to be a mach, ONI or SFI with large MWD will suffice) and a disposable aggro alt in a noob ship (!). No consequences for the bumper whatsoever.

- Having negative sec status has very limited practical consequences for a dedicated ganker char and does not limit the ability to perform ganks in hisec in any way, making sec status loss irrelevant (and consequence free)

- Killrights against ganker chars are practically useless

- Looting stuff from a ganked hauler can be made perfectly safe by using a DST or Orca and a disposable alt

Try arguing for removal/change of any of the above mechanics and you get shouted at for being a risk-averse-carebear-emergent-gameplay-hater. Oh, the irony.